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Fowlfeller1100
11-27-2009, 10:16 PM
I heard a couple of quotes today from a book and cant figure out who wrote the book, or the name of the book. If someone could help it would be much appreciated. These are paraphrased by the way.

"All (men/beings) seek to expend their energy"

"All (men/beings) are driven by will ..., nothing else matters"

The "will" seems to point to Schopenhaur but this doesn't seem to pan out, this is drivign me nuts.

JDogger
11-27-2009, 11:26 PM
I heard a couple of quotes today from a book and cant figure out who wrote the book, or the name of the book. If someone could help it would be much appreciated. These are paraphrased by the way.

"All (men/beings) seek to expend their energy"

"All (men/beings) are driven by will ..., nothing else matters"

The "will" seems to point to Schopenhaur but this doesn't seem to pan out, this is drivign me nuts.

A google of both quotes yielded little other than similarities of the second quote to something similar made by Michael Jordon;
http://www.amazon.com/Driven-Within-Michael-Jordan/dp/B000GYI1II

The first quote seems even more obscure. Google it yerselves.

The second quote, however sounds to me more like Allister Crowley.

"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thelema

Google it.

I know, I know. Now I'm not just a liberal, I'm a devil worshipper.:rolleyes:

Thanks for the break in the mundane, repetitious, blathering of todays other threads, Fowlfeller, and I agree, it does sound like Schopenhaur, but I could find no links to attribute the quotes to him.

As many here know, the internet, with all its possibilities, does not always yield what you seek, but if you seek, you'll surely find something.

JD

"Would you tell me, please, which way I ought to go from here?"
"That depends a good deal on where you want to get to," said the Cat.
"I don't much care where-" said Alice.
"Then it doesn't matter which way you go," said the Cat.
"-so long as I get somewhere," Alice added as an explanation.
"Oh, you're sure to do that," said the Cat, "if you only walk long enough."

Uncle Bill
11-28-2009, 10:44 AM
A google of both quotes yielded little other than similarities of the second quote to something similar made by Michael Jordon;
http://www.amazon.com/Driven-Within-Michael-Jordan/dp/B000GYI1II

The first quote seems even more obscure. Google it yerselves.

The second quote, however sounds to me more like Allister Crowley.

"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thelema

Google it.

I know, I know. Now I'm not just a liberal, I'm a devil worshipper.:rolleyes:

Thanks for the break in the mundane, repetitious, blathering of todays other threads, Fowlfeller, and I agree, it does sound like Schopenhaur, but I could find no links to attribute the quotes to him.

As many here know, the internet, with all its possibilities, does not always yield what you seek, but if you seek, you'll surely find something.

JD

"Would you tell me, please, which way I ought to go from here?"
"That depends a good deal on where you want to get to," said the Cat.
"I don't much care where-" said Alice.
"Then it doesn't matter which way you go," said the Cat.
"-so long as I get somewhere," Alice added as an explanation.
"Oh, you're sure to do that," said the Cat, "if you only walk long enough."



You learned well from Nero, Hugh. There you sit, with the nation falling apart in large part by your crowd's enabling, and your lost in Alice in Wonderland. :rolleyes: GFF

Just keep sipping the koolaid. No concerns for you.

UB

Fowlfeller1100
11-28-2009, 06:09 PM
It was Nietzchie (spelling I know...), I thought it might have been him.

JDogger
11-28-2009, 08:06 PM
It was Nietzchie (spelling I know...), I thought it might have been him.

How and what did you find? I'd be interested.

JD

Uncle Bill
11-29-2009, 01:42 PM
That's easy.

Friedrich Wilhelm Nitzsche said "God is dead!"

To which God replied, "Nitzsche is dead".

Guess we all know how that turned out eh?

UB

Fowlfeller1100
11-29-2009, 04:40 PM
The "God is dead" ("Gott ist tot" I believe) concept is fascinating to me, and probably true at least in the practical context. We no longer explicitely act on religion and certinely religions role in government is diminishing, its more values and less literal. But suddenly we find ourselves without a guide, can we guide ourselves?

Uncle Bill
11-29-2009, 05:26 PM
You sound like you are having a moral dilemma, or at least a problem?

No doubt America has turned it's back on God, for whatever reason...political, ACLU and other court actions, Roe V Wade...all these have an effect, and have succeeded in discarding the moral fiber of the country.

But the fact remains, if the church-going public were really and truly bible-believing Christians, the atheists and agnostics, along with the just plain PC, wouldn't have had the impact on this nation they have had.

After getting thrown out of so many public locations that the founders had no problems with, is it any wonder that just maybe God is considering He may no longer be needed? Maybe like Atlas, it's also His time to shrug. It's not unprecedented...Noahs time, Sodom and Gemorrah, (which I think more resembles what we are witnessing today).

As one continues to age and is allowed to hang around to experience more of this life, attitudes change. Kinda like the old adage of never seeing an atheist in an active foxhole, there are also fewer agnostics over 80.

As for your question, 'can we guide ourselves?'...let me answer with a question...how's that hope and change working out for you?

UB

Fowlfeller1100
11-29-2009, 06:45 PM
Well, I'm not exactly an Obama fanatic, truthfully like Rand, am not an atheist, and mostly agree with you. But I for the purposes of debate will try to provide a counter argument.

-As we age we don't want to accept that there will be a definite end, heaven is much more appealing, so at the last minute we repent covering us in case there is a heaven. I once attended a church service where the minister compared living a Christian life to wearing a seat-belt, you never know when you will need it, but my take is that when you get to be pretty old it is nearly certain you will need it soon.

-As for man kind without religion, it could be argued that we are better of without a bunch of voodoo myticism, that makes us do crazy often violent irrational stuff. And more and more science is winning the war with religion (ex. evolution).

Bonus points if you can answer this question that has been bugging me;
"If god doesn't want to be portrayed or in effect "pinned down" by a definition, what does it mean when it is said that man was created in his image?"

Leddyman
11-29-2009, 09:39 PM
The "God is dead" ("Gott ist tot" I believe) concept is fascinating to me, and probably true at least in the practical context. We no longer explicitely act on religion and certinely religions role in government is diminishing, its more values and less literal. But suddenly we find ourselves without a guide, can we guide ourselves?

Are you aware that Nitzsche spent the last 8 years of his life totally insane?

Religion has little bearing on the existence or not of God. Religion is man's attempt to please God. Whether or not He exists is not affected by the actions of men.

The great question that Nitzsche could not answer is this..."why is there something instead if nothing?"

God is alive and well, I talk to Him every day.

Leddyman
11-29-2009, 10:00 PM
[QUOTE=F

Bonus points if you can answer this question that has been bugging me;
"If god doesn't want to be portrayed or in effect "pinned down" by a definition, what does it mean when it is said that man was created in his image?"[/QUOTE]

Who said God doesn't want to be portrayed? or defined?

God is beyond our ability to understand completely. However, He does wish to be known. The Bible is God's revelation of Himself to man. Paul says in Romans that God wishing to be known has revealed Himself in nature, also known as general revelation.

(Romans 1)  because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead.

To answer your question, what does it mean that God made man in his image?

Is really simple and not so simple at the same time. Theologically it means that man has part of God's spirit. God breathed into man the breath of life and he became a living Spirit. This was not the process for any other life that God created. Remember that this is before the effects of sin entered into the equation. Man had unfettered access to God much as Jesus did in His incarnation.

Practically it is the explanation for the differences between man and all other creatures. 1. Man is unique in creative ability. We create God creates. 2. Man has language. Man speaks God speaks. Animals communicate certain things but not abstract concepts using words. 3. Man can reason, God reasons. Animals are not capable of deductive reasoning. 4. Man is aware of a future. Animals never think about death, they do not plan for the future. 5. Only man worships God. Your dog may worship you, but he has no concept of God. Funny though that if He showed up your dog would probably recognize Him before you did.

To put it simply God created man in order that man could glorify God. To do this he made him different than all other things He created. This is evident in creation. We are unique in abilities. It isn't accidental. God isn't dead.

Fowlfeller1100
12-02-2009, 05:36 PM
"You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them.

(Exodus 20:4-6).

If you define a thing as being X then you are saying that it is therefore not the things that are not X. And God is infinite beyond comprehension so he is not the things that are not X.

This is interesting discussion...