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View Full Version : WIC, This has me fuming!



luvmylabs23139
10-03-2009, 07:11 PM
So, at some point WIC added a veggie entitlement. I'm walking thru the frozen food aisle and notice that Food Lion has signs on certain items, frozen veggies, that say WIC approved. OK, but this gets me furious. I buy 2 lb bag of store brand frozen green beans on sale for $1.88. A person with a WIC check can buy Birds Eye Steam fresh veggies, $ 2.69 for 12 ounces. WIC checks are for an item not a dollar amount.
So I pay .058 per ounce yet someone who sits around on their ass and lives off of my money that is stolen from me by the gov't can buy the veggies that cost .224 per ounce. What's wrong with this picture???:rolleyes:

subroc
10-03-2009, 08:39 PM
You are exposing one of the flaws in welfare, there is no requirement for anyone to be frugal or anyone to be accountable and assure that our government larges is well spent. In another post I believe it was Roger Perry highlighted that part of the savings on healthcare would come from education to prevent smoking, obesity, and the tools they/people need to live healthier lives. Much like this, it would be impossible to demand anyone do anything on that front.

Bob Gutermuth
10-03-2009, 09:29 PM
The indolent are taking over America.

dnf777
10-03-2009, 11:00 PM
My wife and first child were two of those people sitting around on their asses living off your money. Due to educational loans and 30,000 per year tuition for medical school, we were scraping to get by. Don't worry, since finishing school, training, and army service, I have more than repaid our WIC allowances...many, many times over. I'm glad it was there for us when we needed it, and I'm glad that some of my tax dollars may be helping somone who just may be my doctor someday.

subroc
10-04-2009, 06:25 AM
My wife and first child were two of those people sitting around on their asses living off your money. Due to educational loans and 30,000 per year tuition for medical school, we were scraping to get by. Don't worry, since finishing school, training, and army service, I have more than repaid our WIC allowances...many, many times over. I'm glad it was there for us when we needed it, and I'm glad that some of my tax dollars may be helping somone who just may be my doctor someday.

This had nothing to do with any of the posts here. Even the OP didn't have a problem with WIC as a needed, at least at some level, program (at least there wasn't a condemning of it here). The point isn't that you needed WIC. It isn't whether you need welfare. The problem as the OP sees it, and I agree, is there isn't a requirement for any to spend the government largess wisely. That was the OPs point. That was mine as well.

Now, there are many things that can be determined to be wastfull as it relates to social programs, but that isn't the particual issue we were discusing here.

zeus3925
10-04-2009, 09:09 AM
This had nothing to do with any of the posts here. Even the OP didn't have a problem with WIC as a needed, at least at some level, program (at least there wasn't a condemning of it here). The point isn't that you needed WIC. It isn't whether you need welfare. The problem as the OP sees it, and I agree, is there isn't a requirement for any to spend the government largess wisely. That was the OPs point. That was mine as well.

Now, there are many things that can be determined to be wastfull as it relates to social programs, but that isn't the particual issue we were discusing here.

Most county extension agencies have staffers that go out and assist families to more efficiently use their resources.

subroc
10-04-2009, 10:23 AM
requirement

Gun_Dog2002
10-04-2009, 11:30 AM
My wife and first child were two of those people sitting around on their asses living off your money. Due to educational loans and 30,000 per year tuition for medical school, we were scraping to get by. Don't worry, since finishing school, training, and army service, I have more than repaid our WIC allowances...many, many times over. I'm glad it was there for us when we needed it, and I'm glad that some of my tax dollars may be helping somone who just may be my doctor someday.

So let me get this straight Dr. I paid your ass through school so you could become a Dr. and make more money than you know what to do with?

Might want to say thank you to the working stiffs that paid to help you....

/Paul

YardleyLabs
10-04-2009, 11:34 AM
My wife and first child were two of those people sitting around on their asses living off your money. Due to educational loans and 30,000 per year tuition for medical school, we were scraping to get by. Don't worry, since finishing school, training, and army service, I have more than repaid our WIC allowances...many, many times over. I'm glad it was there for us when we needed it, and I'm glad that some of my tax dollars may be helping somone who just may be my doctor someday.


So let me get this straight Dr. I paid your ass through school so you could become a Dr. and make more money than you know what to do with?

Might want to say thank you to the working stiffs that paid to help you....

/Paul
It sounded to me like he did say thank you and that he has since repaid his debt.

zeus3925
10-04-2009, 12:59 PM
requirement

I thought Libertarians didn't like requirements.

Juli H
10-04-2009, 01:08 PM
The wic checks in alaska generally have a limit of 200.00...most of the time the only purchases that come close to this amount are for baby formula...It is, at least, a step above the abuse of F/S..but not by much...

Juli

subroc
10-04-2009, 01:11 PM
I thought Libertarians didn't like requirements.


First of all, I am not a libertarian.
We are talking about conditions on government largess here.
And, I did highlight early on that it wouldn’t be possible and was actually a problem.

luvmylabs23139
10-04-2009, 02:08 PM
My point was that since a WIC check is, or at least was, back when I was working in a grocery store while going to school, for a certain quantity of a comodity, the holder of the check could spend whatever $ amount for said comodity, while I as the taxpayer am trying to maximize my grocery $$$$.
The fact that Tax $$$ are wasted for the convenience of throwing the bag from the freezer into the microwave vs opening the bag, dumping veggies in the pot adding some water and turning on the burner is insane.
Either tax $$ could be saved or for the liberals more people could be helped if the gov't used a bit of common sense.

zeus3925
10-04-2009, 02:15 PM
My point was that since a WIC check is, or at least was, back when I was working in a grocery store while going to school, for a certain quantity of a comodity, the holder of the check could spend whatever $ amount for said comodity, while I as the taxpayer am trying to maximize my grocery $$$$.
The fact that Tax $$$ are wasted for the convenience of throwing the bag from the freezer into the microwave vs opening the bag, dumping veggies in the pot adding some water and turning on the burner is insane.
Either tax $$ could be saved or for the liberals more people could be helped if the gov't used a bit of common sense.

Thus is the power of modern advertising. The word "convenience" has seized our land! :grab:

luvmylabs23139
10-04-2009, 02:48 PM
Thus is the power of modern advertising. The word "convenience" has seized our land! :grab:
It's totally nuts!!!!

Bob Gutermuth
10-04-2009, 02:59 PM
I went to the local ice house to get some for the cooler. It is part of a seafood store. I saw red when the crowd was buying soft crabs and jumbo shrimp with their "Independence Card" the Md version of a ripoff called Foodstamps. I worked all my life and both softcrabs and jumbo shrimp are too expensive for me. I let in my 12 yr old dog van while many of these same folks getting seafood on the taxpayers dime drove new SUVs and luxury cars.

luvmylabs23139
10-04-2009, 03:13 PM
I spent 4 years of my life working for the state of CT as an accountant (CPA), my job was to find waste and abuse in entitlement programs. I found it everyday, nothing was done, reports ignored or buried. I was young and stupid. I really thought it was a good job. Four years later I wised up, got out and told them all off.

dnf777
10-04-2009, 03:31 PM
So let me get this straight Dr. I paid your ass through school so you could become a Dr. and make more money than you know what to do with?

Might want to say thank you to the working stiffs that paid to help you....

/Paul

I won't dignify that personal attack with an equally vicious reply, other than to say if you ever need my services at three in the morning, my ass will be there to help you. Whether you appreciate it or not.

luvmylabs23139
10-04-2009, 03:51 PM
My wife and first child were two of those people sitting around on their asses living off your money. Due to educational loans and 30,000 per year tuition for medical school, we were scraping to get by. Don't worry, since finishing school, training, and army service, I have more than repaid our WIC allowances...many, many times over. I'm glad it was there for us when we needed it, and I'm glad that some of my tax dollars may be helping somone who just may be my doctor someday.

So let me get this straight. At this same time I was working full time,and going to college at night. My now husband was doing the same thing. We scraped by, borrowed no money, paid income taxes, and we're suposed to feel bad?
We didn't have kids at that time that we couldn't afford!!!:rolleyes:

zeus3925
10-04-2009, 04:10 PM
You might want to go to the source to see what is or isn't covered.

http://www.fns.usda.gov/wic/aboutwic/

dnf777
10-04-2009, 04:29 PM
So let me get this straight. At this same time I was working full time,and going to college at night. My now husband was doing the same thing. We scraped by, borrowed no money, paid income taxes, and we're suposed to feel bad?
We didn't have kids at that time that we couldn't afford!!!:rolleyes:

Who the hell said you should feel bad?? You have some real problem, and I suggest you seek help for it. I was responding to someone who portrayed WIC recipients as "someone who sits around on their ass and lives off of my money that is stolen from me by the gov't" , and in no way was whining or complaining about my plight. I faced it head on, and "scraped by" to make something of myself. Sorry if using WIC for a couple of years while in school, prior to serving 14 years (active/reserve) in the army taking care of the best patients in the world doesn't match your ideal of a good little American. Somehow, I doubt any of us could. I have better things to do than waste time responding to such vile attacks that have no place on this forum. Say what you want, you have the last word....make it a real good one.

BTW, if you were "scraping by" and didn't take advantage of loans, grants, or scholarships, you're at least half a bubble off plumb! Those "liberal programs" are there to help citizens make something better of themselves, with the understanding that by doing so, will repay society many times over.

Go ahead, attack away...I really deserve it now. I need a chuckle anyway, before Monday! :D:D:D

Terry Britton
10-04-2009, 04:38 PM
Thus is the power of modern advertising. The word "convenience" has seized our land! :grab:

Sometimes the value addded convenience is worth the few extra pennies for the time saved when my wife wakes up after a day of sleeping after a full night of work in the pediatric hospital just in time for the kids to come home from school and do their homework. Then there is barely anytime to cook befor I get home in time for a family meal before she heads back to work at the hospital.

"Convienience" is a value added to a product that is sometimes worth the cost, and other times a waste of resources depending on your needs.

Bob Gutermuth
10-04-2009, 04:48 PM
If you can't feed em don't breed em.

luvmylabs23139
10-04-2009, 05:52 PM
Sometimes the value addded convenience is worth the few extra pennies for the time saved when my wife wakes up after a day of sleeping after a full night of work in the pediatric hospital just in time for the kids to come home from school and do their homework. Then there is barely anytime to cook befor I get home in time for a family meal before she heads back to work at the hospital.

"Convienience" is a value added to a product that is sometimes worth the cost, and other times a waste of resources depending on your needs.

There is a huge difference between using your own hard earned money to pay for convenience and using taxpayer $$.
I do at times pay for convenience, however it's money hubby and I earned. Mostly I try to save money on food so we have more money to spend on "the dogs".

luvmylabs23139
10-04-2009, 06:03 PM
Who the hell said you should feel bad?? You have some real problem, and I suggest you seek help for it. I was responding to someone who portrayed WIC recipients as "someone who sits around on their ass and lives off of my money that is stolen from me by the gov't" , and in no way was whining or complaining about my plight. I faced it head on, and "scraped by" to make something of myself. Sorry if using WIC for a couple of years while in school, prior to serving 14 years (active/reserve) in the army taking care of the best patients in the world doesn't match your ideal of a good little American. Somehow, I doubt any of us could. I have better things to do than waste time responding to such vile attacks that have no place on this forum. Say what you want, you have the last word....make it a real good one.

BTW, if you were "scraping by" and didn't take advantage of loans, grants, or scholarships, you're at least half a bubble off plumb! Those "liberal programs" are there to help citizens make something better of themselves, with the understanding that by doing so, will repay society many times over.

Go ahead, attack away...I really deserve it now. I need a chuckle anyway, before Monday! :D:D:D

The only problem I have is when I look at gross income on the paycheck and then see the net income after the gov't theft. YTD it equals a nice brand new car in the driveway. Not owing the gov't for anything or having taken advantage of other peoples money is a great feeling. It's nice to know that all we have it 100% a result of our own hard work.

luvmylabs23139
10-04-2009, 06:31 PM
If you can't feed em don't breed em.
Ain't that the truth!

luvmylabs23139
10-04-2009, 06:34 PM
You might want to go to the source to see what is or isn't covered.

http://www.fns.usda.gov/wic/aboutwic/

In NC those convience veggies are covered!

YardleyLabs
10-04-2009, 06:36 PM
The only problem I have is when I look at gross income on the paycheck and then see the net income after the gov't theft. YTD it equals a nice brand new car in the driveway. Not owing the gov't for anything or having taken advantage of other peoples money is a great feeling. It's nice to know that all we have it 100% a result of our own hard work.
Glad to hear that you stayed off of the roads, didn't use any parks or other public lands, avoided any use of publicly subsidized educational facilities, etc. We need more taxpayers like you!

luvmylabs23139
10-04-2009, 06:48 PM
Glad to hear that you stayed off of the roads, didn't use any parks or other public lands, avoided any use of publicly subsidized educational facilities, etc. We need more taxpayers like you!
Hey my old local state park bans dogs in the summer, so what good is that to me? They just get yelled at in the media these days for all of the out of the area fools mostly from another state that don't follow the rules and drown.
Beautiful place that has been destroyed, ugly fences put up to keep fools out of posted no swimming areas, #of people allowed in severely limited again to to the fools breaking the rules and drowning etc. If you are a local and want to go on a weekend day in the summer you better be there by 8 am so you can get in before it fills up to the new # of people that is really low based on the size of the park. All the fools from NYC will be there not the residents of NF.

cpj
10-04-2009, 08:47 PM
I stood directly behind a lady paying for groceries with a food stamp credit card. She completed the transaction and then pulled out a hundred dollar bill to pay for her 12 pack.

luvmylabs23139
10-04-2009, 09:00 PM
I stood directly behind a lady paying for groceries with a food stamp credit card. She completed the transaction and then pulled out a hundred dollar bill to pay for her 12 pack.
How many of us run around with $100 bills on us? I certainly don't. I carry some cash, but have my debit card on me. It's harder for a thief to use my debit card without the code than cash. I'll bet that $100 bill is from illegal activity. Before anyone jumps on me, when I go to the ATM it spits out $20's not $100's.

KEITH L
10-04-2009, 11:00 PM
as an owner of a grocery store i see tons of waste from both wic and food stamps now
called {snaps} don't know why. i do profit from the use of these i don't agree with the process used. both wic and foodstamps are not an intitlement but a supplement for someone who has fallen on hard times. what gets me is when a reciepent uses either they purchase the highest cost items for example milk. i have 3 brands and they choose the most expensive on the shelf when using either they should be controled somehow to purchase the most value for the dollar. what wic is now handing out is a voucher also for produce and some frozen products veggies juice fruit no sugar added product. i do see several times after the use of either of the programs they will buy carton sometimes 2 of cigarettes shame on us . i do belive if anyone recieving gov. money should pass a drug test to qualify
for the program. always remember it's not an intitlement. some young mothers i belive should maybe nursing there children rather than instantly going on formulas also.


keith l.
________
SPORTIVO COUPE (http://www.toyota-wiki.com/wiki/Toyota_Sportivo_Coupe)

zeus3925
10-04-2009, 11:01 PM
Well what are all you going to do about it. There is much griping but no action here. Have you written your legislatures? How about you congressman or governor? Organize a citizen's group? I bet not. Until then it is going to be awfully windy around here.

As the old adage goes: Action talks, Bull S#%@ walks.

Gerry Clinchy
10-05-2009, 06:45 AM
I sure don't have a problem knowing that the food stamp program helped a guy like Dave, and his small family, for a period in his life when he was getting himself an education to become a productive member of society. Such use of the program, I think, is exactly what it should be doing.

The abuses mentioned by several here ... THAT I have a problem with!

Absolutely, if you have to take a drug test to get (or hold) a job, one should do no less to continue to receive a government "gift" beyond, let's say, the first month. Not sure it would be easy to implement. Can also imagine that as soon as there were such rules, there will be plenty of folk who figure out how to cheat on it.

zeus3925
10-05-2009, 07:15 AM
What we have here is someone worrying about an extra 81 cents someone spent on a package of green beans. But, I don't see anyone wound up about millions in subsidies to oil companies to drill. And when the drilling takes place on Indian or Federal land, good luck in collecting the royalties. No one seems to be steamed about that.

Then there is the megabucks going to support ethanol production along with its ripple effect on food price. Uncle Sam then subsidizes farms, especially the big ones, to keep food prices low. There is the billions going to curry favor among warring creations of British foreign policy in the Middle East. Anybody's boiler lit?

When government spends $600 a piece on toilet seats I am not going to sweat 81 cents.

KEITH L
10-05-2009, 08:49 AM
zeus unfortunatly the .81 cents adds up faster into the billions. we as a society
do have a tendecy take advantage of government welfare. like you mentioned
most can and should be cut off.

keith l
________
Volcano Vaporizers (http://www.vaporshop.com/volcano-vaporizer.html)

zeus3925
10-05-2009, 09:14 AM
zeus unfortunatly the .81 cents adds up faster into the billions. we as a society
do have a tendecy take advantage of government welfare. like you mentioned
most can and should be cut off.

keith l

I don't disagree with you Kieth. Lets go after the really big bucks before we worry about the nickles and dimes. Is every one on assistance acting irresponsibly? Most are not. But, it is hard to ignore when it happens in front of you.

subroc
10-05-2009, 11:50 AM
...Lets go after the really big bucks before we worry about the nickles and dimes...

What would you rather have 20 nickles or a buck?

luvmylabs23139
10-05-2009, 01:53 PM
What we have here is someone worrying about an extra 81 cents someone spent on a package of green beans.

Actually it is a lot more than 81 cents.

Bag A was 1.88 for 2 lbs
Bag B was 2.69 for 12 ounces

Bag A is .94 per lb
Bag B is 3.59 per lb

It would cost $7.18 to buy the same amount of bag 2 as is in bag 1

7.18-1.88= $5.30 more!

ducknwork
10-05-2009, 02:00 PM
Actually it is a lot more than 81 cents.

Bag A was 1.88 for 2 lbs
Bag B was 2.69 for 12 ounces

Bag A is .94 per lb
Bag B is 3.59 per lb

It would cost $7.18 to buy the same amount of bag 2 as is in bag 1

7.18-1.88= $5.30 more!

That's a lot of nickels!
________
P_E_A_C_H (http://www.girlcamfriend.com/cam/P_E_A_C_H/)

zeus3925
10-05-2009, 02:03 PM
Actually it is a lot more than 81 cents.

Bag A was 1.88 for 2 lbs
Bag B was 2.69 for 12 ounces

Bag A is .94 per lb
Bag B is 3.59 per lb

It would cost $7.18 to buy the same amount of bag 2 as is in bag 1

7.18-1.88= $5.30 more!

First, not all people are born smart and savvy as you are.

Second, not all people are going to act responsibly when they know better.

As I say, what are you going to do about it? Would you volunteer your services as an accountant to do some consumer education or are you just going to beef?

Buzz
10-05-2009, 02:06 PM
How many of us run around with $100 bills on us? I certainly don't. I carry some cash, but have my debit card on me. It's harder for a thief to use my debit card without the code than cash. I'll bet that $100 bill is from illegal activity. Before anyone jumps on me, when I go to the ATM it spits out $20's not $100's.

I had a brother that was an alcoholic. When he was younger he never had any money beyond a couple days past payday. I don't know how many times I had to fill his gas tank so he could go to work and bought groceries so he had something to eat. I knew better than to give him cash.

For the day or two after payday, he'd have 100's in his wallet. I made about 4 times as much money as him, and I never carried them. It was about pretending, nothing reality based about it. I imagine there are lots of other poor people that do the same thing.

luvmylabs23139
10-05-2009, 02:22 PM
First, not all people are born smart and savvy as you are.

Second, not all people are going to act responsibly when they know better.

As I say what are you going to do about it? Would you volunteer your services as an accountant to do some consumer education or are you just going to beef?

I used the math I learned in elementary school not the accounting I learned in college.
Maybe schools should start teaching kids the basic math skills again and get rid of calculators in the lower grades!

zeus3925
10-05-2009, 03:36 PM
I used the math I learned in elementary school not the accounting I learned in college.
Maybe schools should start teaching kids the basic math skills again and get rid of calculators in the lower grades!

There you go, relying on government to solve the problem for you.

Do you have any skills that you can lend to your community to mitigate a problem that has you fuming?

Hew
10-05-2009, 04:13 PM
When government spends $600 a piece on toilet seats I am not going to sweat 81 cents.
What have you done to prevent $600 toilet seats? Have you marched on Washington? Have you thrown a moltov cocktail at your Congressman. Have you witheld $600 in taxes and told the IRS why? No? STFU, then. You're a slacker.

Doesn't that sound, well...silly?

Hoosier
10-05-2009, 04:45 PM
What have you done to prevent $600 toilet seats? Have you marched on Washington? Have you thrown a moltov cocktail at your Congressman. Have you witheld $600 in taxes and told the IRS why? No? STFU, then. You're a slacker.

Doesn't that sound, well...silly?

Damn Hew, over 700 posts and you're still batting a thousand.

Marvin S
10-05-2009, 04:55 PM
I sure don't have a problem knowing that the food stamp program helped a guy like Dave, and his small family, for a period in his life when he was getting himself an education to become a productive member of society.

Gerry, I have to disagree with you.

dave would have gotten a better education had he earned it on his own. Maybe he would'nt be so quick to embrace socialism had he had the will to earn the education on his own. In dave's case he owes everyone, big time.

A lot of people become productive members of society without getting a handout. ;-)

luvmylabs23139
10-05-2009, 05:16 PM
Here are the billions:

Fiscal year 2008 is more than 6 Billion Dolllars!
I had the breakdown in there for the last four years between food and amin costs but I lost all the formatting when it posted.

zeus3925
10-05-2009, 06:44 PM
What have you done to prevent $600 toilet seats? Have you marched on Washington? Have you thrown a moltov cocktail at your Congressman. Have you witheld $600 in taxes and told the IRS why? No? STFU, then. You're a slacker.

Doesn't that sound, well...silly?

Campaigned to get the bas'ard out. Includes doing mailing, phone banking and a contribution to his opponent.

You try withholding $600 from the IRS. They have little government run hotel in Levenworth, KS for you. I'll supplement your diet there by sending you a fruitcake.:D

By the bye--What have you done for the betterment of our great republic?

dnf777
10-05-2009, 07:43 PM
Gerry, I have to disagree with you.

dave would have gotten a better education had he earned it on his own. Maybe he would'nt be so quick to embrace socialism had he had the will to earn the education on his own. In dave's case he owes everyone, big time.

A lot of people become productive members of society without getting a handout. ;-)

Marvin, that post is so inaccurate and idiotic, I don't even know where to start. First, about getting a "better education"???? I graduated from Jefferson Medical College, ranked #1 in the U.S. in comprehensive medical schools, 1992, when I matriculated. Can I get any better than that? After surgical residency at Temple University, I did a fellowship at the Ochsner Clinic, again top in the world for my specialty. I suppose I could have done better in your view, but guess what?? Nobody cares about your ranking scheme of medical and post-doctoral residency and fellowship training! I took out loans which I am still paying monthly on, and gave up 5 years of the most productive earning years of my career serving on active duty to offset the cost of my education, and am damn proud of it. So when someone like you says I could have gotten a "better education" if I "earned it on my own", I have to wonder what the hell you've done for this country, what education you've had?? I don't usually talk like that, but if you're going to attack everything I"ve worked for, you better be ready to get it back at you! I did nothing to deserve such a vile attack on what I hold dear, other than mention that when times were tough, my wife used WIC, which has been repaid many times.
I'll bet you're the type who shows up at my office and carps about having to pay $15 copay, but worries that your doctor may have used some type of assistance to get through medical school, to offset a 200k education.

As for owing everyone bigtime, I'd like to hear your retarded explanation for that. After working 120 hrs/week at times for 7 years at 34k/yr, after med school, after college, that's an entire career for many people. That was just so I can START working. I owe my patients my full dedication to excellence, and thats what they get, nothing less. I owe you NOTHING.
Have a nice day. Ignorance is bliss.

Hew
10-05-2009, 10:59 PM
Campaigned to get the bas'ard out. Includes doing mailing, phone banking and a contribution to his opponent.

You try withholding $600 from the IRS. They have little government run hotel in Levenworth, KS for you. I'll supplement your diet there by sending you a fruitcake.:D

By the bye--What have you done for the betterment of our great republic?
LOL. You licked some stamps for a politician and that makes you a regular Yankee F'ing Doodle Dandy, eh? One more night on the phones pestering people at home and you can submit for, no, strike that....you DESERVE the Congressional Medal of Freedom. :p

I'm just funnin' ya. I've done the same things. But then I'm not the one pretending that I'm changing the world or that my 1st Ammendment rights count more than somebody else who doesn't do those things. ;-)

Marvin S
10-05-2009, 11:20 PM
Marvin, that post is so inaccurate and idiotic, I don't even know where to start. First, about getting a "better education"???? I graduated from Jefferson Medical College, ranked #1 in the U.S. in comprehensive medical schools, 1992, when I matriculated. Can I get any better than that? After surgical residency at Temple University, I did a fellowship at the Ochsner Clinic, again top in the world for my specialty. I suppose I could have done better in your view, but guess what?? Nobody cares about your ranking scheme of medical and post-doctoral residency and fellowship training! I took out loans which I am still paying monthly on, and gave up 5 years of the most productive earning years of my career serving on active duty to offset the cost of my education, and am damn proud of it. So when someone like you says I could have gotten a "better education" if I "earned it on my own", I have to wonder what the hell you've done for this country, what education you've had?? I don't usually talk like that, but if you're going to attack everything I"ve worked for, you better be ready to get it back at you! I did nothing to deserve such a vile attack on what I hold dear, other than mention that when times were tough, my wife used WIC, which has been repaid many times.
I'll bet you're the type who shows up at my office and carps about having to pay $15 copay, but worries that your doctor may have used some type of assistance to get through medical school, to offset a 200k education.

As for owing everyone bigtime, I'd like to hear your retarded explanation for that. After working 120 hrs/week at times for 7 years at 34k/yr, after med school, after college, that's an entire career for many people. That was just so I can START working. I owe my patients my full dedication to excellence, and thats what they get, nothing less. I owe you NOTHING.
Have a nice day. Ignorance is bliss.


Gerry, I have to disagree with you.

dave would have gotten a better education had he earned it on his own. Maybe he would'nt be so quick to embrace socialism had he had the will to earn the education on his own. In dave's case he owes everyone, big time.

A lot of people become productive members of society without getting a handout. ;-)

When times got tough you took the easy way out, you said so. Just read the last line of my post, it says it all. Just as many others will to rationalize that what they are doing is OK.

Remember, anyone can rationalize that what they did was correct, even when it is not.

You have a nice day, & careful when name calling, it has to be beneath the dignity of what you claim to be. ;-)

BTW, my speciality at work was taking the wind out of the sails of know it alls like yourself. It's very entertaining. :eek:

& FYI, If it really made any difference, I would compare life's hardships & how they were handled by myself with you. But it doesn't, so we'll let it go at that. But I will say "No Handouts", my personal pride is much higher than that.

Gerry Clinchy
10-05-2009, 11:44 PM
Gerry, I have to disagree with you.

dave would have gotten a better education had he earned it on his own. Maybe he would'nt be so quick to embrace socialism had he had the will to earn the education on his own. In dave's case he owes everyone, big time.

A lot of people become productive members of society without getting a handout. ;-)


But not all of them become doctors :-) ... or could become doctors even if they had all the financing.

Doctors get more schooling than many other professions; then more time as interns & residents. Unlike some other professions, how well they learn becomes literally a matter of life or death. I think we often forget that while doctors can make some big bucks, they also put in long hours, depending on their specialty.

I'm less concerned that our taxes are helping educate doctors, than thinking some perfectly good tax money goes to educating lawyers :razz:

I think loans are legitimate to finance education. They are paid back; not charity. Some would not be able to go to advanced schooling without the loans. Ive read there are a lot of defaults on student loans, but if Dave is repaying his loans, then there's no gripe there.

Look on the bright side ... as a doctor, Dave will get to pay a ton of income taxes to replenish the WIC fund from which he may have gotten maybe about $15,000 worth of food from :-) [That would be $150/wk for family of 3 for 2 years] We should be so lucky that everyone who has been on the program should be able to repay their debt with some taxes like Dave probably contributes :-)

I have read in some instances armed forces personnel are also eligible for food stamps. In my book, it is kind of disgraceful that our soldiers have to live on the edge of poverty. I would not deny them some additional help either.

It's those who "abuse" what is meant to be a temporary hand up that cost not only money, but our society's fabric. Those families where welfare has become a "career" rather than a temporary condition is where such programs have failed.

I could be wrong, but I don't read Dave as "embracing socialism". I do think he's of a "liberal" mind on several issues (he has defended the value of unions); and not so liberal on others (he doesn't like silly govt spending any more than others on this forum).

zeus3925
10-05-2009, 11:59 PM
LOL. You licked some stamps for a politician and that makes you a eh? One more night on the phones pestering people at home and you can submit for, no, strike that....you DESERVE the Congressional Medal of Freedom. :p

I'm just funnin' ya. I've done the same things. But then I'm not the one pretending that, I'm changing the world or that my 1st Ammendment rights count more than somebody else who doesn't do those things. ;-)

I don't need no stinkin' medals.

I didn't say or imply I'm changing the world or that my 1st Ammendment rights count more than somebody else who doesn't do those things.

But, being a regular Yankee F'ing Doodle Dandy, that might fit.

Cheers, Hew, don't let the Gators bite you in the posterior.

Buzz
10-06-2009, 12:16 AM
Is a student that meets the income qualifications for federal financial aid and accepts it a slacker? Is a student with a family that meets the income qualifications for WIC and accepts it so he can feed his family while in school any different? If so, how?

I qualified for financial aid and I accepted it. As a result my daughter will not qualify for financial aid, and I will end up footing her bill, as well as part of the tuition of others who qualify for aid, through the vastly higher taxes I've paid over the years compared to what I would have been otherwise paying. And along the way, I think that education has been applied toward making the lives of a few people better than they would have otherwise been.

charly_t
10-06-2009, 12:21 AM
..... And when the drilling takes place on Indian or Federal land, good luck in collecting the royalties. No one seems to be steamed about that.


So who should get the royalties when the drilling takes place on "Indian land" ? Just was wondering what you thought.

charly_t

dnf777
10-06-2009, 05:29 AM
When times got tough you took the easy way out, you said so. Just read the last line of my post, it says it all. Just as many others will to rationalize that what they are doing is OK.

Remember, anyone can rationalize that what they did was correct, even when it is not.

You have a nice day, & careful when name calling, it has to be beneath the dignity of what you claim to be. ;-)

BTW, my speciality at work was taking the wind out of the sails of know it alls like yourself. It's very entertaining. :eek:

& FYI, If it really made any difference, I would compare life's hardships & how they were handled by myself with you. But it doesn't, so we'll let it go at that. But I will say "No Handouts", my personal pride is much higher than that.

Well, first Marvin, I didn't call you names. I said you post was idiotic, and if the PMs I've recieved are any indication, I was right. Get your accusations correct.

I pointed out that I serve my fellow man, and served my country in order to off-set the cost of education. You said you "take wind out of sails". I've never heard of a "wind taker". Does that serve your country?? Someone who thinks becoming a doctor and serving the army is "taking the easy way out", I'd really like to hear what they do???

Sorry, your reply was a woefully inadequate attempt to save face, after a very inappropriate personal insult.

YardleyLabs
10-06-2009, 06:35 AM
When times got tough you took the easy way out, you said so. Just read the last line of my post, it says it all. Just as many others will to rationalize that what they are doing is OK.

Remember, anyone can rationalize that what they did was correct, even when it is not.

You have a nice day, & careful when name calling, it has to be beneath the dignity of what you claim to be. ;-)

BTW, my speciality at work was taking the wind out of the sails of know it alls like yourself. It's very entertaining. :eek:

& FYI, If it really made any difference, I would compare life's hardships & how they were handled by myself with you. But it doesn't, so we'll let it go at that. But I will say "No Handouts", my personal pride is much higher than that.
Marvin,

We have those programs for a reason and, generally speaking, those reasons are good, no matter how mean spirited you may choose to be. In 1933, my drunken, KKK member grandfather chose to drive himself and two of his sons across a one lane bridge already being used by a car coming in the other direction. Fortunately, my grandfather was the only one killed. He left behind seven children, aged 2 months to 14 years, and a wife earning $7/week as a waitress. The family survived only because of surplus foods available through the Department of Agriculture, the Depression era equivalent of food stamps. My father went on to put himself through college and then sent two of his brothers to college. Every kid grew up to be independent and a contributing member of society. However, nothing about their lives could ever be described as taking "the easy way out".

So you can be as nasty and pig headed as you want. Fortunately as a country we have found better ways to use our heads, including having programs that help families survive through crises. Mistakes are made in some of those programs, but hopefully over time they have become more effective in helping people work out of poverty rather than become used to it.

By the way, from your "no handouts" claim I am assuming that you are not accepting any more from social security than you paid in and that you do not accept Medicare.

zeus3925
10-06-2009, 08:19 AM
So who should get the royalties when the drilling takes place on "Indian land" ? Just was wondering what you thought.

charly_t

Presently, the tribe via the Mineral Management Service in the Department of Interior.

Pete
10-06-2009, 08:30 AM
Its one thing taking government aid and sitting back and doing nothing

Its another who accept it and better their life and end up being contributors to society.
Sometimes you need money or a hand out to get somewhere ,
I would commend those that got grants and loans for education and bettered their life. Or those that took hamdouts until they got back on their feet. At least they used it for what its for and were successful in their goals. And they overcame the adversity


This isnt a lib or rep. thing,,most people will take advantage of things or situations to better their life. Stuff happens in life thats not good.
People will do what it takes to thrive.

Its hard to condem someone for that

Pete

ErinsEdge
10-06-2009, 09:08 AM
savings on healthcare would come from education to prevent smoking, obesity, and the tools they/people need to live healthier lives. Much like this, it would be impossible to demand anyone do anything on that front.

I don't have a problem with food supplements if it was for real food-milk, eggs, fresh fruits and vegetables, meats. Talk about using tools with wellness, why not start out by only allowing real food instead of junk food for family supplements? Let them pay cash for junk food. The computers are tagged for taxable items, how about for healthy items only allowed? That could be done now. It used to be certain items were tabboo-why did that stop?

Buzz
10-06-2009, 09:12 AM
I don't have a problem with food supplements if it was for real food-milk, eggs, fresh fruits and vegetables, meats. Talk about using tools with wellness, why not start out by only allowing real food instead of junk food for family supplements? Let them pay cash for junk food. The computers are tagged for taxable items, how about for healthy items only allowed? That could be done now. It used to be certain items were tabboo-why did that stop?

Good luck with the lobbying from the junk food producers.

Pete
10-06-2009, 09:16 AM
I don't have a problem with food supplements if it was for real food-milk, eggs, fresh fruits and vegetables, meats. Talk about using tools with wellness, why not start out by only allowing real food instead of junk food for family supplements? Let them pay cash for junk food. The computers are tagged for taxable items, how about for healthy items only allowed? That could be done now. It used to be certain items were tabboo-why did that stop

Amen Nancy


Good luck with the lobbying from the junk food producers

Somebody need the balls to look these overpaid bass turds in the eye and tell them to get out of their face. Isnt that how you get rid of pests
I dont know if their are junk food lobbiests or not ,,,just the word lobbiest pisses me off.

Pete

Henry V
10-06-2009, 09:35 AM
I don't have a problem with food supplements if it was for real food-milk, eggs, fresh fruits and vegetables, meats. Talk about using tools with wellness, why not start out by only allowing real food instead of junk food for family supplements? Let them pay cash for junk food. The computers are tagged for taxable items, how about for healthy items only allowed? That could be done now. It used to be certain items were tabboo-why did that stop?
This is exactly the purpose of WIC. It is an entirely different program from food stamps. From the WIC website http://www.fns.usda.gov/wic/:

WIC provides Federal grants to States for supplemental foods, health care referrals, and nutrition education for low-income pregnant, breastfeeding, and non-breastfeeding postpartum women, and to infants and children up to age five who are found to be at nutritional risk.
and,
The WIC food packages provide supplemental foods designed to meet the special nutritional needs of low-income pregnant, breastfeeding, non-breastfeeding postpartum women, infants and children up to five years of age who are at nutritional risk. WIC food packages and nutrition education are the chief means by which WIC affects the dietary quality and habits of participants.
So, the program is in fact trying to counter the fast food, junk food, and processed food culture that we live in that is fully subsidized by the federal farm program.
Its kind of funny that this thread started with a criticism of the fact that the state implemented WIC program did this
So, at some point WIC added a veggie entitlement. I'm walking thru the frozen food aisle and notice that Food Lion has signs on certain items, frozen veggies, that say WIC approved. OK, but this gets me furious..........
As far as I am concerned the WIC program is just the type of low income food program to use if you are going to have a program. We can help kids now through WIC or pay a lot more for their long term health care costs later or do neither.

ducknwork
10-06-2009, 09:43 AM
Its kind of funny that this thread started with a criticism of the fact that the state implemented WIC program did this


You missed the point. The point was that people on WIC are allowed to buy the name brand hideously expensive foods on our dime, while people who work for a living and value their money generally will get store brand to save money. If it is your own hard earned money, buy what you want. If it is government money, some common sense should be used by whoever decides what is allowed.
________
1983 kawasaki kz550 f1 spectre (http://www.cyclechaos.com/wiki/Kawasaki_KZ1100D)

dnf777
10-06-2009, 09:57 AM
You missed the point. The point was that people on WIC are allowed to buy the name brand hideously expensive foods on our dime, while people who work for a living and value their money generally will get store brand to save money. If it is your own hard earned money, buy what you want. If it is government money, some common sense should be used by whoever decides what is allowed.

You would think that even when given WIC vouchers, that there is still limited funds, and they would shop judiciously. It's been mentioned here before by others, and bears repeating: "You can't fix stupid!" Whether paying with WIC, ACcess, or hard-earned cash, some people just won't care.

ducknwork
10-06-2009, 10:04 AM
You would think that even when given WIC vouchers, that there is still limited funds, and they would shop judiciously. It's been mentioned here before by others, and bears repeating: "You can't fix stupid!" Whether paying with WIC, ACcess, or hard-earned cash, some people just won't care.

Winner winner chicken dinner!!

Hey write this down. I TOTALLY agree with you...:D;)
________
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dnf777
10-06-2009, 10:10 AM
Winner winner chicken dinner!!

Hey write this down. I TOTALLY agree with you...:D;)

WOW! I never thought I'd get a "chicken dinner" on POTUS!!:D:D

Cody Covey
10-06-2009, 10:30 AM
You would think that even when given WIC vouchers, that there is still limited funds, and they would shop judiciously. It's been mentioned here before by others, and bears repeating: "You can't fix stupid!" Whether paying with WIC, ACcess, or hard-earned cash, some people just won't care.

I haven't worked at a grocery store in a couple years but when i did WIC was a per item voucher not monetary. The voucher is for example for 1 peanut butter for a certain amount of ounces and 3 cereals etc... so really they have no reason to be frugal.

Henry V
10-06-2009, 10:42 AM
You missed the point. The point was that people on WIC are allowed to buy the name brand hideously expensive foods on our dime, while people who work for a living and value their money generally will get store brand to save money. If it is your own hard earned money, buy what you want. If it is government money, some common sense should be used by whoever decides what is allowed.
I directly quoted one point of the start of this thread. It was, in part, about the "veggie entitlement".

Why does anyone presume that low income folks in this program prefer to buy high dollar foods? Why do you also presume that these folks on WIC are not working? Perhaps you should volunteer at a WIC clinic in your county and see how the program works and who is served.

If you want to know more about costs of the program and how money is spent check out http://www.fns.usda.gov/ora/WICFoodCosts/FY2005/FY2005.pdf

It is once again great to see such a nice Christian mindset/approach expressed on a public policy issue here.

luvmylabs23139
10-06-2009, 10:46 AM
[quote=Henry V;508925]Its kind of funny that this thread started with a criticism of the fact that the state implemented WIC program did this
quote]

You completely missed the point. MY point as the OP was that when I go grocery shopping I look for the best value for my family's money.
I will buy the green beans that cost 1/4 the price for basically the same item as someone can spend for the exact same basic item using taxpayer $$$.
That is my issue with the system.
Remember I compared frozen green bean A to frozen green bean B.
I was questioning why my tax dollars are being used for someone to pay in the same store 4 X's as much for the same item.

Raymond Little
10-06-2009, 10:59 AM
I directly quoted one point of the start of this thread. It was, in part, about the "veggie entitlement".

Why does anyone presume that low income folks in this program prefer to buy high dollar foods? Why do you also presume that these folks on WIC are not working? Perhaps you should volunteer at a WIC clinic in your county and see how the program works and who is served.

If you want to know more about costs of the program and how money is spent check out http://www.fns.usda.gov/ora/WICFoodCosts/FY2005/FY2005.pdf

It is once again great to see such a nice Christian mindset/approach expressed on a public policy issue here.
Because it is not their money and they will gladly tell you that when asked!

luvmylabs23139
10-06-2009, 11:01 AM
I directly quoted one point of the start of this thread. It was, in part, about the "veggie entitlement".

Why does anyone presume that low income folks in this program prefer to buy high dollar foods? Why do you also presume that these folks on WIC are not working? Perhaps you should volunteer at a WIC clinic in your county and see how the program works and who is served.

If you want to know more about costs of the program and how money is spent check out http://www.fns.usda.gov/ora/WICFoodCosts/FY2005/FY2005.pdf

It is once again great to see such a nice Christian mindset/approach expressed on a public policy issue here.

Geeze, have you ever worked in a grocery store and dealt with WIC checks or food stamps(back when they were funny money)?
Go spend just one day working in a grocery store and you will quickly notice the difference between what is being bought by people who use their hard earned money and those on the public dole.
Here's a good example:
WIC check for 1/2 gallon of juice.
Person paying own way buys either store brand or whatever is on sale depending on what is cheaper.
WIC voucher: They buy their favorite brand regardless of price.

Raymond Little
10-06-2009, 11:02 AM
Guy inline at local grocery is buying cases of cokes that happened to be onsale one day. He pulls out his La Purchase card and swipes it:mad:, I swipe my debit card and proceed to the parking lot to see him loading up his new CADILLAC CTS!:-x These people have a differrent value system than the people that actually work for a living.

luvmylabs23139
10-06-2009, 11:10 AM
You would think that even when given WIC vouchers, that there is still limited funds, and they would shop judiciously. It's been mentioned here before by others, and bears repeating: "You can't fix stupid!" Whether paying with WIC, ACcess, or hard-earned cash, some people just won't care.
Dave,
I think we actually agree on something! The point of my original rant was the waste of money comparing what I pay VS what someone can pay for the same basic item using taxpayer money.
What boils my blood is that I pay X and yet the person who is living off off my tax dollars can pay 4 X's as much for the same item.
I can't change (at least with democrats in power) the amount of money the gov't takes from me.

luvmylabs23139
10-06-2009, 11:22 AM
Is a student with a family that meets the income qualifications for WIC and accepts it so he can feed his family while in school any different? If so, how?

.

Many liberal won't agree with this but really, why have kids you can't afford, and expect others to pay for them?????:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

ducknwork
10-06-2009, 11:49 AM
Many liberal won't agree with this but really, why have kids you can't afford, and expect others to pay for them?????:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

In theory, that is a great point. But what about the guy who works 2 jobs to support his family and is doing fine. Then, his company lays him off. He could afford the kids when he had them...
________
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ducknwork
10-06-2009, 11:51 AM
I directly quoted one point of the start of this thread. It was, in part, about the "veggie entitlement".


Well, sort of. You left out the key point that was the entire reason (justifiably so) for the rant. You knew you left it out, hence the ........ at the end of your quote where you left the important part out. You would make a great liberal newspaper columnist.

Pick and choose reporting regards,
________
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luvmylabs23139
10-06-2009, 12:04 PM
In theory, that is a great point. But what about the guy who works 2 jobs to support his family and is doing fine. Then, his company lays him off. He could afford the kids when he had them...

That is totally different from the person who could not afford the kids when they had them.
I also have a huge problem with people who don't think and rather than have a reserve in the bank they have 2 brand new cars in the garage and then claim poor when something happens.

ducknwork
10-06-2009, 12:10 PM
That is totally different from the person who could not afford the kids when they had them.
I also have a huge problem with people who don't think and rather than have a reserve in the bank they have 2 brand new cars in the garage and then claim poor when something happens.

Agreed, but the example buzz gave did not specify that the person was young and couldn't afford the kids. All he said was 'student'. Lots of people get laid off and then go back to school.
________
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luvmylabs23139
10-06-2009, 12:15 PM
Agreed, but the example buzz gave did not specify that the person was young and couldn't afford the kids. All he said was 'student'. Lots of people get laid off and then go back to school.

He also didn't say that the person could afford the kids before a layoff, Buzz never mentioned a layoff in his original post.

ducknwork
10-06-2009, 12:17 PM
Yes, I know.

So you jumped to the conclusion that he couldn't afford the kids and I gave you an example of why you can't jump to conclusions.
________
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luvmylabs23139
10-06-2009, 12:26 PM
Yes, I know.

So you jumped to the conclusion that he couldn't afford the kids and I gave you an example of why you can't jump to conclusions.


Here's what I am really saying.
There is a huge problem in this country when people claim "poor" because a job loss really means that 2 car payments and insane house payment etc break the bank.

Buzz
10-06-2009, 03:27 PM
Agreed, but the example buzz gave did not specify that the person was young and couldn't afford the kids. All he said was 'student'. Lots of people get laid off and then go back to school.

I didn't mention the circumstances when the kid/kids were born, because to me it's irrelevant.

If the wage earner got laid off and is back in school trying to improve his/her marketability in the job market, good for them. If a young kid fathers a child, takes responsibility for it instead pushing for an abortion, marries the girl, and goes to college to help put himself in the position to take care of his family, great. Sounds to me like the responsible thing to do.

ducknwork
10-06-2009, 03:45 PM
I didn't mention the circumstances when the kid/kids were born, because to me it's irrelevant.

If the wage earner got laid off and is back in school trying to improve his/her marketability in the job market, good for them. If a young kid fathers a child, takes responsibility for it instead pushing for an abortion, marries the girl, and goes to college to help put himself in the position to take care of his family, great. Sounds to me like the responsible thing to do.

Quit making sense!

Although, I think rather than accepting the fact of teen pregnancies, more should be done to prevent it. I don't necessarily mean hand out condoms. I am thinking more along the lines of parents raising their children the right way. Any social change that is going to happen has to begin at home. I could be wrong, because I am not that old, but 50 years ago teen pregnancies or pregnancies outside of wedlock were not as prevalent as they are today. I believe that is due to lack of parenting and a society that, as a general rule, condones any behavior that makes you 'feel' good. Almost any problem that we have today can be traced back to a lack of morals, ethics, and values.


All this agreeing I am doing today is starting to worry me. Am I hanging out with the wrong crowd?:confused:
________
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Marvin S
10-06-2009, 05:59 PM
Marvin,

We have those programs for a reason and, generally speaking, those reasons are good, no matter how mean spirited you may choose to be. In 1933, my drunken, KKK member grandfather chose to drive himself and two of his sons across a one lane bridge already being used by a car coming in the other direction. Fortunately, my grandfather was the only one killed. He left behind seven children, aged 2 months to 14 years, and a wife earning $7/week as a waitress. The family survived only because of surplus foods available through the Department of Agriculture, the Depression era equivalent of food stamps. My father went on to put himself through college and then sent two of his brothers to college. Every kid grew up to be independent and a contributing member of society. However, nothing about their lives could ever be described as taking "the easy way out".

I am quite familiar with relief & the commodities that were distributed. I am also familiar with the requirement that one had their name published in the county newspaper as someone on relief to be sure they were truly in need.


So you can be as nasty and pig headed as you want. Fortunately as a country we have found better ways to use our heads, including having programs that help families survive through crises. Mistakes are made in some of those programs, but hopefully over time they have become more effective in helping people work out of poverty rather than become used to it.

I have no issue with a hand up but many with handouts. You may in all your willingness to help others with someone else's money call me all the names you want, but I consider you to be wrong.


By the way, from your "no handouts" claim I am assuming that you are not accepting any more from social security than you paid in and that you do not accept Medicare.

With all your cognitive abilities I would believe you to be able to see a difference in these programs & WIC. If not, start a new thread as it is a much different subject.

zeus3925
10-07-2009, 09:24 AM
For those worried about the price of a package of beans that no one saw buy with WIC.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33205803/ns/us_news-military/

dnf777
10-07-2009, 09:31 AM
For those worried about the price of a package of beans that no one saw buy with WIC.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33205803/ns/us_news-military/

Billions shmillions! I trust defense contractors completely. I don't know why we even waste time in budget committees and oversight committees....just give them a blank check, and trust they'll do what's right. :rolleyes:

Wouldn't it be nice to be able to put on some "truth goggles" and really see where that money ends up??

ducknwork
10-07-2009, 09:36 AM
By posting that article, you are obviously trying to downplay the significance of the excessive government waste in WIC. In all reality, they are BOTH serious issues that waste a ton of our money and BOTH of them need to be dealt with. I don't think that waste in one area is any more significant than waste in another area. Overspending is overspending, no matter what it is being spent on, and something needs to be done to fix any and all financial waste, whether it be on the battlefield or on aisle 3...
________
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luvmylabs23139
10-07-2009, 10:53 AM
For those worried about the price of a package of beans that no one saw buy with WIC.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33205803/ns/us_news-military/

Save me the "no one saw". I have, many years ago, actually processed thru the grocery store register many WIC transactions that were a waste of tax money.
Most expensive brand of milk, high priced name brand cereal vs the on sale store brand equivalent etc. Yes I have witnessed and processed the waste, because I had no choice but follow the law. I did however, unlike many cashiers play the food police. No one was gonna slip one extra ounce past me, or sneak imported cheese thru.

Gerry Clinchy
10-07-2009, 11:02 AM
ducknwork

Overspending is overspending, no matter what it is being spent on, and something needs to be done to fix any and all financial waste, whether it be on the battlefield or on aisle 3...

Bingo! The obvious waste may be easier to spot, but the kind that is less obvious can be even more insidious.