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View Full Version : Doesn't this scare gun owners or at least raise an eyebrow!



RedHeadedHurricane
12-04-2008, 04:44 PM
The 2008 Legislative session has begun, and the Ammunition Accountability Act is being introduced across the country. Below is a list of states where legislation has already been introduced:

Alabama, Arizona, California, Connecticut, Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Kentucky, Maryland, Mississippi, Missouri , New Jersey , New York , Pennsylvania , Rhode Island , South Carolina , Tennessee , and Washington

Remember how Obama said that he wasn't going to take your guns? Well, it seems that his minions and allies in the anti-gun world have no problem with taking your ammo!

The bill that is being pushed in 18 states (including Illinois and Indiana ) requires all ammunition to be encoded by the manufacture a data base of all ammunition sales. So they will know how much you buy and what calibers. Nobody can sell any ammunition after June 30, 2009 unless the ammunition is coded.

Any privately held uncoded ammunition must be destroyed by July 1, 2011. (Including handloaded ammo.) They will also charge a .05 cent tax on every round so every box of ammo you buy will go up at least $1.25 or more! If they can deprive you of ammo they do not need to take your gun!

Can this be true?

http://ammunitionaccountability.org/Legislation.htm

akbrowndogs
12-04-2008, 11:13 PM
Wow, that is scarry. Thank god Alaska isn't one of those states. yet.

badbullgator
12-05-2008, 08:32 AM
Wow, that is scarry. Thank god Alaska isn't one of those states. yet.


Or Florida either...glad we are a gun friendly state....time to stock up on reloading supplies

Hoosier
12-05-2008, 08:42 AM
Does anyone have a list of who is sponsoring these bills, and what political party they belong to. I agree this would kill reloading.

Pete
12-05-2008, 08:45 AM
Now this is the part I don't get about people including many( more than 1) on this board.

And that is well if it is the law then we must obey it. Because after all its the law of the land and we must all live civilly within the laws our government which is for the people and by the people have set up.

This is not a democrocy but a Republic.
Just because some idiot passes a law doesn't mean we have to bow down to it.
Majority doesn't rule in my house regaurds
Pete

brian breuer
12-05-2008, 10:02 AM
Now this is the part I don't get about people including many( more than 1) on this board.

And that is well if it is the law then we must obey it. Because after all its the law of the land and we must all live civilly within the laws our government which is for the people and by the people have set up.

This is not a democrocy but a Republic.
Just because some idiot passes a law doesn't mean we have to bow down to it.
Majority doesn't rule in my house regaurds
Pete

Could you elaborate on your system? Will it keep you out of of prison?

Totally disagree with this legislation but like to see my kids more than regularly scheduled visits through glass.

Pete
12-05-2008, 12:29 PM
Brian
I refuse to get on my knee's
for any man. The day that happens is the day I go bazerk and they fill me full of holes.
Which is funny because I am contemplating giving up all my firearms and beer and being subject to a house inspection day or night by the authorities (thus causing me to not be able to work at my trade for a period of 2 years or until I can figure other ways ),,,, while I am helping someone get back on their feet who other wise would have it way to ruff..and end up reverting back to their old ways. So I guess there is a situation that would make me give up my rights.
However being forced to will only make me fight harder against it.

Transitional vertibra regaurds
Pete

Eric Johnson
12-05-2008, 02:13 PM
Well...it's hard to be frightened of non-existant legislation. I can't find any such bill as the one they describe in Alabama.

Eric

TroyW
12-05-2008, 02:37 PM
Well...it's hard to be frightened of non-existant legislation. I can't find any such bill as the one they describe in Alabama.

Eric


In Alabama it is Senate bill 541. It's real.
TroyW

D Beard
12-05-2008, 03:19 PM
it was withdrawn in Kentucky

Illinois Bob
12-05-2008, 03:22 PM
Illinois Ammo Ban Bill
AMMUNITION BAN BILLS ON THE MOVE IN ILLINOIS GENERAL ASSEMBLY

A pair of ammunition ban bills are up for hearing in the House Executive Committee this week. If enacted, either of these bills would effectively ban the purchase of ammunition in Illinois. The bills in question are HB 4269 sponsored by Rep. Monique Davis (D-Chicago), and HB 4349 sponsored by Rep. Naomi Jakobsson (D-Champaign).

Here is what passage of either of these bills would mean to you:
1. Ammunition manufacturers would be required to imprint a secret code on cartridge casings so that the purchaser of the ammunition could be identified.

2. When you purchase ammunition, that secret code would be registered to your name.

3. All your ammunition purchases would be registered with the Illinois State Police.

4. You would be responsible for all eternity for ammunition registered to you.

5. It would be in your best interest to destroy all expended ammunition casings because an unaccounted for empty casing could be used to frame you for a crime you did not commit.

6. You would have to surrender all unregistered ammunition you now own to the Illinois State Police.

7. Reloading would be banned.

8. The Illinois Department of Revenue would be authorized to place a tax on ammunition and raise that tax any time for any reason.

9. Taxes and increased manufacturing costs would raise the price of a box of .45 ammo to $200 or more.

10. Gun ownership would become too costly for most people.


WHAT YOU MUST DO TO HELP SAVE YOUR GUN RIGHTS:

1. Call Rep. Monique Davisí office at (217) 782-0010 and POLITELY tell the person that answers that you are a law-abiding gun owner and you would oppose Rep. Davisí attempt to ban ammunition.

2. Call Rep. Naomi Jakobssonís offce at (217) 558-1009 and POLITELY tell the person that answers that you are a law-abiding gun owner and you would oppose Rep. Jakobssonís attempt to ban ammunition.

3. Call each of the following members of the House Executive Committee and POLITELY tell whoever answers the phone that you OPPOSE HB4269 and HB4349 and that you would like them to vote against those bills in the Executive Committee. Remember, you represent the gun owners of this state, so BE POLITE:

Rep. Dan Burke (D-Chicago) (217) 782-1117
Rep Joseph Lyons (D-Chicago) (217) 782-8400
Rep. Dan Brady (R-Bloomington) (217) 782-1118
Rep. Eddie Acevedo (D-Chicago) (217) 782-2855
Rep. Maria Antonia Berrios (D-Chicago) (217) 558-1032
Rep. Bob Biggins (R-Elmhurst) (217) 782-6578
Rep Michael Bradley (D-Chicago) (217) 782-8117
Rep. Brent Hassert (R-Romeoville) (217) 782-4179
Rep. Jim Meyer (R-Naperville) (217) 782-8028
Rep. Robert Molaro (D-Chicago) (217) 782-5280
Rep. Bob Rita (D-Crestwood) (217) 558-1000
Rep. Angelo Saviano (R-River Grove) (217) 782-3374
Rep. Arthur Turner (D-Chicago) (217) 782-8116

4. Please pass this alert along to all your gun-owning friends and ask them to make calls as well.

5. Please post this alert to any and all Internet bulletin boards to which you may belong.

Hoosier
12-05-2008, 03:24 PM
Thanks Julie. I think that about sums it up. I just hope we don't all get ran over by one of those Change Mobiles you so kindly posted pictures of. I live in the Peoples Republic of Minnesota though. That first photo looks a lot like our very own rep.Ellison. We had the honor of electing the very first Muslim to congress a couple of years back. Hope we can contribute more to this great country in the future. If we could get a full-fledged Al Qaeda member to run for office I'm sure we would elect him. If he was a democrat and promised mo munny tu da po foke of course.

Eric Johnson
12-05-2008, 10:37 PM
I've checked in ALISON (Alabama Legislative Information System Online).

1. The new session hasn't started yet. Some bills are pre-filed but relatively few.

2. There's no record of a SB541.

Ooops. I was checking the 2009 calendar. Then I checked the 2008 calendar and found...

Instrument Sponsor Subject In Status Comm Assigned Comm Recomm Last
Action
Date
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Smitherman Firearms S Indefinitely suspended Judiciary 4/18/08
in House of origin

Firearms and ammunition, coding required, disposal of non-coded ammunition, Public Safety Department to establish database, fee, Code Ammunition Fund, established, recording of handgun ammunition transactions, civil and criminal penalties

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

IOW, it's a dead issue as for now. The 2008 session is over and any bills not passed are dead.

Hoosier
12-05-2008, 11:45 PM
Think I'd put the card back in my pocket.

Legacy 6
12-06-2008, 09:58 AM
Hey Hoosier, I'm a Minnesotan in the Army here in KS... I am about 3 months away from coming back to MN, and I'm not sure I want to... Al Franken!?!? Seriously? I have heard reports that he's behind in the count, but there are 4,000 contested ballots that were dismissed and both Franken and Harry Reid are using the term "disenfranchised?"

Also, if the state can't decide, and it goes up to the Supreme Court... well, I hope not either way. I think by the time that happens, law says the Congress will decide which candidate will win... and with MN having a super liberal state congress, and the US Senate is SO close to haveing a super democratic majority... I just don't want to think about politics when I make a decision to move back to MN and my family.

Give me some hope!! At least Michelle Bachman got re-elected, right? Is there any light at the end of the tunnel?

I have Hope and want Change... but I didn't vote that guy in office regards

Hoosier
12-06-2008, 10:15 AM
I don't know how much hope I can offer. They keep "finding" ballots - in cubicles, in cars and probably under Franken's mattress. Now they are searching for some missing ballots that may or may not exist and the court has given them an indefinite period of time to find them.
On the bright side- We do have Governor Pawlenty that stands up to the tax mongers.
Michelle Bachman was re-elected but she stepped on some toes with her straight-talk and has been smacked down a little. I hope she gets back up.
Being a welfare magnet state our population keeps increasing with your unsavory types that tend to vote democrat. An ever expanding hmong and somali population - before long we will have pirates on the Mississippi. Any public hunting land near the Twin Cities has been over-run by hmong and you can't even find a song bird. It's eerie to walk through a woods and not even see a song bird. Then get back to the parking lot and find a fire pit and a bunch of song bird feathers. And that is no BS!

Legacy 6
12-06-2008, 06:15 PM
I know EXACTLY what you mean!!! I lived near Lake Rebecca Park when I was in HS and they spent SO much money trying to re-stock the lake with fish because the Hmong would fish there like it's a grocery store... They kept EVERYTHING they caught.

I was a CC runner then and we'd see them all over the place fishing, and would walk out with BUCKETS of little tiny fish, turtles, and I even saw a dog fish a time or two...

I don't believe they aren't bad people, but JEEZ I don't believe in depleating natural resources either. The DNR just didn't have the manpower to do much about it.

Well crap. At least in two years I'll be able to vote without an absentee ballot. Maybe that'll help... right?

Illinois Bob
12-06-2008, 06:49 PM
Actually Patrick, I think I've been quite tame. But, I am concerned that there are a few people on this board who fear Obama because he is black and knows some Muslims. So, if the hood fits. . .


I don't fear him because he's black or muslim.I fear him because he is going to keep trying to melt down our guns.


**** Alert *** Alert *** Alert ****
Dear Fellow NRA Member,
In the next few days, you'll receive your new NRA membership card.
The moment you receive it, I urge you to validate your new membership card as soon as possible. More than ever, we need you to stand with NRA and fight to save our Second Amendment freedoms.

Because Barack Obama's campaign promise
not to take away our guns is a lie.
He's not even in office, yet he's fired the opening salvos in a war against the future of the Second Amendment, our hunting and shooting traditions, and YOU.
Obama's FIRST attack on YOU: Appointing Illinois Congressman Rahm Emanuel to be White House Chief of Staff. In Congress, Emanuel earned an "F" rating from NRA, and while working in the Clinton Administration, he was known as the "point man on gun control." He is an avowed enemy of the Second Amendment and will wield enormous power in the battle for the future of our firearm freedoms.
Obama's SECOND attack on YOU: If Hillary Clinton is confirmed as Secretary of State, she'll rip the Second Amendment right out of the Bill of Rights. She'll be our nation's top diplomat with the power to determine whether the United Nations will pass, and Obama will sign, a global gun ban treaty that will surrender our Second Amendment rights and our national sovereignty.
Obama's THIRD attack on YOU: Nominating ex-Senator and former Majority Leader Tom Daschle-an avowed enemy of NRA-to be Secretary of Health and Human Services. NRA was responsible for defeating Daschle when he ran in South Dakota for re-election to the Senate. If Daschle is confirmed, he could hold the ultimate power to declare guns a "public health menace" and regulate away our essential liberties.
Obama's FOURTH attack on YOU: Nominating Eric Holder to be Attorney General. As former Assistant Attorney General, Holder was a key architect and vocal advocate for the Clinton era's sweeping gun ban agenda. He supported national handgun licensing, mandatory trigger locks, and ending gun shows as we know them.
Just recently, Holder opposed the District of Columbia's Heller decision that declared the Second Amendment an individual right. Holder also called for reviving the Clinton gun bans and, as Attorney General, would fight in court to prevent the landmark Heller decision from being made applicable to state and local governments.
Worst of all, if Holder is confirmed as the nation's top law-enforcement officer, he would control BATFE and wield enormous power to harass gun owners and sue America's arms makers out of existence.
Obama's FIFTH attack on YOU: In the job application for the Obama Administration, he made it clear that gun owners are second-class citizens and told 80 million gun owners not to even bother applying for a job. In the "White House Personnel Data Questionnaire" he asked:
"Do you or any members of your immediate family own a gun? If so, provide
complete ownership and registration information. Has the registration ever
lapsed? Please also describe how and by whom it is used and whether it has
been the cause of any personal injuries or property damage."
This chilling notice to gun owners-that they are not welcome to serve in his Administration-shows the deep hostility for Americans' Second Amendment Freedoms that Obama and his Administration have in their hearts.
On its face, that question endorses gun registration-a mandate in only five states in our nation-and buys into the anti-gun premise that firearms are inherently dangerous and gun owners are prone to misusing them.
That's an outrageous mindset, especially for the President-elect whose sworn duty will be to uphold the U.S. Constitution, including our right to keep and bear arms.
Obama CLEARLY wants to make gun registration the law of the land.
First for employees under his control...AND THEN FOR YOU.
Working with a Congress dominated by gun haters like Nancy Pelosi, Dianne Feinstein, John Conyers, Henry Waxman, and Charles Schumer!!!
Rubbing salt in gun owner wounds is the Brady Campaign, which just issued a completely bogus poll claiming that two-thirds of the Americans-including 60% of all gun owners-favor gun registration, licensing of firearm owners, and other sweeping restrictions on our firearm freedoms!

Add it all up and you have the potential
for a Second Amendment disaster that's unlike
any other NRA members have ever battled.
That's why we need the strongest possible commitment from EVERY NRA member, starting today. That's why I'm hoping you'll validate your new NRA membership card the moment you receive it.
Because our greatest strength is you.
Only by working with you can NRA hold the line against these threats from every quarter. We are the one force that has the strength to keep Americans free and our rights intact for future generations. With you at our side, we will fight and we will prevail against all odds.
Thank you for your loyalty to NRA and the cause of Freedom.

http://www.nrahq.org/umgraphics/wayne/PostElection-Alert-EmailBanner.jpg

Forward this E-Mail to Friends
and Urge Them to Join NRA Today!

zeus3925
01-06-2009, 08:32 AM
The NRA and the Sierra Club have the same M.O. They create a big overblown fear. They demonize politicians they don't like. Once they get the suckers riled, they stick out their hands for a donation.

duckheads
01-06-2009, 09:57 AM
there was a bill like this in IN in 2008 and it died in committee. i can not find anyting on the 2009 schedule, yet.

are you a gun owner zuess? if so what to you do to make sure you can continue to own and use those guns? do you do anything or do you just keep telling your self that nothing will happen?

sticking your head in the sand regards,

zeus3925
01-06-2009, 10:35 AM
You bet I own guns. I just don't agree with the shrill approaches of the two organizations I have mentioned. They both create as much harm to the image of their adherents as they do good.

Scott Greenwood
01-06-2009, 11:07 AM
Zeus,
I am with you on that account. Same thing happened with Clinton. Alot of fear for a bunch of fluff. I work for a company that is well known for their outdoor heritage. You should see the guns running out the door. Everyone that comes in says they need them before Obama takes them. The company just sits back and smiles because they know as long as this retoric keeps going they will continue to make money had over fist. The guys that were around during the Clinton years thank him for the bills that were passed because it made their jobs easier. Nothing like keeping guns out of peoples hands that shouldn't have them! Now don't forget to burn me on the internet instead to my face.

John Kelder
01-06-2009, 11:20 AM
The attacks on the Second Amendment during the Clinton years were very real . And if don't like the NRA's approach to getting things accomplished , do you agree with the NRA's goals ?
If so , please volunteer to spread the NRA message in a manner you are agreeable with .
United we stand , divided we lose the Second Amendment .

zeus3925
01-06-2009, 11:28 AM
I have served in a leadership role on several successful public issue campaigns. None of them had high initial public support. I have also done some non-paid lobbying as well.

We prevailed in all our pursuits by having good data and by cultivating good public relations. We endeavored to maintain respectful relations with the opposition whenever that was possible. You can learn a lot from your opponent if you remain civil. We avoided partisan alignments.

We worked to keep our rhetoric cool and reasoned, even when if the opposition got wild.

Politics is a game that trades on image. If you appear to be the calm, reasoned and the informed one, then you are more likely to prevail-- especially when the opposition is incendiary, and emotional.

dixidawg
01-06-2009, 11:41 AM
I have served in a leadership role on several successful public issue campaigns. None of them had high initial public support. I have also done some non-paid lobbying as well.

We prevailed in all our pursuits by having good data and by cultivating good public relations. We endeavored to maintain respectful relations with the opposition whenever that was possible. You can learn a lot from your opponent if you remain civil. We avoided partisan alignments.

We worked to keep our rhetoric cool and reasoned, even when if the opposition got wild.

Politics is a game that trades on image. If you appear to be the calm, reasoned and the informed one, then you are more likely to prevail-- especially when the opposition is incendiary, and emotional.


Zeus,

What state are you in? I would venture a guess that it is not one that has some draconian laws. As someone form Massachuestts, I can tell you that the threat you your gun rights from the government is VERY real. Pretending that is not true doesn't make it so.

zeus3925
01-06-2009, 11:54 AM
I live in MN. We have our share of politicians who are sources of rectal discomfort. There was some press about lead shards in venison around deer season. Wouldn't you know we now have a state rep that has proposed banning all lead ammo. Never mind if the problem could be cured by a little bit of hunter education before they butcher their deer.

Illinois Bob
01-06-2009, 12:18 PM
We prevailed in all our pursuits by having good data and by cultivating good public relations. We endeavored to maintain respectful relations with the opposition whenever that was possible. You can learn a lot from your opponent if you remain civil. We avoided partisan alignments.

We worked to keep our rhetoric cool and reasoned

Is that why you called NRA supporters "suckers"? Zeus,it's OK if you have a different opinion,even a wrong one,but you really should practice what you preach.

dixidawg
01-06-2009, 12:33 PM
I live in MN. We have our share of politicians who are sources of rectal discomfort. There was some press about lead shards in venison around deer season. Wouldn't you know we now have a state rep that has proposed banning all lead ammo. Never mind if the problem could be cured by a little bit of hunter education before they butcher their deer.


I suggest that your tune may change once you live with the laws that folks in other states live with.

How about getting a "license" to possess any gun?
That license is at the discretion of the Chief of Police?
And once approved, you can only purchase guns that the state "approves"?

I could go on, but until you have actually experienced "common sense gun control" don't preach:

"They create a big overblown fear."

The fear is very real whether you choose to believe it or not.

zeus3925
01-06-2009, 12:53 PM
Again I was speaking about similar approaches by two very high powered groups that are beyond the beyonds. I think a list of donors in any organization that can be regularly counted on for an appeal for cash is commonly referred to as a "sucker list".

Donate to a political campaign, soon everyone down to a dogcatcher candidate will be calling about the bogey man on the other side and then they ask for the cash. That's what it's like on the "sucker list"

zeus3925
01-06-2009, 01:27 PM
I suggest that your tune may change once you live with the laws that folks in other states live with.

How about getting a "license" to possess any gun?
That license is at the discretion of the Chief of Police?
And once approved, you can only purchase guns that the state "approves"?

I could go on, but until you have actually experienced "common sense gun control" don't preach:

"They create a big overblown fear."

The fear is very real whether you choose to believe it or not.

I grew up in a hunting family. I am not in support of preventing any sane person from having a firearm.

All I'm saying (which some of you read that I am pro-control) is that the NRA approach gives rise to more resistance. I see a lot of pro-control reaction out there that is based on fear. There is nothing that in the way the NRA approach that allays that fear. Coupled with a dwindling hunter base unfamiliar with firearms, this is going to continue to bite us.

I know our fears--the loss of our guns, our ability to hunt, loss of protection. But how well do you understand the opposition? What drives their fear and how do you mitigate it?

Vicky Trainor
01-06-2009, 09:08 PM
The racists remarks and inappropriate pictures have been removed from this thread.