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Buster Brown
11-09-2008, 04:42 AM
Is this a rumor is it true. A friend of mine said the supreme court was asking for Obama's birth certificate. Is this true. What are the implications?

YardleyLabs
11-09-2008, 04:59 AM
Is this a rumor is it true. A friend of mine said the supreme court was asking for Obama's birth certificate. Is this true. What are the implications?

It means nothing unless it's not produced. This is a by-product of Phillip Berg's lawsuit. He had asked for a stay of the election and was turned down. He has now asked the SP to hear the case. Souter requested an official copy of the certificate (according to some Internet sites, I have't seen the request) prior to deciding on Berg's request. If it's produced the case will presumably be dismissed out of hand. The following story appeared in the Honolulu Star Bulletin:

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Hawaii's health director steps in after numerous requests for the document
By Star-Bulletin Staff and News Services

POSTED: 01:30 a.m. HST, Nov 01, 2008
The state health director said yesterday she has personally seen and verified Sen. Barack Obama's original birth certificate in an effort to address numerous requests for the document. Obama, who is running against Sen. John McCain for president, posted on his Web site the birth certificate showing Honolulu as his birthplace.
State law prohibits the release of a birth certificate except to a person seeking his or her own certificate and the person's spouse, parent and legal guardian.
But health officials have been receiving numerous e-mail and phone requests for the document, according to Janice Okubo, Heath Department spokeswoman.
Health Director Chiyome Fukino said she and the vital statistics registrar viewed and verified Obama's birth certificate.
"No state official, including Gov. Linda Lingle, has ever instructed that this vital record be handled in a manner different from any other vital record in the possession of the State of Hawaii," Fukino said.
Critics have questioned whether Obama is a U.S. citizen and have filed lawsuits around the country challenging it. Those suits have been dismissed, including one in Ohio yesterday.
In Hawaii, Andy Martin, an Obama opponent, filed a lawsuit earlier this month seeking a copy of the birth certificate. The Hawaii Supreme Court on Oct. 22 denied his request to see the document.

The state health director said yesterday she has personally seen and verified Sen. Barack Obama's original birth certificate in an effort to address numerous requests for the document.
Obama, who is running against Sen. John McCain for president, posted on his Web site the birth certificate showing Honolulu as his birthplace.
State law prohibits the release of a birth certificate except to a person seeking his or her own certificate and the person's spouse, parent and legal guardian.
But health officials have been receiving numerous e-mail and phone requests for the document, according to Janice Okubo, Heath Department spokeswoman.
Health Director Chiyome Fukino said she and the vital statistics registrar viewed and verified Obama's birth certificate."
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Hew
11-09-2008, 08:26 AM
I have little doubt that Obama has a valid/legit birth certificate. That said, it's interesting to consider what would happen if he didn't...

I don't think there's any way that the Supreme Court would invalidate the election or Obama as a constitutionally acceptable candidate/president-elect at this point in the game. There would be rioting in the streets and the rift left afterward would make Gore v. Bush seem like a pillow fight. Moreover, what would the remedy be? Biden becomes president-elect and chooses a VP candidate? Votes for Obama/Biden are nullified and McCain wins? Another election? And if another election, how are the Dem candidates to be decided? I think the country can survive 4 years of Obama just fine. I can't say the same if the election results are overturned (no matter how constitutionally valid it may be to do so).

Patrick Johndrow
11-09-2008, 09:11 AM
I have little doubt that Obama has a valid/legit birth certificate. That said, it's interesting to consider what would happen if he didn't....




At this point I think we just let it go.

Joe S.
11-09-2008, 01:52 PM
I think the country can survive 4 years of Obama just fine.

Can I quote you on that?;-)

I think you are correct regarding the citizenship issue. Realizing the SCOTUS has other things to do, it would be nice if they ruled on the issue once and for all considering some of the citizenship issues that could arise in the coming years.

Besides, both my children were born overseas and it would be nice to have this settled before they run for President. ;-)

Born In The USA Regards,

Joe S.

K G
11-09-2008, 02:15 PM
I'd like to know for one reason and one reason only: was he eligible to run for the office?

I don't understand why this has been allowed to remain as a point of contention. Produce the birth certificate and move on. WHY is it such a big deal IF he's American-born? IF he's NOT would be the only reason to not produce the document.

kg

YardleyLabs
11-09-2008, 03:29 PM
I'd like to know for one reason and one reason only: was he eligible to run for the office?

I don't understand why this has been allowed to remain as a point of contention. Produce the birth certificate and move on. WHY is it such a big deal IF he's American-born? IF he's NOT would be the only reason to not produce the document.

kg

He did produce the certificate and sent copies to all major media outlets, some of which actually viewed certified copies. Right wing blogs began questioning the validity of the copies that were distributed, claiming they were forgeries, and Phillip Berg initiated litigation claiming that Obama was not a citizen and requesting discovery proceedings requiring Obama to present a variety of documents that would only exist if he were not a citizen.

Persons contacting the State of Hawaii directly to request his certificate were informed that Hawaii, like many States, does not release certificates to anyone except the named person or legal guardian. This is done to prevent identity theft. Any time you request a certified birth certificate you receive a legally valid certificate in the form provided by that State at that time. I have multiple "copies" of my certificate from the State of Tennessee. No two look alike because they were obtained at different times. I have one that is hand-written and signed (pre-dates photo-copiers), one that is an old photocopy from microfilm, and more recent ones that are computer printed on fancy paper. All are valid.

My impression is that this issue has been nothing but noise from the beginning. What is interesting about it is that it is not clear that there is a defined process for validating the credentials of candidates for office. The bottom line of the Berg decision is that (appropriately in my mind) the random citizen does not have standing to demand that a candidate produce credentials when requested. I do not know if the FEC has procedures for handling this. Obviously, procedures governing issuance of social security numbers and passports (both of which Obama has) are designed to verify citizenship but do not, by themselves, tell you if an individual is a citizen by birth or by naturalization which is only relevant for someone seeking the presidency or vice-presidency.

harvey8542
11-09-2008, 05:25 PM
Read thishttp://www.clevelandleader.com/node/6524

YardleyLabs
11-09-2008, 05:54 PM
Read thishttp://www.clevelandleader.com/node/6524

Notice the date. The suit was filed in August. He's lost at every step. The request for a birth certificate came in conjunction with the Supreme Court refusing Berg's request for an injunction on the election or an emergency hearing. In accordance with SCOTUS procedures, Souter will prepare the case for consideration of a Writ of Certiorari (an agreement to hear the case on its merits) which must be signed by either 3 or 4 justices (I forget which). If certiorari is denied -- as will presumably happen -- the case is over with no adiditional channels for appeal. If certiorari is granted, the Court would have to make a scheduling decision. I don't think you'll find anyone outside of Berg and a few extremist websites taking this case seriously.