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Franco
09-12-2010, 01:17 PM
Not to distract from the other thread, DipittyDawg suggest that we would have been better off to have "turned the other cheek" after the attacks on 911.

Isn't that what the Christian Bible directs its followers to do?

I agree that we took our eye off the goal or mission, to kill or capture bin Lauden. Our efforts against radical Islam was faulty. What in the hell was the then current administration thinking getting us mired in Iraq?

Did they really believe the Intel? They really sold it to Gen Colin Powell and used him as the fall guy. I remember Powell's presentation to the UN on Iraq's WMD's. Was Pres Bush trying to gain acceptence from his father by going after Saddam from hiring Bush 41 hitmen? Was it a Dick Chaney "grand experiment" to bring Democray to Iraq? Don't try and tell me it was worth the lives of US Servicemen, much less the teasure it cost us!

Turn the other cheek? Not me brother, I don't pretend to be a Christian like some on this board! I'm all for killing bin Lauden and his band of thugs and those that support them!

Clay Rogers
09-12-2010, 01:56 PM
The bible also states an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.

gman0046
09-12-2010, 02:08 PM
Maybe Dip would feel differently if one of the three thousand killed by Raghead extremists on 9/11 happened to be one of his loved ones.

Pals
09-12-2010, 03:01 PM
Franco-

I abstained from commenting on that post yesterday out of respect for the day, the families and our military. I found the idea of turning the other cheek to be totally without merit-for this reason: these are not 'normal' enemies. They want us all dead and are fanantical is their quest to kill us. They have no honor, they will slaughter the innocent, turn on their own neighbors and family, televise beheadings, and are depraved disgusting beings who thrive on hate and terror. The rules of combat that we as American's believe in are not followed by this enemy. If turning the other cheek will lead to our slaughter-then I firmly believe that Christ will want us to defend ourselves with honor. All life is precious, including our own. What Christ ultimately wants is for each soul to be His and to be saved. If we all followed his teachings there would be no war, no killing, no hate. Sadly we are incapable of even being decent or civil on this forum-the idea that we as a whole would opt for peace is but a pipe dream.

The idea of doing nothing after 9/11 would have emboldened a crazed group of terrorists, lead to more terror attacks and would have ultimately resulted in the loss of the freedom's we hold so dear. To be pacifists in today's world is a death sentence.

dnf777
09-12-2010, 03:21 PM
Not to distract from the other thread, DipittyDawg suggest that we would have been better off to have "turned the other cheek" after the attacks on 911.

Isn't that what the Christian Bible directs its followers to do?

I agree that we took our eye off the goal or mission, to kill or capture bin Lauden. Our efforts against radical Islam was faulty. What in the hell was the then current administration thinking getting us mired in Iraq?

Did they really believe the Intel? They really sold it to Gen Colin Powell and used him as the fall guy. I remember Powell's presentation to the UN on Iraq's WMD's. Was Pres Bush trying to gain acceptence from his father by going after Saddam from hiring Bush 41 hitmen? Was it a Dick Chaney "grand experiment" to bring Democray to Iraq? Don't try and tell me it was worth the lives of US Servicemen, much less the teasure it cost us!

Turn the other cheek? Not me brother, I don't pretend to be a Christian like some on this board! I'm all for killing bin Lauden and his band of thugs and those that support them!


You, me, and every politician from every party agreed with that. That's why nobody complained when we went into Afghanistan after the perpetrators of 911. Then, for reasons unknown (to this day) the Bush administration chose to let bin Laden slip through our fingers, and abandon the Afghanistan mission, instead focusing on Iraq. As Franco alluded to, I don't believe there was "faulty" intel, or genuine concern for the Kurds. There was some agenda that we are not privy to. The decision to go to war in Iraq will go down in history as a grand blunder. And one our kids and grandkids will have to pay for. I shudder to think of all the bridges, schools, GAS PIPELINES, that could have been upgraded and built with the billions we spend in Iraq.

Franco
09-12-2010, 03:22 PM
Franco-

I abstained from commenting on that post yesterday out of respect for the day, the families and our military. I found the idea of turning the other cheek to be totally without merit-for this reason: these are not 'normal' enemies. They want us all dead and are fanantical is their quest to kill us. They have no honor, they will slaughter the innocent, turn on their own neighbors and family, televise beheadings, and are depraved disgusting beings who thrive on hate and terror. The rules of combat that we as American's believe in are not followed by this enemy. If turning the other cheek will lead to our slaughter-then I firmly believe that Christ will want us to defend ourselves with honor. All life is precious, including our own. What Christ ultimately wants is for each soul to be His and to be saved. If we all followed his teachings there would be no war, no killing, no hate. Sadly we are incapable of even being decent or civil on this forum-the idea that we as a whole would opt for peace is but a pipe dream.

The idea of doing nothing after 9/11 would have emboldened a crazed group of terrorists, lead to more terror attacks and would have ultimately resulted in the loss of the freedom's we hold so dear. To be pacifists in today's world is a death sentence.

I wholeheartedly agree, the meek shall not inherit the earth.

subroc
09-12-2010, 05:24 PM
I wholeheartedly agree, the meek shall not inherit the earth.

they will be subjugated...

depittydawg
09-12-2010, 06:14 PM
Franco-

I abstained from commenting on that post yesterday out of respect for the day, the families and our military. I found the idea of turning the other cheek to be totally without merit-for this reason: these are not 'normal' enemies. They want us all dead and are fanantical is their quest to kill us. They have no honor, they will slaughter the innocent, turn on their own neighbors and family, televise beheadings, and are depraved disgusting beings who thrive on hate and terror. The rules of combat that we as American's believe in are not followed by this enemy. If turning the other cheek will lead to our slaughter-then I firmly believe that Christ will want us to defend ourselves with honor. All life is precious, including our own. What Christ ultimately wants is for each soul to be His and to be saved. If we all followed his teachings there would be no war, no killing, no hate. Sadly we are incapable of even being decent or civil on this forum-the idea that we as a whole would opt for peace is but a pipe dream.

The idea of doing nothing after 9/11 would have emboldened a crazed group of terrorists, lead to more terror attacks and would have ultimately resulted in the loss of the freedom's we hold so dear. To be pacifists in today's world is a death sentence.

As usual you missed the point of the statement. Here it is. To do nothing and to result in being better off than we are now was an acknowledgement that the reaction we DID undertake was SO WRONG, and SO COSTLY, that we are now worse off than had we done absolutely nothing at all.
I will admit, that as I wrote that statement, the thought of Jesus Christ did occur to me. And I strongly disagree with you that Jesus would have condoned killing innocent people, including children for Christs sake in our zeal to extract revenge and justice. When he was executed on the cross, his last statement was to forgive those who drove the spikes into his hands and feet, whipped him, tortured him and finally hung him on a cross to die. Certainly if you believe in his deity, you believe he could have struck down every Jewish person, or Roman on the planet in his vengeance.
While I can never aspire to such humility as Christ achieved, I can at least acknowledge, that when my countries actions result in the death of innocent people, I condemn those actions and will try to make sure it never happens again.

Pals
09-12-2010, 06:24 PM
Do me a favor and re-read my post. If, IF, we all followed Christ's teachings we wouldn't be in this position now would we???? Well guess what, we are-I prefer to defend myself and my country. I support my military and while I may not agree with our leaders I do support them. AND I pray for them-constantly. We are not war-mongers, this was brought to our shores, our shores-our citizens killed. So yes we are at war, you turn the other cheek and live happily(for about 12 seconds if those jihadist get hold of you).

Franco
09-12-2010, 06:58 PM
Do me a favor and re-read my post. If, IF, we all followed Christ's teachings we wouldn't be in this position now would we???? Well guess what, we are-I prefer to defend myself and my country. I support my military and while I may not agree with our leaders I do support them. AND I pray for them-constantly. We are not war-mongers, this was brought to our shores, our shores-our citizens killed. So yes we are at war, you turn the other cheek and live happily(for about 12 seconds if those jihadist get hold of you).


I understood your post perfectly.

I'm not interested in another Christian Crusade, I just want the terrorist dead.

Franco
09-12-2010, 07:02 PM
As usual you missed the point of the statement. Here it is. To do nothing and to result in being better off than we are now was an acknowledgement that the reaction we DID undertake was SO WRONG, and SO COSTLY, that we are now worse off than had we done absolutely nothing at all.
I will admit, that as I wrote that statement, the thought of Jesus Christ did occur to me. And I strongly disagree with you that Jesus would have condoned killing innocent people, including children for Christs sake in our zeal to extract revenge and justice. When he was executed on the cross, his last statement was to forgive those who drove the spikes into his hands and feet, whipped him, tortured him and finally hung him on a cross to die. Certainly if you believe in his deity, you believe he could have struck down every Jewish person, or Roman on the planet in his vengeance.
While I can never aspire to such humility as Christ achieved, I can at least acknowledge, that when my countries actions result in the death of innocent people, I condemn those actions and will try to make sure it never happens again.

You need to work on reading comprehension.

Where did I say that Jesus condoned killing anyone? In fact, I said according to him, Christians should turn the other cheek!

I am also a believe in that the meek will not accomplish anything.

Pals
09-12-2010, 07:16 PM
I understood your post perfectly.

I'm not interested in another Christian Crusade, I just want the terrorist dead.


Franco-that was directed at DeppityDawg, not you. Do you have him on ignore?

depittydawg
09-12-2010, 08:01 PM
Do me a favor and re-read my post. If, IF, we all followed Christ's teachings we wouldn't be in this position now would we???? Well guess what, we are-I prefer to defend myself and my country. I support my military and while I may not agree with our leaders I do support them. AND I pray for them-constantly. We are not war-mongers, this was brought to our shores, our shores-our citizens killed. So yes we are at war, you turn the other cheek and live happily(for about 12 seconds if those jihadist get hold of you).

And do you believe that dropping bombs on people who have done us no harm, and shooting their children from helicopters is honorable? Do you believe it falls under the right to "defend my country"?

Never mind answering to me. You already have. I disagree with you. I happen to think it is disgraceful and is the reaction of a coward, be it an individual or a nation. You, and others try to misconstrue my words of condemnation of our national response to a a proclamation of an appeasement strategy. They are not the same. They serve only to avert the question.
I believe the perpertrators of the attack against us were Saudi's. They were brainwashed in Mosque's in Saudi Arabia. Those Mosques are still active turning out Radical's who hate America every day. They were and are led by members of the Saudi royal family. I have publicly called for action against this nation. I have, on this site said more than once I would support action against this nation to wipe out the hate mongering fanatics that fuel Radical Islam. For that I get ridicule and condemnation from the nuts on this site who would rather believe we are waging an effective campaign by attacking innocents in nations that have nothing to do with Islamic Terrorism. Why? Because it make you feel good?
What has our government done given the facts that The Terrorist enemy that attacked our country originated in Saudi Arabia?
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/28/washington/28weapons.html
We're GIVING them 20,000,000,000.00 in Miliatry Aid!!!!! Come on people. Get your heads out of your collective asses and start paying attention!

Granted you and a lot of other folks on this site hate my guts because I often point out the lies, mis-statements, and at times overt deceit that you all seem so willing to swallow, hook, line and sinker. At some point you folks need to stop reacting and start thinking. Un-circle your wagons and start paying attention.

Pals
09-12-2010, 08:07 PM
And do you believe that dropping bombs on people who have done us no harm, and shooting their children from helicopters is honorable? Do you believe it falls under the right to "defend my country"?

Never mind answering to me. You already have. I disagree with you. I happen to think it is disgraceful and is the reaction of a coward, be it an individual or a nation. You, and others try to misconstrue my words of condemnation of our national response to a a proclamation of an appeasement strategy. They are not the same. They serve only to avert the question.
I believe the perpertrators of the attack against us were Saudi's. They were brainwashed in Mosque's in Saudi Arabia. Those Mosques are still active turning out Radical's who hate America every day. They were and are led by members of the Saudi royal family. I have publicly called for action against this nation. I have, on this site said more than once I would support action against this nation to wipe out the hate mongering fanatics that fuel Radical Islam. For that I get ridicule and condemnation from the nuts on this site who would rather believe we are waging an effective campaign by attacking innocents in nations that have nothing to do with Islamic Terrorism. Why? Because it make you feel good?
What has our government done given the facts that The Terrorist enemy that attacked our country originated in Saudi Arabia?
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/28/washington/28weapons.html
We're GIVING them 20,000,000,000.00 in Miliatry Aid!!!!! Come on people. Get your heads out of your collective asses and start paying attention!

Granted you and a lot of other folks on this site hate my guts because I often point out the lies, mis-statements, and at times overt deceit that you all seem so willing to swallow, hook, line and sinker. At some point you folks need to stop reacting and start thinking. Un-circle your wagons and start paying attention.

Hate? I don't hate you, why would I? I may not agree with you but I certainly don't hate you. Let's see-pretty darn sure not one person on this board is happy about dropping bombs on innocent children. Wish there was a way to only kill terrorists with no collateral damage-but again this is the real world, not la la land. I'm sure the terrorist were only after uhmmmm zionist pig bankers? or well really just who did they target when they crashed our planes into our buildings? Guess it doesn't matter, it was only 3,000 american citizens.

david gibson
09-12-2010, 10:47 PM
Granted you and a lot of other folks on this site hate my guts because I often point out the lies, mis-statements, and at times overt deceit that you all seem so willing to swallow, hook, line and sinker. At some point you folks need to stop reacting and start thinking. Un-circle your wagons and start paying attention.

so you are so smart you know more than the CIA, FBI, and military intelligence? only you know the truth??

please

and can you please cite evidence where our soldiers intentionally and repeatedly shoot children from helicopters?

Cody Covey
09-13-2010, 10:58 AM
And do you believe that dropping bombs on people who have done us no harm, and shooting their children from helicopters is honorable? Do you believe it falls under the right to "defend my country"?

Never mind answering to me. You already have. I disagree with you. I happen to think it is disgraceful and is the reaction of a coward, be it an individual or a nation. You, and others try to misconstrue my words of condemnation of our national response to a a proclamation of an appeasement strategy. They are not the same. They serve only to avert the question.
I believe the perpertrators of the attack against us were Saudi's. They were brainwashed in Mosque's in Saudi Arabia. Those Mosques are still active turning out Radical's who hate America every day. They were and are led by members of the Saudi royal family. I have publicly called for action against this nation. I have, on this site said more than once I would support action against this nation to wipe out the hate mongering fanatics that fuel Radical Islam. For that I get ridicule and condemnation from the nuts on this site who would rather believe we are waging an effective campaign by attacking innocents in nations that have nothing to do with Islamic Terrorism. Why? Because it make you feel good?
What has our government done given the facts that The Terrorist enemy that attacked our country originated in Saudi Arabia?
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/28/washington/28weapons.html
We're GIVING them 20,000,000,000.00 in Miliatry Aid!!!!! Come on people. Get your heads out of your collective asses and start paying attention!

Granted you and a lot of other folks on this site hate my guts because I often point out the lies, mis-statements, and at times overt deceit that you all seem so willing to swallow, hook, line and sinker. At some point you folks need to stop reacting and start thinking. Un-circle your wagons and start paying attention.So you disagree with every single war that has ever happened?

Franco
09-13-2010, 11:05 AM
Again ,,,,The meek will inherit the earth. Look up the word meek and what your supposed to be meek to. look up dispensations,,,,when ,where ,why who,,how,,,its all there.

Franco
I love when people who don't even believe the bible try to use it as a sword. They end up cutting off their own head.

Pete

There are many, many ways of interpreting the bible and everyone claims thiers to be the correct one!

Franco
09-13-2010, 02:06 PM
I also think that radio ads don't work. After all I have proved that fact over and over,,,no matter what the zealots and sales man say about it. Any body can interpret numbers to mean anything they want;-)

Pete

If it wasn't the most effective advertising medium today, it would have gone out of buisness many, many years ago instead of the 5 billion annual industry it is today!;-)

Uncle Bill
09-13-2010, 02:43 PM
Yo Franco, are you still assailing us with your atheism as being so superior to Christianity? There's nothing I can say that will change your beliefs, don't claim that power, nor can anyone else. That's the work of the Holy Ghost. All we can do is pray for your soul, and for you to stop persecuting those that are Christians.

As a final comment to you on this topic, is your atheism as strong as you portray it on RTF? Doesn't that align you with other great atheists like Stalin, Hitler, and their followers? They of course never invoked war; only Christian Crusaders are guilty of killing the masses, right?

Please explain how we shouldn't consider you are throwing stones from your glass house?

UB

Franco
09-13-2010, 03:01 PM
Here ya go UB, obvious by your post you didn't read the first post of this thread. I simply asked those on here that were responding to dipittydawg's post on another thread asking if violence was against thier Christian faith.

"Not to distract from the other thread, DipittyDawg suggest that we would have been better off to have "turned the other cheek" after the attacks on 911.

Isn't that what the Christian Bible directs its followers to do?

I agree that we took our eye off the goal or mission, to kill or capture bin Lauden. Our efforts against radical Islam was faulty. What in the hell was the then current administration thinking getting us mired in Iraq?

Did they really believe the Intel? They really sold it to Gen Colin Powell and used him as the fall guy. I remember Powell's presentation to the UN on Iraq's WMD's. Was Pres Bush trying to gain acceptence from his father by going after Saddam from hiring Bush 41 hitmen? Was it a Dick Chaney "grand experiment" to bring Democray to Iraq? Don't try and tell me it was worth the lives of US Servicemen, much less the teasure it cost us!

Turn the other cheek? Not me brother, I don't pretend to be a Christian like some on this board! I'm all for killing bin Lauden and his band of thugs and those that support them!"

starjack
09-13-2010, 03:40 PM
Franco Where Can I Get A Copy Of That Sports Illustrated.

road kill
09-13-2010, 03:45 PM
Not to distract from the other thread, DipittyDawg suggest that we would have been better off to have "turned the other cheek" after the attacks on 911.

Isn't that what the Christian Bible directs its followers to do?

I agree that we took our eye off the goal or mission, to kill or capture bin Lauden. Our efforts against radical Islam was faulty. What in the hell was the then current administration thinking getting us mired in Iraq?

Did they really believe the Intel? They really sold it to Gen Colin Powell and used him as the fall guy. I remember Powell's presentation to the UN on Iraq's WMD's. Was Pres Bush trying to gain acceptence from his father by going after Saddam from hiring Bush 41 hitmen? Was it a Dick Chaney "grand experiment" to bring Democray to Iraq? Don't try and tell me it was worth the lives of US Servicemen, much less the teasure it cost us!

Turn the other cheek? Not me brother, I don't pretend to be a Christian like some on this board! I'm all for killing bin Lauden and his band of thugs and those that support them!

They can kiss both my cheeks, in what ever order they choose!!;-)


RK

Franco
09-13-2010, 04:59 PM
Franco Where Can I Get A Copy Of That Sports Illustrated.



Send me you email address and I'll send you the cover. I actually lifted that pic off of Facebook.;-)

If I don't get it tonight, I won't be able to send till Friday as I won't be near a computer for the next three days.

depittydawg
09-13-2010, 09:36 PM
So you disagree with every single war that has ever happened?

No, I don't. I do believe that if Congress cannot declare a war, the US should not commit our troops and resources to fighting one. Our constitution is clear, it is NOT the President of the US who has the authority to commit the nation to War. It is the Congress. The last 50 years have been a good lesson on why that is important.