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dixidawg
06-11-2010, 11:00 AM
Experts Say White House 'Misrepresented' Views to Justify Drilling Moratorium


The seven experts who advised President Obama (http://www.retrievertraining.net/forums/#) on how to deal with offshore drilling safety after the Deepwater Horizon explosion are accusing his administration of misrepresenting their views to make it appear that they supported a six-month drilling moratorium -- something they actually oppose.


http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/06/10/experts-say-obama-misrepresented-views-justify-offshore-drilling-ban/

paul young
06-11-2010, 11:20 AM
i think there should be a moratorium on deep-water drilling operations until the oil companies can show that they have a WORKING plan to deal with the kind of mess we are now experiencing. i think it's obvious to everyone that is not the case, at this time.

drilling at depths where they can access the well with divers should be exempt until technology to contain blow-outs like the current one can be developed and proven.

i trust that the experts who consulted on this will publish their recommendations. that should clear everything up. i just don't trust ANY news source anymore. they ALL have agendas.-Paul

dixidawg
06-11-2010, 11:22 AM
I agree Paul.

What I don't agree with is misrepresenting a report to justify a position.

Cody Covey
06-11-2010, 11:50 AM
i think there should be a moratorium on deep-water drilling operations until the oil companies can show that they have a WORKING plan to deal with the kind of mess we are now experiencing. i think it's obvious to everyone that is not the case, at this time.

drilling at depths where they can access the well with divers should be exempt until technology to contain blow-outs like the current one can be developed and proven.

i trust that the experts who consulted on this will publish their recommendations. that should clear everything up. i just don't trust ANY news source anymore. they ALL have agendas.-Paul
They did publish their recommendation and then after it was signed by the contributors to the report Salazar added paragraphs to it to support his agenda...

huntinman
06-11-2010, 12:25 PM
Business as usual for this administration. Obama has been a lie since day one of his campaign. I don't think I need to list the major ones.

Franco
06-11-2010, 01:08 PM
With the deep water rigs pulling out of the gulf and going elsewhere around the globe, if the ban is lifted it will take years for drilling to resume in the gulf.

In the mean time the area will lose over 20,000 high paying jobs.

What failed on the Horizon was the BOP. Doesn't take that long to get all of them inspected.

The fact that Obama has never contacted the President of BP only confirms my suspecions that Obama is intimidated by oil companies.

Look for major increases at the pump.

dnf777
06-11-2010, 02:42 PM
In the mean time the area will lose over 20,000 high paying jobs.



What "mean time"? How many jobs are CURRENTLY lost because of offshore drilling? I haven't heard the numbers of fishermen, guides, shrimpers, oyster bed workers, lifeguards, fish processors.....Is it over 20,000 yet?

Franco
06-11-2010, 03:17 PM
What "mean time"? How many jobs are CURRENTLY lost because of offshore drilling? I haven't heard the numbers of fishermen, guides, shrimpers, oyster bed workers, lifeguards, fish processors.....Is it over 20,000 yet?

Offshore workers make 90K plus a year. Fisherman make much less than 50k per year after expenses. So, though the fisherman are being paid what they reported on last year's tax return, BP isn't paying for laid off offshore workers because it is the government that has cause thier unemployment.

Buzz
06-11-2010, 03:40 PM
BP isn't paying for laid off offshore workers because it is the government that has cause thier unemployment.

That almost made me spit out my coffee...

Franco
06-11-2010, 04:09 PM
BP didn't call for a moritorium and neither did the panel of experts Obama put together!

Those offshore workers are unemployed because Obama is playing politics.

The sooner Obama and his cronies are out of DC, the better off we will all be.

depittydawg
06-11-2010, 04:13 PM
With the deep water rigs pulling out of the gulf and going elsewhere around the globe, if the ban is lifted it will take years for drilling to resume in the gulf.

In the mean time the area will lose over 20,000 high paying jobs.

What failed on the Horizon was the BOP. Doesn't take that long to get all of them inspected.

The fact that Obama has never contacted the President of BP only confirms my suspecions that Obama is intimidated by oil companies.

Look for major increases at the pump.

I don't know if he's intimidated. More likely he's watching the mail for his next check!

depittydawg
06-11-2010, 04:17 PM
What "mean time"? How many jobs are CURRENTLY lost because of offshore drilling? I haven't heard the numbers of fishermen, guides, shrimpers, oyster bed workers, lifeguards, fish processors.....Is it over 20,000 yet?

The 20,000 figure was picked out of a hat by politicians. I wouldn't put much stock in it. Also, how many thousands, including fishermen, have been hired and will be hired to clean this mess up before it's over with. Obama is doing all the wrong things as usual. He should be reforming his own regulatory agencies and getting his own house in order. But the reality is, BP F-k'd up. The rest is window dressing.

dnf777
06-11-2010, 05:01 PM
BP didn't call for a moritorium and neither did the panel of experts Obama put together!

Those offshore workers are unemployed because Obama is playing politics.

The sooner Obama and his cronies are out of DC, the better off we will all be.

When both space shuttles blew up, a moratorium was placed on further flights until the CAUSE and a FIX were determined. Given the magnitude of this spill (which we still don't fully realize) I think a review of the safety and process of this relatively new procedure (deep water drilling) are perfectly in order.

I won't argue with you on this point however. If seeing your own backyard fowled by millions upon millions of gallons of crude doesn't convince you....I don't stand a chance!

Cody Covey
06-11-2010, 05:54 PM
So then you don't think obama is playing politics

Franco
06-11-2010, 06:44 PM
When both space shuttles blew up, a moratorium was placed on further flights until the CAUSE and a FIX were determined. Given the magnitude of this spill (which we still don't fully realize) I think a review of the safety and process of this relatively new procedure (deep water drilling) are perfectly in order.

I won't argue with you on this point however. If seeing your own backyard fowled by millions upon millions of gallons of crude doesn't convince you....I don't stand a chance!

Like I said earlier, how long does it take to check all the BOP's? That is what failed and that is what needs checking.

Obama is caving to left wing pressure. His handlers are anti-oil because they aren't in the biz.

dnf777
06-11-2010, 09:16 PM
Like I said earlier, how long does it take to check all the BOP's? That is what failed and that is what needs checking.

Obama is caving to left wing pressure. His handlers are anti-oil because they aren't in the biz.

Wait a minute. You're saying he's caving to left-wing pressure....someone else just said he's afraid to face the CEO because he's caving to oil?? Well, which is it? Just goes to show, he can't wipe his butt in the right direction without being criticized by both sides!

How does one check BOPs 5000 feet underwater? Many use hydraulic rams to crimp the well casing, so there's really to way to check it without pulling the trigger. I was dumbfounded when I heard that there's a "failsafe" system that is battery operated. Obviously, those engineers never had battery operated toys as kids, or else they'd know how failsafe batteries are!

Franco
06-11-2010, 09:24 PM
Wait a minute. You're saying he's caving to left-wing pressure....someone else just said he's afraid to face the CEO because he's caving to oil?? Well, which is it? Just goes to show, he can't wipe his butt in the right direction without being criticized by both sides!

How does one check BOPs 5000 feet underwater? Many use hydraulic rams to crimp the well casing, so there's really to way to check it without pulling the trigger. I was dumbfounded when I heard that there's a "failsafe" system that is battery operated. Obviously, those engineers never had battery operated toys as kids, or else they'd know how failsafe batteries are!

They can be checked from the control center on the rig. Not quite the same type battereis that children use for toys.

Yes, he is caving to the left. The Barbara Boxer/Rosie O'Donnell types, his core and soul mates.

Gerry Clinchy
06-12-2010, 06:40 AM
It seems logical that in all this time, there would have been a point where O would have picked up the phone to talk to Hayward. Why would he not do that?

Franco
06-12-2010, 09:11 AM
It seems logical that in all this time, there would have been a point where O would have picked up the phone to talk to Hayward. Why would he not do that?


I find that very strange too. Probably doesn't want to confirm to Hayward how inept a POTUS he is.

Captain Mike D
06-12-2010, 11:05 AM
What "mean time"? How many jobs are CURRENTLY lost because of offshore drilling? I haven't heard the numbers of fishermen, guides, shrimpers, oyster bed workers, lifeguards, fish processors.....Is it over 20,000 yet?

I'm sure it is well over 20,000 given all the different types of businesses affected. BUT why throw another 100,000 out of work (estimates of all types of workers that support the rigs,from food service to crew boat and supply boat crews) because of ONE Rig.

The reason for the moritorium is two-fold.
1. Obama need to show the public he was doing SOMETHING
2. It advances his agenda of development of alternative energy. By shutting down the rigs they know oil prices will go up. He wants to raise taxes on the oil companies so oil will go up more. By artificially driving prices up it makes the search for alternatives more inviting

The Administration is dragging its feet due to beaurocracy and incompetence
1.The Dutch offered skimmer ships 3 days into the spill- turned down by the administration
2.EPA allows dispersents to be sprayed at the source creating clouds of submerged toxic oil and chemicals which will wipe out countless marine animals but protests and slows down LA's request to build sand berms to block the oil from marshes.
3.There have been numerous reports of companies with miles of booms and other items like skimmers, oil water seperaters sitting in warehouses contacting officials to see if they can be used. It is taking 3 or 4 weeks for someone to finally get back to them, if they are called back at all.
4. The team of experts Obama put on the case recommended a pause to check the BOP's ond other safety measures so Obama has it turned into a Moritorium on deep water drilling
5. Noaa's spill response plan was never put into effect,or was partially put into effect weeks after the spill started.

Doesn't anyone else think it was kind of wierd that among the first responders was a team of goverment lawyers sent by Eric Holder? All the first comments by the administration were about how the goverment was going to make BP pay for the clean up.

It seems to me the the proper response would have been to unleash a huge effort to get on top of the oil before it hit shore, with contengencies at multiple levels for all the what ifs, Then go after BP for the money.

Clint Watts
06-12-2010, 11:13 AM
The 20,000 figure was picked out of a hat by politicians. I wouldn't put much stock in it. Also, how many thousands, including fishermen, have been hired and will be hired to clean this mess up before it's over with. Obama is doing all the wrong things as usual. He should be reforming his own regulatory agencies and getting his own house in order. But the reality is, BP F-k'd up. The rest is window dressing.

Ditto, BP screwed the pooch on this one. Using seawater instead of mud to save money? Sounds like the BP supervisor on the rig made some very stupid decisions. The well was way over budget and I bet that supervisor was under great pressure to complete the well causing him to make decisions that ultimately caused the incident. Managerial courage was lacking, shortcuts should never be tolerated. Obama is right now lacking the same managerial courage, instead of standing up to political pressure he is caving. The moritorium is a political move. Watch the price of crude oil and the stock prices of the major oil companies, they will both go up. The price at the pump will go up. This in turn will affect the cost of everything we we buy. How can Obama not know this? Hopefully I am wrong.

Clint

GoldDogger
06-12-2010, 12:51 PM
Is it wrong for those oil prices to go up? Something needs to force Americans away from their oil dependence and apparently concern for the environment is not good enough for most. Now if you for the pocketbook...

I just can't help but think the moratorium on drilling is a smart move. Why on Earth should the government let oil companies keep drilling when they have just proven they can't contain the oil?

And look at this--another oil spill just occurred today and think of the environmental impact again.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700039797/Oil-spill-above-Red-Butte-threatens-waters-wildlife.html

Captain Mike D
06-12-2010, 05:33 PM
Is it wrong for those oil prices to go up? Something needs to force Americans away from their oil dependence and apparently concern for the environment is not good enough for most. Now if you for the pocketbook...

I just can't help but think the moratorium on drilling is a smart move. Why on Earth should the government let oil companies keep drilling when they have just proven they can't contain the oil?

And look at this--another oil spill just occurred today and think of the environmental impact again.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700039797/Oil-spill-above-Red-Butte-threatens-waters-wildlife.html

There you go! ANOTHER DUM BASS WITH NO CONCEPT OF REALITY CHIMES IN.
Dude, I hope you are a rich boy since everything you consume or own is either made from or transported with OIL.
As far as your link- the spill has already been delt with and contained per the link as would any spill in Anwar or shallow water wells.
Thanks, try again

GoldDogger
06-12-2010, 06:02 PM
There you go! ANOTHER DUM BASS WITH NO CONCEPT OF REALITY CHIMES IN.
Dude, I hope you are a rich boy since everything you consume or own is either made from or transported with OIL.
As far as your link- the spill has already been delt with and contained per the link as would any spill in Anwar or shallow water wells.
Thanks, try again

That's great--except for the fact that oil is a non-renewable resource. Or did you overlook that fact? Some day it is going to run out and what are you going to do then?

And whether the spill is contained or not do not neglect the fact that this will have a negative impact on the environment. Always does, always will.

I am neither 'rich' nor a 'boy' but thanks for playing ;)

Clint Watts
06-12-2010, 11:46 PM
Is it wrong for those oil prices to go up? Something needs to force Americans away from their oil dependence and apparently concern for the environment is not good enough for most. Now if you for the pocketbook...

I just can't help but think the moratorium on drilling is a smart move. Why on Earth should the government let oil companies keep drilling when they have just proven they can't contain the oil?

And look at this--another oil spill just occurred today and think of the environmental impact again.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700039797/Oil-spill-above-Red-Butte-threatens-waters-wildlife.html

It would be devastating to an already fragile world economy. The reality of the situation is that oil is going to continue to be around for a long time. It is also very ignorant to lump all oil companies under the screw up of BP. Also the moritorium is just for offshore drilling, there is currently 1,492 drilling rigs in the USA alone. Chevron is the largest employer in the state of California. Lets just shutdown all oil companies and live off love. Lets get serious, argue with logic and facts, not emotion. Think of the headline, Obama shuts down all oil Companies and think of the economic impact of that. Of course this will never happen, just trying to make a point.

GoldDogger
06-13-2010, 08:37 AM
I did not intend to suggest all companies should be shutdown now, but I think we should be headed in the direction of alternative energies. Oil will not last and is has a bad impact on the environment no matter how you slice it.

dnf777
06-13-2010, 09:01 AM
I don't think anyone suggests shutting down all drilling, but high-risk deep water....until we figure out what happened (or is anyone content just taking BP's word for it?) is a reasonable precaution, and given it's relatively low contribution to the world oil supply, would not cause the sky to fall as all the tar-babies are crying.

If this isn't a wake up call to begin to develop new energy sources, I don't know what is. This crap about collapsing economies are exactly what we heard as the whaling industry declined in New Bedford after Drake's well hit and crude oil began to replace whale oil. Did the economy collapse? Hell no....rather a new, more prosperous era was began. Its not an overnite switch, but we better start working on wind, solar and nuclear, or we're gonna be in a real bind.....and FAR behind other countries who don't have their head's up the oil exec's a$$es!

subroc
06-13-2010, 09:20 AM
I have no problem with a moratorium on deep water drilling. However, this will be more a left wing extremist position to force unaffordable and marginally effective technologies at end users. If a moratorium is needed on deep water drilling, open “ALL” other locations (ANWAR, etc.) in an attempt to keep oil affordable.

road kill
06-13-2010, 01:22 PM
Did anyone watch Huckabee's show last night?

I was in the U.S. Coast Guard.
1 of our duty's was oil/fuel spill clean up.
We used to use double and triple booms to contain and a wool like material to clean it up.

I have been wondering why nothing like this is apparently being done (or at least reported on).
I am sure the USCG is doing all they can.

But there were about a dozen people with all kinds of devices and substances to clean this stuff up.
(again, in Amrica all we need is $$ signs and watch the engenuity!!)

Each claimed that no one (BP or Obama's crew)will even talk to them.
Except the last guy with the bubble machine.

Your thoughts on this?
If this is true (not saying it is yet).......WTF??????



rk

Franco
06-13-2010, 02:48 PM
Did anyone watch Huckabee's show last night?

I was in the U.S. Coast Guard.
1 of our duty's was oil/fuel spill clean up.
We used to use double and triple booms to contain and a wool like material to clean it up.

I have been wondering why nothing like this is apparently being done (or at least reported on).
I am sure the USCG is doing all they can.

But there were about a dozen people with all kinds of devices and substances to clean this stuff up.
(again, in Amrica all we need is $$ signs and watch the engenuity!!)

Each claimed that no one (BP or Obama's crew)will even talk to them.
Except the last guy with the bubble machine.

Your thoughts on this?
If this is true (not saying it is yet).......WTF??????



rk

Believe me, they(BP hired clean up crews including fishermen, Coast Guard, National Gurad,etc.) are using all the latest high tech and proven and unproven techniques available. They hired Kevin Costner's company that seperates oil from water. No rednecks out there using straw to soak up oil.

.

road kill
06-13-2010, 02:52 PM
Believe me, they(BP hired clean up crews including fishermen, Coast Guard, National Gurad,etc.) are using all the latest high tech and proven and unproven techniques available. They hired Kevin Costner's company that seperates oil from water. No rednecks out there using straw to soak up oil.

.

I feel way better now!!!:rolleyes:



rk

Franco
06-13-2010, 03:13 PM
I feel way better now!!!:rolleyes:



rk


http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/greenspace/2010/06/gulf-oil-spill-costner-solution-has-green-light-but-no-green.html

Gerry Clinchy
06-13-2010, 03:44 PM
We used to use double and triple booms to contain and a wool like material to clean it up.

I have been wondering why nothing like this is apparently being done (or at least reported on).
I am sure the USCG is doing all they can.


Another list mentioned using "hair" brooms ... among the hair, dog hair! However, a later post indicated that the hair brooms became saturated and sunk too soon to be of much use.

Gerry Clinchy
06-13-2010, 03:58 PM
The company’s largest machine is 112 inches high, weighs 2-1/2 tons and cleans 210,000 gallons a day of oily water.

If all goes according to plan, Costner and Houghtaling said they hope to sell as much of the oil reclaimed by their machines as possible, and donate 80% of the proceeds to parishes struggling to cope with fouled marshlands and devastated fisheries.
gallons a day of oily water.


At least more useful input than what we normally get from celebrities.

The technology seems logical. The up-side being that no chemicals are being put into the environment (as with dispersants), and the oil is actually being removed from the environment, not just letting it degrade over time.

Also nice to know that some of the money that BP is spending for the cleanup would result in ultimately going back to the damaged areas from Costner's company's profits.

This will certainly be a a demanding test of the technology and the machinery. If it works as "planned", it could be of great value in the future.