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david gibson
03-25-2010, 07:32 AM
unbelievable. In an interview with John McCain she averred that the use of terms such as "battleground state" incites the masses to take up arms and start a real firefight. for real?? that is a term that has been around in politics forever and has no reference to the term in the literal sense.

same with the terms "kill the bill or face a november slaughter" - she actually takes that literally as well. McCain laughed it off as absurd - as well it is. she really asked if those are terms we should be using in such a divisive debate. huh?

Also taking issue with Sarah Palin saying "dont retreat, reload". jeeeeeeeezus that has been around as well, she is not telling people to reload guns, we all know that is a metaphor to rejuvenating your argument and defense for whatever issue you are facing.

liberals and political correctness have gone madder and madder.

McCain and Boehner both have denounced the threats of violence, but holy cow, when you do what the Dems did to get this bill passed, all the BS that has gone on what do they expect? red carpet treatment?

dnf777
03-25-2010, 08:00 AM
unbelievable. In an interview with John McCain she averred that the use of terms such as "battleground state" incites the masses to take up arms and start a real firefight. for real?? that is a term that has been around in politics forever and has no reference to the term in the literal sense.

same with the terms "kill the bill or face a november slaughter" - she actually takes that literally as well. McCain laughed it off as absurd - as well it is. she really asked if those are terms we should be using in such a divisive debate. huh?

Also taking issue with Sarah Palin saying "dont retreat, reload". jeeeeeeeezus that has been around as well, she is not telling people to reload guns, we all know that is a metaphor to rejuvenating your argument and defense for whatever issue you are facing.

liberals and political correctness have gone madder and madder.

McCain and Boehner both have denounced the threats of violence, but holy cow, when you do what the Dems did to get this bill passed, all the BS that has gone on what do they expect? red carpet treatment?

both sides will cherry-pick egregious examples of the oppositions rhetoric and try to paint broadly with them. It would be just as easy to highlight the people yelling N----r!, baby-killer, etc...or people who fly airplanes into offices or shoot up buildings......but I won't.

As some point, especially when we know that there are some out there who WILL act on such rhetoric, we need to tone down the violence. As I heard one democrat say, "we've had 50 'isolated incidents' this past week!"

road kill
03-25-2010, 08:23 AM
No one seemed this offended when Sarah Palin was being ATTACKED!!??!!??


rk

david gibson
03-25-2010, 08:23 AM
both sides will cherry-pick egregious examples of the oppositions rhetoric and try to paint broadly with them. It would be just as easy to highlight the people yelling N----r!, baby-killer, etc...or people who fly airplanes into offices or shoot up buildings......but I won't.

As some point, especially when we know that there are some out there who WILL act on such rhetoric, we need to tone down the violence. As I heard one democrat say, "we've had 50 'isolated incidents' this past week!"

no one has said otherwise. but where are the confirmed "N----r" and spitting incidents?? not saying they are fabrications, but until you prove all of it then any of it is just as likely to be chicago style politics with plants or made up stories. these are well known to be used by this group - rohm "dead fish" emanual is the king of it.

but come on - "battleground states" and "don't retreat, reload" as inciting violence ....really?

i am wearing my "eagle crapping on obama" shirt out as much as possible this week!

when you act like the dems did they have to expect some backlash.

Hew
03-25-2010, 08:31 AM
no one has said otherwise. but where are the confirmed "N----r" and spitting incidents?? not saying they are fabrications, but until you prove all of it then any of it is just as likely to be chicago style politics with plants or made up stories. these are well known to be used by this group - rohm "dead fish" emanual is the king of it.
Yeah, I'd like to see/hear some video/audio of that. Last campaign there was much ado about somebody supposedly yelling "kill him!" when Obama's name was mentioned at a McCain rally and it turned out to be an absolute fabrication by the reporter.

Franco
03-25-2010, 08:36 AM
Some appropriate Thomas Jefferson quotes;



The will of the people is the only legitimate foundation of any government, and to protect its free expression should be our first object. (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/8448.html)

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/5157.html)

A little rebellion now and then...is a medicine necessary for the sound health of government. (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/20994.html)

Whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends [life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness] it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government... (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/20991.html)

I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them. (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/31399.html)

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/35961.html)

Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have ... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases. (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/38765.html)

Question with boldness even the existance of a god; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear. (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/36540.html)

dnf777
03-25-2010, 08:36 AM
[QUOTE=david gibson;589505]no one has said otherwise. but where are the confirmed "N----r" and spitting incidents?? not saying they are fabrications, but until you prove all of it then any of it is just as likely to be chicago style politics with plants or made up stories. these are well known to be used by this group - rohm "dead fish" emanual is the king of it.

but come on - "battleground states" and "don't retreat, reload" as inciting violence ....really?

I have no problem with those colloquialiasms.

As for "proof", most of the time someone comes forward and admits yelling, but that it was taken out of context. ("you're a liar", "babykiller") In this particular case, Rep. John Lewis said he heard someone yell at him. He has been an honorable man, and I accept his word on this. That's enough "proof" for me.

Buzz
03-25-2010, 08:48 AM
I imagine until those who vandalized Democrat offices are apprehended and convicted in court, there is no proof that any of this is just coincidence.:confused:

road kill
03-25-2010, 08:54 AM
Yeah, I agree.
I'd like to see some of the vandals of the Republican offices and vehicles from the last Presidential campaign addressed.

Oh, and that inconvenient little issue of the Black Panthers (armed) at the polling places.
Video recorded BTW.

But that's different, ain't it.




rk

david gibson
03-25-2010, 09:04 AM
Yeah, I agree.
I'd like to see some of the vandals of the Republican offices and vehicles from the last Presidential campaign addressed.

Oh, and that inconvenient little issue of the Black Panthers (armed) at the polling places.
Video recorded BTW.

But that's different, ain't it.

rk

That was absolutely the worst ever. the dems can claim all they want with tit-for-tat comments like "reps did it too" etc etc - but that was absolutely over the top and nothing even close has ever been substantiated on reps.

on tape, and obama apparently told holder to just to let it slide........

that one incident is so indicative, i would love to see obama questioned on it directly without his teleprompter.

YardleyLabs
03-25-2010, 11:34 AM
Some appropriate Thomas Jefferson quotes;
...

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/5157.html)

In context (11/13/1787 Letter to William Stephens Smith)

"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. ... What country before ever existed a century and half without a rebellion? And what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure.



A little rebellion now and then...is a medicine necessary for the sound health of government. (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/20994.html)

In context (Also concerning the Shay's rebellion)

"I hold it that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical. Unsuccessful rebellions, indeed, generally establish the encroachments on the rights of the people which have produced them. An observation of this truth should render honest republican governors so mild in their punishment of rebellions as not to discourage them too much. It is a medicine necessary for the sound health of government." A few things were left out in the middle.



Whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends [life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness] it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government... (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/20991.html)

In context (The Declaration of Independence):
The primary right being upheld by Jefferson and our forefathers was "to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed." That is, the primary fault og the King was in ignoring the democratically expressed will of the colonies as expressed by the legislatures and in excluding the colonies from representation in the legislative and decision making process. Thr right of rebellion rested not with a person, but with the unrepresented people collectively. However, when individuals with democratically elected representation choose to rebel based on disagreements with the decisions made by their duly elected representatives, that wold fall under the Constitution's definition of treason. Jefferson, as evidenced in the earlier quotes would concur with the government putting down such an insurrection but also encourage "mild" treatment of the insurrectionists (or those practicing civil disobedience through things like, say anti war protests or gay liberation demonstrations:rolleyes:) since such actions become a vehicle for minorities to express their dissatisfaction with the direction of the government.



...
The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/35961.html)

This is not a quote from Jefferson at all and seems to have first appeared in print in 1986.

[quote=Franco;589517]
Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have ... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases. (http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/38765.html)[/quote
This is not an actual quote from Jefferson and appears to have first appeared in print in 1976.

The Jefferson Encyclopedia (http://wiki.monticello.org/) allows you to look up quotes attributed to Jefferson to find either their exact source or the fact that they do not actually appear in his writings. Many of the supposed Jefferson quotes, including many of the most cited ones on conservative logs, are relatively recent inventions.

YardleyLabs
03-25-2010, 11:42 AM
Yeah, I agree.
I'd like to see some of the vandals of the Republican offices and vehicles from the last Presidential campaign addressed.

Oh, and that inconvenient little issue of the Black Panthers (armed) at the polling places.
Video recorded BTW.

But that's different, ain't it.




rk
Did you go back and watch the video of the one place where this happened? It happened in one polling place in Philadelphia and carried less meat on the bones than the guys openly carrying (legal) automatic weapons to an Obama rally in Nevada. No one was hassled trying to enter the polling place. The guys who felt "intimidated" were white Republican campaign staff trying to enter the polling place in a group and the questions asked of them concerned whether the staff were actually trying to scare voters away in a district that is almost exclusively black. It seemed like a pretty legitimate question to me. The illegitimate part was that one of the guys was carrying a police stick which would have been legal if concealed but was illegal when held openly. It is normal in PA to have people standing near the doors of each voting station "greeting" each voter in a not very subtle effort to influence votes.

duckheads
03-25-2010, 12:10 PM
Here is a good youtube vid that does not support the BS claim.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3dOdniifqo&feature=youtube_gdata (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3dOdniifqo&feature=youtube_gdata)

david gibson
03-25-2010, 12:18 PM
Did you go back and watch the video of the one place where this happened? It happened in one polling place in Philadelphia and carried less meat on the bones than the guys openly carrying (legal) automatic weapons to an Obama rally in Nevada. No one was hassled trying to enter the polling place. The guys who felt "intimidated" were white Republican campaign staff trying to enter the polling place in a group and the questions asked of them concerned whether the staff were actually trying to scare voters away in a district that is almost exclusively black. It seemed like a pretty legitimate question to me. The illegitimate part was that one of the guys was carrying a police stick which would have been legal if concealed but was illegal when held openly. It is normal in PA to have people standing near the doors of each voting station "greeting" each voter in a not very subtle effort to influence votes.


you would defend new black panther thugs. no surprise there.

Buzz
03-25-2010, 12:50 PM
Here is a good youtube vid that does not support the BS claim.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3dOdniifqo&feature=youtube_gdata (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3dOdniifqo&feature=youtube_gdata)

That wasn't James Clyburn, it was John Lewis.