PDA

View Full Version : Universe 13.7 Billion Years Old "Happy B'Day"



Franco
01-05-2010, 08:11 PM
Flippen' through that Comcast sight I found this gem.

Hubble is well worth the investment!

http://www.comcast.net/articles/news-science/20100105/US.SCI.Hubble.Photo/

subroc
01-05-2010, 08:18 PM
...Hubble is well worth the investment!


I believe it is as well.

dnf777
01-05-2010, 08:24 PM
Only godless liberals would think the world was older than 6000 years! All those fake fossils and rock strata prove it! :rolleyes:

YardleyLabs
01-05-2010, 08:38 PM
All obviously a hoax based on unproven theories of expansion. Everything was created simultaneously at different distances from the earth. The false notion of age stems solely from the mistaken belief that all the galaxies originally started in the same place. That place was God's hand and he only needed one day to put everything in its proper place where it remains today. This would all be clear if you only opened your hearts to the truth.:rolleyes:


In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.


And that was before he even got warmed up on the first day.... On the fourth day, "He also made the stars."

brent mccoy
01-05-2010, 08:50 PM
Very well said Jeff.

Franco
01-05-2010, 08:50 PM
I believe it is as well.



The new James Webb telescope costing 4.5 billion dollars and launching in 4 years will be able to take us to the beginning of time!:cool:

K G
01-05-2010, 09:22 PM
Only godless liberals would think the world was older than 6000 years! All those fake fossils and rock strata prove it! :rolleyes:


All obviously a hoax based on unproven theories of expansion. Everything was created simultaneously at different distances from the earth. The false notion of age stems solely from the mistaken belief that all the galaxies originally started in the same place. That place was God's hand and he only needed one day to put everything in its proper place where it remains today. This would all be clear if you only opened your hearts to the truth.:rolleyes:


In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.


And that was before he even got warmed up on the first day.... On the fourth day, "He also made the stars."

Interesting...we can always count on you two to take the anti-creation/anti-
God tack WHENEVER there is an opportunity...thanks for being so predictable.

Good job staying on task, Franco.

kg

dnf777
01-05-2010, 09:52 PM
Interesting...we can always count on you two to take the anti-creation/anti-
God tack WHENEVER there is an opportunity...thanks for being so predictable.

Good job staying on task, Franco.

kg

So predictable of you to think that ONLY YOUR religious views are valid. That God could not have made the heavens and earth in ways that those blinded by men in robes (or designer suits and Rolexes) cannot or will not possibly see. As Wilhelm Humboldt said, "I do not need men or books to teach me, the earth is my textbook."

Nothing about astronomy or biology or geology is "anti-creation/anti-God". Only in your narrowly defined interpretation is it. Darwin, Descartes, Humboldt, were ALL Christians. It was only when their work threatened the power structure of the church were they threatened or ridiculed. This has been a constant, recurring theme throughout the history of reason versus religion.

K G
01-05-2010, 10:13 PM
So predictable of you to think that ONLY YOUR religious views are valid. That God could not have made the heavens and earth in ways that those blinded by men in robes (or designer suits and Rolexes) cannot or will not possibly see. As Wilhelm Humboldt said, "I do not need men or books to teach me, the earth is my textbook."

Nothing about astronomy or biology or geology is "anti-creation/anti-God". Only in your narrowly defined interpretation is it. Darwin, Descartes, Humboldt, were ALL Christians. It was only when their work threatened the power structure of the church were they threatened or ridiculed. This has been a constant, recurring theme throughout the history of reason versus religion.


dnf, your fear is showing....;-)

You know NOTHING of my beliefs, and I sure haven't posted them on this thread. Weren't you the one crying on another thread about being pigeonholed about what you believe, yet you can slam what you think I believe, all because I took you to task on your predictability? We can add "thin-skinned" to your resume'...

Nothing you say threatens me, on this topic or on any other. I'm secure about my position in life....I suggest you focus on cleaning up your own front porch before you condemn mine. As for your comment on "reason vs. religion," why do you think there has to be a battle? Usually when one is unsure of their "facts" they want to fight...looks like what you're doing here, frankly.

I'll leave you with a couple of interesting links, although I think you need to be a little more free-thinking and approachable to grasp them.

http://www.halos.com/

http://www.everystudent.com/features/isthere.html?gclid=CNGG0aHfjp8CFRJinAodZjFUJA

Disclaimer: I am NOT trying to convert you or anyone else...you make your own decisions in this life as do we all. Your lashing out is offensive, but I'm sure that's how you deal with your fear. That's YOUR problem and YOUR problem alone. If you're good with that, good for you. I'm not surprised on whit.

kg

dnf777
01-05-2010, 10:49 PM
dnf, your fear is showing....;-)
No fear. Just good discussion.

You know NOTHING of my beliefs, and I sure haven't posted them on this thread. Weren't you the one crying on another thread about being pigeonholed about what you believe, yet you can slam what you think I believe, all because I took you to task on your predictability? We can add "thin-skinned" to your resume'...
Don't know where your "thin-skinned" accusation comes from, other than throwing everything against the wall, and see if any of it sticks. It hasn't.
I don't claim to know what you believe. I commented on the narrow beliefs (whatever they may be) that do not allow for other's beliefs, such as scientific explanation. As for being predictable, I would hope you figured out that I'm a creature of reason and analysis rather than blind faith by now!

Nothing you say threatens me, on this topic or on any other. I'm secure about my position in life....I suggest you focus on cleaning up your own front porch before you condemn mine. As for your comment on "reason vs. religion," why do you think there has to be a battle? That's MY point exactly. I don't think there is. I believe in God, and I believe he created this incredible world I'm trying to understand through observation, not the Bible. The Bible (in my opinion) is good for spriritual guidance, not scientific discovery and star gazing. The Bible deals with whats inside of us, science deals with what in the world, outside of us.Usually when one is unsure of their "facts" they want to fight...looks like what you're doing here, frankly. Quite the opposite. Some are just looking for fights so badly, they see them everywhere, when in fact there is often agreement.

I'll leave you with a couple of interesting links, although I think you need to be a little more free-thinking and approachable to grasp them.

http://www.halos.com/

http://www.everystudent.com/features/isthere.html?gclid=CNGG0aHfjp8CFRJinAodZjFUJA

Disclaimer: I am NOT trying to convert you or anyone else...you make your own decisions in this life as do we all. Your lashing out is offensive, but I'm sure that's how you deal with your fear. That's YOUR problem and YOUR problem alone. If you're good with that, good for you. I'm not surprised on whit.
Again, no idea where your fear references come from. It ain't stickin'! I don't see you as trying to convert me or anyone else here. Just see you looking to scrap over this, which is fine...like I've said many times, I enjoy a spirited debate as much as the next guy.:D

kg

Franco lobbed a meatball, I just took a swing. If I were scared, I wouldn't even come here. I'm more afraid of the 3+ feet of snow and whats piling up on my porch. Poor pup can't keep his head above the snow w/o hopping like a gazelle. :(

subroc
01-06-2010, 05:47 AM
Franco lobbed a meatball, I just took a swing.

It is only a meatball if you are looking for any opportunity to bring anti religion rhetoric and sarcasm into any discussion in a malicious way. It just illustrates you have malice in your heart.

subroc
01-06-2010, 05:53 AM
The new James Webb telescope costing 4.5 billion dollars and launching in 4 years will be able to take us to the beginning of time!:cool:

One has to wonder if it will, and what the begining of time really means.

dnf777
01-06-2010, 05:57 AM
It is only a meatball if you are looking for any opportunity to bring anti religion rhetoric and sarcasm into any discussion in a malicious way. It just illustrates you have malice in your heart.

Please pray for me then. I'm praying for you.
I'm praying for thicker skin for you, if you think some mild little sarcasm in response to a little sarcasm is "malice"! :D

Sugar and spice and everything nice regards....

YardleyLabs
01-06-2010, 06:04 AM
It is only a meatball if you are looking for any opportunity to bring anti religion rhetoric and sarcasm into any discussion in a malicious way. It just illustrates you have malice in your heart.
Since when are posts on POTUS intended for any purpose other than to make a point about something known to stimulate controversy?

A sampling of threads that you have started recently (not to suggest my own similar list would be less provocative), each bringing anti-liberal rhetoric in a malicious way and designed to stimulate more of the same:


end of global warming causing serious problems
o-bow-ma
obama and the enemy camp
Vice President Dick Cheney A great American
It appears the bloom is off the rose...
Is Global Warming Over?
approval rating
Bob Dylan
example of media bias at the NY Times
Who Caused The Housing Bubble - A Report
global warming

subroc
01-06-2010, 06:36 AM
Dave, no need to pray for me...really, I am not a religious man.

I expect this post was intended to be a discussion of the Hubble telescope. That was my intent in my response. Your off topic, uninvited attack on those who practice religion is malicious.

BTW, I believe, as far as the space program goes, the telescope programs probably give us the most bang for the buck.

Franco
01-06-2010, 07:37 AM
The intent of this thread is about the news story itself.

Since the launch of Hubble, man has learned more facts about earth's and the universe's origins than all the time preceeding Hubble's launch.

After googling James Webb telescope, that investment will teach us even more about the universe as it peeps even deeper into our past.

I think we live in very exciting times and would hope that most would look at these new discoveries with an open mind.

dnf777
01-06-2010, 09:37 AM
Dave, no need to pray for me...really, I am not a religious man.

I expect this post was intended to be a discussion of the Hubble telescope. That was my intent in my response. Your off topic, uninvited attack on those who practice religion is malicious.

BTW, I believe, as far as the space program goes, the telescope programs probably give us the most bang for the buck.

I believe Franco if he says he posted the story at face value. I have no reason to doubt him. However, afte being attacked and called a godless liberal, and people feeling "sorry for my kids" etc....I felt just fine pointing out the controversy involved. After all, this is POTUS, not the astronomy room, right? Don't be so surprised if politics enters a discussion here! If you check the old threads on earth ages, you'll see any non-conservative Christians took a real thumping when suggesting the earth is 6 billion years old. Or is it five? Who's counting candles anymore.

BTW, I'm not really praying for you. I save my prayers for when I'm really in deep dung, like all fair weather Catholics! :D

Have a good one,
dave

dnf777
01-06-2010, 09:40 AM
The intent of this thread is about the news story itself.

Since the launch of Hubble, man has learned more facts about earth's and the universe's origins than all the time preceeding Hubble's launch.

After googling James Webb telescope, that investment will teach us even more about the universe as it peeps even deeper into our past.

I think we live in very exciting times and would hope that most would look at these new discoveries with an open mind.

Franco, all political jabs aside, I find that article fascinating. I'm not sure what the practical application of much of theoretical astrophysics is, but it is fascinating and mind-boggling, nonetheless. For a really fun time, all you need is a starry night, a cheap telescope, a 12-pak and several cans of beenie-weenies. It's a humbling experience.

Franco
01-06-2010, 09:47 AM
I believe Franco if he says he posted the story at face value. I have no reason to doubt him. However, afte being attacked and called a godless liberal, and people feeling "sorry for my kids" etc....I felt just fine pointing out the controversy involved. After all, this is POTUS, not the astronomy room, right? Don't be so surprised if politics enters a discussion here! If you check the old threads on earth ages, you'll see any non-conservative Christians took a real thumping when suggesting the earth is 6 billion years old. Or is it five? Who's counting candles anymore.

BTW, I'm not really praying for you. I save my prayers for when I'm really in deep dung, like all fair weather Catholics! :D

Have a good one,
dave

Earth is 4.5 billion years old and the first signs of life appeared 3.5 billion years ago.

We've had some religious discussions here but I did try to avoid it this time because folks will believe what they want to. I guess it is impossible to talk about discoveries concerning the universe without someone bring up Noah's Ark.;-)

dnf777
01-06-2010, 12:04 PM
Earth is 4.5 billion years old and the first signs of life appeared 3.5 billion years ago.

I recently read Steven Hawking's "Brief History of Time" and it really messes with your mind! Just when you think some of the stuff he's saying is far flung and only in the realm of academic chalkboards, you go outside and look at the stars and realize its all right before you. That the small pinpoint of light coming from a star is thousands to millions of years old by the time it hits our eyes.

Even the most advanced science, in my mind, NO WAY refutes the existence of God. If anything, the more we know, the more wonder there is, and the more firmly I believe in the Creator.

K G
01-06-2010, 12:13 PM
I recently read Steven Hawking's "Brief History of Time" and it really messes with your mind! Just when you think some of the stuff he's saying is far flung and only in the realm of academic chalkboards, you go outside and look at the stars and realize its all right before you. That the small pinpoint of light coming from a star is thousands to millions of years old by the time it hits our eyes.

Even the most advanced science, in my mind, NO WAY refutes the existence of God. If anything, the more we know, the more wonder there is, and the more firmly I believe in the Creator.

You and I have more in common than you thought.....;-)

kg

Franco
01-06-2010, 12:54 PM
Even the most advanced science, in my mind, NO WAY refutes the existence of God. If anything, the more we know, the more wonder there is, and the more firmly I believe in the Creator.



Getting all warm and fuzzy are we?;-) Maybe the easier thing to believe in?

Like I've stated before, I too believe in a higher power. That higher power being more energy than spiritual.

david gibson
01-06-2010, 01:01 PM
so how old is the earth then? i hear varying numbers from creationists - some a strict interpretation of the old testament, others find a way to interpret differently to fit science better. curious as to what you guys think......

Bayou Magic
01-06-2010, 02:02 PM
...

Even the most advanced science, in my mind, NO WAY refutes the existence of God. If anything, the more we know, the more wonder there is, and the more firmly I believe in the Creator.

Well just damn it to hell then! We actually agree on something.

fp

dnf777
01-06-2010, 02:17 PM
Well just damn it to hell then! We actually agree on something.

fp

Me, you, KG, and Franco agreeing??? THAT is worthy of a Steven Hawking book explaining mysteries of the universe itself! Or a cold beer. I'm opting for the latter at this point.

Have a good one,
dave

Franco
01-06-2010, 02:33 PM
so how old is the earth then?



4.5 billion years old. First signs of life, 3.5 billion years ago.

What we've learned from Hubble was also backed up when rocks found after a volcano erruption were dated and found to be 4.5 billion years old.

david gibson
01-06-2010, 02:50 PM
4.5 billion years old. First signs of life, 3.5 billion years ago.

What we've learned from Hubble was also backed up when rocks found after a volcano erruption were dated and found to be 4.5 billion years old.

i am asking the creationists only here.......

how old do you believe the earth is?

Terry Britton
01-06-2010, 04:46 PM
so how old is the earth then? i hear varying numbers from creationists - some a strict interpretation of the old testament, others find a way to interpret differently to fit science better. curious as to what you guys think......

If you studied Modern Physics, you will know the time will change varying on your position relative to the one creating Earth. If God was moving around at or above speed of light while creating Earth, his one day may be many many millions of years compared to the observer sitting stationary on the Moon watching.

david gibson
01-06-2010, 08:32 PM
If you studied Modern Physics, you will know the time will change varying on your position relative to the one creating Earth. If God was moving around at or above speed of light while creating Earth, his one day may be many many millions of years compared to the observer sitting stationary on the Moon watching.

ohhhh, i get it. so God moved at the speed of light, and the guys that wrote the old testament understood that, added in the calculations and voila, now we can convert the 7 days and 10,000 yrs or so and magically make that mesh with the 4.54 billion years of earths actual age and the 13.7 billion years of the age of the universe. very convenient way to admit that the earth is 4.54 billion years old - but, many other fundamentalist creationists still reject your theory. arent there several here that refute that any rock on earth could be a million years old?? or 200 million? and that the grand canyon is proof of the great flood??

very creative - but thats an invented version of your religion. true fundamentalists stick with the 7,000 or 10,000 yrs, whatever it is, regardless of time-space continuum. so who is right?

look at all those galaxies!!! billions and billions!!! and each has billions and even multitudes of trillions of stars!! thats billions upon billions of opportunities for other terrestrial life on a planet associated with those stars.....

why bother....creationists just keep inventing things to mesh the two trains of thought to "prove" they are right.......


teach real science in schools, creation in your own home and/or church. simple.

K G
01-06-2010, 10:19 PM
Thanks for confirming what I thought was the purpose of your post #27, David.

kg

K.Bullock
01-06-2010, 10:24 PM
so how old is the earth then? i hear varying numbers from creationists - some a strict interpretation of the old testament, others find a way to interpret differently to fit science better. curious as to what you guys think......

No your not. Your interested in what fundamentalist strawmen believe, and I am not sure you know what your talking about when you say "fundamentalist".

...that's what I believe, since your so "curious" about what creationists believe.:rolleyes:

david gibson
01-06-2010, 10:36 PM
No your not. Your interested in what fundamentalist strawmen believe, and I am not sure you know what your talking about when you say "fundamentalist".

...that's what I believe, since your so "curious" about what creationists believe.:rolleyes:

nope..i am pretty sure i got it.. ;-)

pretty simple, either you believe in Genesis as written, or you dont. and if you dont, you are making your own religion fit your own beliefs or at least to explain the weaknesses you see in what you have been told to believe all your life.

i can roll my eyes too.... :rolleyes:

K.Bullock
01-06-2010, 11:28 PM
pretty simple, either you believe in Genesis as written, or you dont.
could you unpack this for me a little?


and if you don't, you are making your own religion fit your own beliefs How so?



or at least to explain the weaknesses you see in what you have been told to believe all your life. And what is it that I have been taught all my life?


...see, that's the problem with straw man arguments.


i can roll my eyes too.... :rolleyes: Well done!.