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M&K's Retrievers
03-26-2010, 11:51 AM
What gives with this classless act? I thought Netenyahu was a friend. Guess not. He is probably the only one that will take of Iran so let's be sure and piss him off while apologizing to everyone else.

subroc
03-26-2010, 11:59 AM
I guess obama has a different idea of who our allies are. He bows to our enimies and gives CDs to our friend. castro compliments him and he snubs netenyahu.

Henry V
03-26-2010, 01:01 PM
You should be a bit more specific on what you view as a "snub".

Are you talking about these items?
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/03/25/president-allegedly-dumps-israeli-prime-minister-dinner/

http://thelastcrusade.org/2010/03/26/obama-snubs-israel%E2%80%99s-prime-minister/

In review of recent events the Obama administrations interactions with Israel this week seem appropriate to me. Did you expect that they should be rewarded for their bad behavior regarding settlements and peace talks?
From the FOX piece
After failing to extract a written promise of concessions on settlements, Obama walked out of his meeting with Netanyahu but invited him to stay at the White House, consult with advisers and “let me know if there is anything new”, a U.S. congressman, who spoke to the Prime Minister, said.
and
He (Netanyahu) returned to Israel yesterday isolated after what Israeli media have called a White House ambush for which he is largely to blame.

Maybe next time he should just bow for the photo op, would that make you feel better.;)

YardleyLabs
03-26-2010, 01:48 PM
You should be a bit more specific on what you view as a "snub".

Are you talking about these items?
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/03/25/president-allegedly-dumps-israeli-prime-minister-dinner/

http://thelastcrusade.org/2010/03/26/obama-snubs-israel%E2%80%99s-prime-minister/

In review of recent events the Obama administrations interactions with Israel this week seem appropriate to me. Did you expect that they should be rewarded for their bad behavior regarding settlements and peace talks?
From the FOX piece
and

Maybe next time he should just bow for the photo op, would that make you feel better.;)
Sometimes a diplomatic snub is called for. Based on Netanyahu's decisions to announce new settlements timed to coincide with Biden's visits and his meeting with the President -- both deliberately provocative acts -- a snub is definitely called for. World War I provided ample lessons concerning the fate of a major world power that allows its policies to be dictated by another, smaller country with an independent agenda. While I am a strong supporter of Israel, I am not a strong supporter of the current government's "strategy" for dealing with Palestinian's and of undermining all negotiations toward a two state solution. Netanyahu is not strong enough to take a negotiating position opposed by the most right wing elements of his coalition. Rather than try, I think he has decided to scuttle any peace efforts, accelerate settlements, and hope for a more sympathetic US administration in the future. I think the current administration has to push back harder than it has done so far.

Cody Covey
03-26-2010, 03:32 PM
how much land does Israel have to give up before it is enough for the Palestinians? Also not sure what peace agreements you're talking about unless you mean the ones where the palestinians get more land and peace agreements then come and ambush Israel with missiles and gun fire. I think Israel has put up with enough.

YardleyLabs
03-26-2010, 04:01 PM
how much land does Israel have to give up before it is enough for the Palestinians? Also not sure what peace agreements you're talking about unless you mean the ones where the palestinians get more land and peace agreements then come and ambush Israel with missiles and gun fire. I think Israel has put up with enough.
Israel had previously agreed to the Roadmap to Peace put forward by Bush. That called for halting the development of settlements in the occupied territories pending the outcome of negotiations concerning frontiers for a two state solution. Instead, under Netanyahu, Israel has accelerated settlements and forced relocations. Quite frankly, had Israel annexed all the territiories that it captured in 1967 and 1973 and granted full citizenship rights to the residents, I would have no problem. However, an apartheid approach where the residents of those lands are considered "temporary" with no rights of citizenship and limited protection for their property rights has no place in a democratic society. If that is the path that Israel elects to follow, I do not believe that the US can allow itself to be cast in the role of enabler. I say that as an unapologetic Zionist who has heard Syrian shells fired from the Golan Heights fly overhead to land in nearby kibbutzim. Much of Israel's population would be happy to give up the settlements in exchange for peace. However, Netanyahu takes his lead from the most rabid parts of the right wing. Netanyahu has tried to cast this as strictly an issue about Jerusalem. However, the settlements involved, as I understand it, extend into the suburbs of Jerusalem. Even without that, however, Israel had previously agreed not to settle East Jerusalem pending the outcome of negotiations.

road kill
03-26-2010, 04:04 PM
Israel had previously agreed to the Roadmap to Peace put forward by Bush. That called for halting the development of settlements in the occupied territories pending the outcome of negotiations concerning frontiers for a two state solution. Instead, under Netanyahu, Israel has accelerated settlements and forced relocations. Quite frankly, had Israel annexed all the territiories that it captured in 1967 and 1973 and granted full citizenship rights to the residents, I would have no problem. However, an apartheid approach where the residents of those lands are considered "temporary" with no rights of citizenship and limited protection for their property rights has no place in a democratic society. If that is the path that Israel elects to follow, I do not believe that the US can allow itself to be cast in the role of enabler. I say that as an unapologetic Zionist who has heard Syrian shells fired from the Golan Heights fly overhead to land in nearby kibbutzim. Much of Israel's population would be happy to give up the settlements in exchange for peace. However, Netanyahu takes his lead from the most rabid parts of the right wing. Netanyahu has tried to cast this as strictly an issue about Jerusalem. However, the settlements involved, as I understand it, extend into the suburbs of Jerusalem. Even without that, however, Israel had previously agreed not to settle East Jerusalem pending the outcome of negotiations.

Iran agreed to NOT pursue nukes......GAME CHANGER!!!



rk

YardleyLabs
03-26-2010, 04:08 PM
Iran agreed to NOT pursue nukes......GAME CHANGER!!!



rk
Iran's got nothing to do with the occupied lands and their activites provide all the more reason to reach a settlement of the occupation. There are no solutions for the Middle East that do not require some fundamentally equitable solution of the Palestinian situation. That war will never fade away.

road kill
03-26-2010, 04:13 PM
Iran's got nothing to do with the occupied lands and their activites provide all the more reason to reach a settlement of the occupation. There are no solutions for the Middle East that do not require some fundamentally equitable solution of the Palestinian situation. That war will never fade away.

Yes, Iran does have something to do with this situation and for you to suggest otherwise is disingenious.
But you give Iran a pass, and whine about Israel, stay in lock step!!:D




rk

dnf777
03-26-2010, 04:25 PM
Would anyone else agree that this might be a time for a former president, namely the one who most recently brokered a peace accord in Israel, to be named special envoy to help resolve this violation of said accord? I was going to get a jab in at him (hard to resist) but he may actually be able to help in this situation. Just no massages or talk about a pig roast this time. Couldn't resist just one.

Koolaid
03-26-2010, 04:25 PM
how much land does Israel have to give up before it is enough for the Palestinians? Also not sure what peace agreements you're talking about unless you mean the ones where the palestinians get more land and peace agreements then come and ambush Israel with missiles and gun fire. I think Israel has put up with enough.


This one makes me laugh. How much land does Israel have to give up? How much land did the Palestinians give up in the first place?

I honestly never see that situation working out. It was a great idea almost a century ago to try and give the Jewish people a homeland, but surely someone saw that sticking a Jewish state in the middle of Muslim land was going to cause problems...the kind of problems that don't end until one side or the other is dead.

It may be sad to say, but if you want to put an end to terrorism and the hate for the western world that spews out of the middle east, you have to pull out of that place completely. Iraq, Afghanistan, Isreal, etc...

"Israel has put up with enough"? Many times they are the aggressor. Many times their retaliation goes way to far. You're basically looking at a first class military against ak47s and IEDs.

I realize that there is some sort of attachment to Israel, but you are dealing with group of people who's only method of fighting are small "terrorist" attacks. If you were on the other side, terror very quickly changes to liberation. I don't defend their actions, but too often people seem to just blindly side with Israel as if they are infallible and anything they do is clearly a good thing.


I'm no real expert on Israel, just a couple of history based books...what is the current attachment to Israel based in. I recently read an article that tried to base it on the fact that Jerusalem is the Holy Land and that the so called second coming of Jesus was going to be a Jew in the Holy Land.

BonMallari
03-26-2010, 04:53 PM
why are we so surprised about BHO view of Israel....he get his errand gal Hillary to do some pseudo tough talk, but Netanyahu and the world knows she has no power in this administration...BHO has never shown much support of Israel and they were prepared for the snub or lack of support

YardleyLabs
03-26-2010, 05:20 PM
I remember, as do all Israelis, when every surrounding nation was committed to making the Mediterranean run red with the blood of Jews. 1948 was a final gift of British colonialism. The land under dispute had not existed as a separate nation for centuries. The countries that are there now were largely created by partitioning the lands captured from the Ottoman Empire by the British. In 1919, the British promised that one of those partitions would become a Jewish state. From an historical perspective, the Arabs had no more claim on that land than the Jews. It had actually been controlled by the Turks for 600 years.

Based on the Balfour Declaration, Jews from around the world purchased land in what would become Israel. They began forming settlements in anticipation of that partition. However, in the lead up, fighting and settlement of WWII, the British began to renege of that promise in efforts to court Arabs. As it became messy, the issue was turned over to the UN which authorized the creation of Israel from a small portion of the Ottoman territories. Other parts became Jordan, Iran, Iraq, etc. The bloodshed began immediately and Israel fought successfully to survive.

The situation actually improved over time until the lead up to the 1967 war. The Arab nations decided they could win with a concerted attack. They were wrong and Israel captured lands that had been used to threaten its existence: the Golan Heights and the west bank. It also captured East Jerusalem, a territory that had been hard fought in 1948 before it was captured by the Palestinians, and the Gaza territories, which had little use other than as a buffer against Egypt. In 1973, Egypt and the Arab nations tried again and were thoroughly beaten, but not without moments when it was not clear if Israel would survive.

Israel held back in both wars at the request of the US which feared the implications of a total victory. From a strategic perspective, Israel can never give up the Golan Heights or the west bank without a firm peace deal in place.

The reason is obvious from a map. The Golan Heights overlook all of northern Israel. Take away the west bank, and the center strip of Israel is only a few miles wide, making it easy for the country to be cut in two. However, military considerations aside, those areas were occupied by regular people. Israel did not want to give those people citizenship for fear that it would upset the political balance of the country by increasing the number of Palestinian citizens. They could not expel them from the lands without being guilty of crimes against humanity. This conundrum has remained for 40 years eating the heart of Israel like a cancer. The driving force pushing for expansion of an apartheid "solution" has come from the most extreme factions of the religious right. However, the policy has only been successful because we have done nothing to stop it.

While I believe we should continue to guarantee Israel's security, I believe that there should also be a direct correlation between the level of support we provide and the extent to which Israel works as an active partner for peace. Today it is failing in that role and our support should be reduced.

Goose
03-26-2010, 05:59 PM
Why is anybody surprised at this 'snub'? Our President was born and raised in Kenya where anti-semitism is sport. And if you're still confused go talk to his spiritual mentor, the most wonderful Reverend Jeremiah "them jews ain't going to let him talk to me" Wright.

This isn't hard to understand. His middle name is Hussein!!

We live in Cuba now.

Pete
03-26-2010, 07:20 PM
[QUOTE]n review of recent events the Obama administrations interactions with Israel this week seem appropriate to me. Did you expect that they should be rewarded for their bad behavior regarding settlements and peace talks?
From the FOX piec/QUOTE]

So you are in the same boat. You also think Isreal should not be allowed to build new houses in there own country. would you make sure a photo op does not take place with a jew because it will piss off your muslim buddies. And he is single handedly alienated our allies while getting on his knee's for Chavez,castro,abedinjehied ect ect. The son of a bitch is a socialistic ,,commy sympathizing traitor. And those who agree with him are too. And deserve a one way ticket to somewhere they feel at home

Sorry don't have a link for that

p

YardleyLabs
03-26-2010, 07:26 PM
[quote]n review of recent events the Obama administrations interactions with Israel this week seem appropriate to me. Did you expect that they should be rewarded for their bad behavior regarding settlements and peace talks?
From the FOX piec/QUOTE]

So you are in the same boat. You also think Isreal should not be allowed to build new houses in there own country. would you make sure a photo op does not take place with a jew because it will piss off your muslim buddies. And he is single handedly alienated our allies while getting on his knee's for Chavez,castro,abedinjehied ect ect. The son of a bitch is a socialistic ,,commy sympathizing traitor. And those who agree with him are too. And deserve a one way ticket to somewhere they feel at home

Sorry don't have a link for that

p
Pete,

It's part of Israel, why are the people that lived there before and still live there now not afforded the rights of citizenship and protection of property?

Pete
03-26-2010, 09:08 PM
Jeff
If mexico was trying to take over texas OH sorry they already have,,, OK if mexico was lobbing missiles in Texas do you think theres a Texan living that would put up with that.
Besides the heathan bass turds stole it first:)

Pete

cotts135
03-27-2010, 07:24 AM
Why is anybody surprised at this 'snub'? Our President was born and raised in Kenya where anti-semitism is sport. And if you're still confused go talk to his spiritual mentor, the most wonderful Reverend Jeremiah "them jews ain't going to let him talk to me" Wright.

This isn't hard to understand. His middle name is Hussein!!

We live in Cuba now.

Born and raised in Kenya......................hmmmmmmmmm. Since you have demonstrated that facts have no relevancy or meaning in your writings do you suppose that in the future you could post some kind of evidence that supports your position?
Put down your World Net Daily or National Enquirer or whatever else your reading and at least be somewhat critical of what your ingesting.

Pete
03-27-2010, 09:10 AM
[QUOTE]Born and raised in Kenya./QUOTE]

He never showed any one proof that he wasn't, and wasn't his brother born there.
The guy proves every day now on a continual basis what a F....snake in the grass he is. Setting Policy aside. Add all this stuff in and you have a really black hearted individual. A master of deception.
And you guys can't stop stroking him. Its like your charmed by the snake.

I'm listening to him tout his rev right serman crap ,,you know with all the holy roller hoopla and dancing across the stage,,, On his addresses on the radio.
Since when does a president talk this way. Do we have a religious nut also to deal with.

We are in deep KAKA

WOW

Pete

Koolaid
03-27-2010, 09:31 AM
Personally I want to see a video of his infant head crowning and then the camera turns to a window and outside you can see Hawaii.:rolleyes:

YardleyLabs
03-27-2010, 09:32 AM
[quote]Born and raised in Kenya./QUOTE]

He never showed any one proof that he wasn't, and wasn't his brother born there.
The guy proves every day now on a continual basis what a F....snake in the grass he is. Setting Policy aside. Add all this stuff in and you have a really black hearted individual. A master of deception.
And you guys can't stop stroking him. Its like your charmed by the snake.

I'm listening to him tout his rev right serman crap ,,you know with all the holy roller hoopla and dancing across the stage,,, On his addresses on the radio.
Since when does a president talk this way. Do we have a religious nut also to deal with.

We are in deep KAKA

WOW

Pete
Pete,

I heard you were born on a canoe on the Amazon with an anaconda snake as the midwife. Can you provide proof to the contrary?:rolleyes: The "brother" you are talking about is a half brother born after Obama's father abandoned his US family and returned to live in Kenya when Obama was two. Obama's mother obtained a divorce and remarried an Indonesian. None of that affects the fact that Obama was born in Hawaii, after Hawaii became a state, has a birth certificate to prove it that has been reviewed twice in court and attested to by all appropriate officials from the state, and a birth that was announced in a newspaper in Hawaii immediately following his birth. Copies of that announcement have been widely reproduced and unchallenged. The "birther" argument at this point has descended into an argument that he has a funny last name and a father who was African and therefore ha cannot be American. Oddly enough, our laws are very simple. If you are born in this country, nothing else matters. You are an American unless and until you formally renounce your citizenship.

M&K's Retrievers
03-27-2010, 10:33 AM
[QUOTE=YardleyLabs;590730..... You are an American unless and until you formally renounce your citizenship.[/QUOTE]

I think he has indirectly renounced his citizenship by his actions in office.:(:mad::(

road kill
03-27-2010, 11:17 AM
[quote=Pete;590725]
Pete,

I heard you were born on a canoe on the Amazon with an anaconda snake as the midwife. Can you provide proof to the contrary?:rolleyes: The "brother" you are talking about is a half brother born after Obama's father abandoned his US family and returned to live in Kenya when Obama was two. Obama's mother obtained a divorce and remarried an Indonesian. None of that affects the fact that Obama was born in Hawaii, after Hawaii became a state, has a birth certificate to prove it that has been reviewed twice in court and attested to by all appropriate officials from the state, and a birth that was announced in a newspaper in Hawaii immediately following his birth. Copies of that announcement have been widely reproduced and unchallenged. The "birther" argument at this point has descended into an argument that he has a funny last name and a father who was African and therefore ha cannot be American. Oddly enough, our laws are very simple. If you are born in this country, nothing else matters. You are an American unless and until you formally renounce your citizenship.

Could you show me a link or a copy of his BC??:D
(not a birther, and not sayin he was or wasn't, just askin to see)



rk

Goose
03-27-2010, 11:30 AM
You mean there are still people who don't believe Obama was born in Kenya? Come on now! Didn't you read the Dan Rather piece? He wrote about it right after the "Bush is a doosh and a draft dodger" piece. Wait a minute...maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it was a story right after the story proving that Bush blew up the World Trade Towers to get the $160 billion in gold bullion buried underneath the towers.

We could get to the bottom of this story if we could just interview our President's brother who's still living in Kenya. It couldn't be too hard to find him. There can't that many bridges to live under in Kenya. Or is he still living in a cardboard shanty.

But if you don't believe our President is an anti-semite just remember he spent over 20 years in a vile, Jew-hating church with a scum-bag leading the congregation.

Over 20 years.

We live in Cuba now.

YardleyLabs
03-27-2010, 11:35 AM
[quote=YardleyLabs;590730]

Could you show me a link or a copy of his BC??:D
(not a birther, and not sayin he was or wasn't, just askin to see)



rk
It has actually been posted repeatedly on line, looking just like the certificates that I have for myself and my children. Certified copies -- which carry the full weight of law -- have been reviewed in detail by different independent organizations and by the courts. Birthers keep yelling fraud. Two times courts have reviewed the documentation and both times have thrown out the challenges. If you want to see a copy, you will have no difficulty finding one through Google. If you are simply looking for a talking point it doesn't matter and the wind turbines need sources of energy.

road kill
03-27-2010, 11:45 AM
[quote=road kill;590754]
It has actually been posted repeatedly on line, looking just like the certificates that I have for myself and my children. Certified copies -- which carry the full weight of law -- have been reviewed in detail by different independent organizations and by the courts. Birthers keep yelling fraud. Two times courts have reviewed the documentation and both times have thrown out the challenges. If you want to see a copy, you will have no difficulty finding one through Google. If you are simply looking for a talking point it doesn't matter and the wind turbines need sources of energy.

Another personal insult.....you are sooo much better than that.
Or are you??

As far as hot air being posted???


YOU are the poster child for bloviating.:D

On my way to run the hounds, you know, training?



rk

Pete
03-27-2010, 07:16 PM
Jeff
Have you been listening to him lately.
while he was running for president he was a smooth talker without a southern black preachers accent. He sounds like he is a rev, wright wanna be. Throw in some bible verses and I would feel like I'm sitting in church in the deep south.
Except only he connotes a cynical tone,and talks down on anyone who disagree's with him like some spoiled little rich kid who owns the floor.
Pete

M&K's Retrievers
03-28-2010, 01:19 AM
Jeff
Have you been listening to him lately.
while he was running for president he was a smooth talker without a southern black preachers accent. He sounds like he is a rev, wright wanna be. Throw in some bible verses and I would feel like I'm sitting in church in the deep south.
Except only he connotes a cynical tone,and talks down on anyone who disagree's with him like some spoiled little rich kid who owns the floor.
Pete

Not as presidential as Reagan or for that matter Bush, Clinton, Bush or even Carter.