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View Full Version : Self Interest, or Selfish Socialism



Buzz
08-13-2009, 11:52 AM
I think this guy hit the nail on the head.

http://www.samefacts.com/archives/health_care_/2009/08/the_passions_and_the_interests.php


I think it has to do with the dynamics of self-interest and self-deception. Some of the most virulent opponents of health reform are the elderly, who already have government-provided health insurance. While some may be too silly to know that that's what they have, a great many assuredly do know it, and are happy to pull up the ladder behind them. Medicare is already very successful and very generous. Under universal coverage, it's unlikely to get much better (except for prescription drug coverage, but not all the elderly take a huge number of pills). And it could, for all one knows, get worse. To avoid that risk, better that some youngsters go without.

This reasoning, though, is brutal--too brutal to acknowledge. While we're a pretty selfish country, "I'm all right, Jack" is not an argument people comfortably make when others' lives are at stake. But "if this passes, they'll euthanize me and my friends" is another kind of argument altogether. It's false, but easy to seize on as a morally comfortable pretext for opposing a bill that threatens one's self-interest.

K G
08-13-2009, 12:00 PM
And then there's this....

http://www.campaignmoney.com/political/contributions/andrew-sabl.asp?cycle=08

Makes sense to me...:cool:

kg

Buzz
08-13-2009, 01:21 PM
So I guess if you've ever given any money to a conservative, I should completely discount your opinion on any issue too.

K G
08-13-2009, 01:51 PM
I've never given money to ANY of them, conservative OR liberal.

Now what? :p

kg

road kill
08-13-2009, 02:07 PM
I think this guy hit the nail on the head.

http://www.samefacts.com/archives/health_care_/2009/08/the_passions_and_the_interests.php

And where would "if it doesn't pass we'll have a catastrophe" fit in??


"...elderly, who already have government-provided health insurance. While some may be too silly to know that that's what they have..."

The elderly are "silly?"
They built this country you so fervently want to tear apart!!
You will be old someday (hopefully) and will not like being referred to in such a disrespectful manor!


just sayin'

TXduckdog
08-13-2009, 02:44 PM
I think this guy hit the nail on the head.

http://www.samefacts.com/archives/health_care_/2009/08/the_passions_and_the_interests.php


What folks are rejecting is government intrusion and government control.

Sure Medicare is a government prgram and for the most part folks are pretty happy with it. Sure it needs some tweaking, what health care aspect doesn't.

But 'tweaking' is one thing....wholesale government takeover is a whole nuther ballgame.

We still don't hardly know what was in the stimulus bill and it's barely been spent.....people are not willing to be run over like that again for their health care coverage.

They have every right to stand up and demand HONEST ANSWERS from this lying, obfuscating, "how we going to fool them today", democratic administration.

Who, BTW, ran on being transparent and putting up bills on the internet so everybody could read through them before congressional action.
THIS HAS NOT HAPPENED ONE GODDAM TIME!!!!

Buzz
08-13-2009, 03:20 PM
Who, BTW, ran on being transparent and putting up bills on the internet so everybody could read through them before congressional action.
THIS HAS NOT HAPPENED ONE GODDAM TIME!!!!


On this aspect of the argument I'm with you. He said that negotiations on healthcare would be televised on C-Span. Now we are learning about deals cut behind the scenes. In the next 10 years, something like 3.6 trillion will be sent on drugs. We're hearing about $800 billion in savings over 10 years from Pharma. Well, Canada negotiates a 50% savings over what we pay here. The VA negotiates a 40% savings. That $800 billion is 2%. What a terrific deal they negotiated. Now Pharma plans to spend around $150 million to run ads backing the healthcare reform.

badbullgator
08-13-2009, 03:30 PM
On this aspect of the argument I'm with you. He said that negotiations on healthcare would be televised on C-Span. Now we are learning about deals cut behind the scenes. In the next 10 years, something like 3.6 trillion will be sent on drugs. We're hearing about $800 billion in savings over 10 years from Pharma. Well, Canada negotiates a 50% savings over what we pay here. The VA negotiates a 40% savings. That $800 billion is 2%. What a terrific deal they negotiated. Now Pharma plans to spend around $150 million to run ads backing the healthcare reform.

Yes ONLY if bonogo hold up his end of the deal he made with them. Isn;t that like buying support? Something seems wrong with that too me