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fishdogs
11-11-2010, 03:04 PM
I'm curious how many hunters also fish? We are in need of a strong lobbying group for fishing rights, and it seems all the national ones are deep down funded by environmental groups and/or big corporations. The underlying push is towards a light tackle catch and release only fishery, and National government control over ALL waterways.

I understand that the NRA was trying to establish some legislation like a Constitutional Amendment to protect Fishing and hunting rights. I know the NRA will not "split" it's message (and shouldn't), but has anyone thought of the possibility of adding a fishing arm to the NRA? We could really use the strength and expertise that NRA has developed over the years!

dnf777
11-11-2010, 03:19 PM
This is actually good news. It must mean the NRA is confident that there are no realistic threats on the horizon, in order to take up another cause.

On the threat to fishing notion....the NRA typically supports republican candidates, no surprises there. However, republican lawmakers have typically been very favorable to deregulation of energy extraction and very unfavorable to clean air and water legislation, so the NRA has in fact, posed a very real threat to anyone who enjoys fishing in clean water that supports aquatic life. I am a life member, and would rather they stick to their chartered mission.

Acid mine runoff, fracking waste water, and stream degradation are far more of a threat than government regulation to fishing.

Buzz
11-11-2010, 03:45 PM
What evidence do you have that there is any threat to our fishing rights coming down the pike, besides more fear mongering?

road kill
11-11-2010, 06:44 PM
What evidence do you have that there is any threat to our fishing rights coming down the pike, besides more fear mongering?

You fear nothing!!!:D



RK

zeus3925
11-11-2010, 06:56 PM
It is getting so you can't eat the fish anyway from anywhere anyway. Protecting fishing rights is meaningless unless the pollution stops.

depittydawg
11-11-2010, 08:27 PM
I'm curious how many hunters also fish? We are in need of a strong lobbying group for fishing rights, and it seems all the national ones are deep down funded by environmental groups and/or big corporations. The underlying push is towards a light tackle catch and release only fishery, and National government control over ALL waterways.

I understand that the NRA was trying to establish some legislation like a Constitutional Amendment to protect Fishing and hunting rights. I know the NRA will not "split" it's message (and shouldn't), but has anyone thought of the possibility of adding a fishing arm to the NRA? We could really use the strength and expertise that NRA has developed over the years!

The only threat to fishing I've seen is that everything is over fished anymore. Most of the conservation groups are the best advocates for preserving and maintaining a sport fishing industry. NRA would be the last place I would look. All they are interested in is selling their product.

Nor_Cal_Angler
11-11-2010, 08:43 PM
What evidence do you have that there is any threat to our fishing rights coming down the pike, besides more fear mongering?

Research....

MLPA and PFMC.....SCREW ALL THOSE DAMN LIBERAL THINK TANKS THAT WANT TO STRIP ME OF MY GOD GIVEN RIGHT TO FISH THESE WATERS!!!!!!

NOR CAL ANGLER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nor_Cal_Angler
11-11-2010, 08:46 PM
The only threat to fishing I've seen is that everything is over fished anymore. Most of the conservation groups are the best advocates for preserving and maintaining a sport fishing industry. NRA would be the last place I would look. All they are interested in is selling their product.

Everything is NOT overfished....there is not ONE single source of evidence unless you go back to the 30's 50's 60's and 70's to suggest that MAN has OVER fished a region especially yours and mine...

what man has done...is STRIP THE WATER WAYS of NATURAL RUN OFF....DAM, DAM, DAM and ohhhh yea lets build another DAM.

RESTORE (give back) the water to the fish!!!!!!!!!

NOR CAL ANGLER

dnf777
11-11-2010, 09:16 PM
what man has done...is STRIP THE WATER WAYS of NATURAL RUN OFF....DAM, DAM, DAM and ohhhh yea lets build another DAM.

RESTORE (give back) the water to the fish!!!!!!!!!

NOR CAL ANGLER

How do you feel about beavers?

depittydawg
11-11-2010, 10:01 PM
Everything is NOT overfished....there is not ONE single source of evidence unless you go back to the 30's 50's 60's and 70's to suggest that MAN has OVER fished a region especially yours and mine...

what man has done...is STRIP THE WATER WAYS of NATURAL RUN OFF....DAM, DAM, DAM and ohhhh yea lets build another DAM.

RESTORE (give back) the water to the fish!!!!!!!!!

NOR CAL ANGLER

You have a good point. And there are lots of fish where I live. But most of them are stocked now. Which is fine too. But good trophy's... They are very hard to get anymore.

Cody Covey
11-11-2010, 10:52 PM
are you kidding me? There are MANY species of fish that are over fished almost to extinction.

Nor_Cal_Angler
11-11-2010, 11:48 PM
How do you feel about beavers?

I would rather keep this PG.....lol;-);-)



You have a good point. And there are lots of fish where I live. But most of them are stocked now. Which is fine too. But good trophy's... They are very hard to get anymore.

I am glad you see the importance of man's assistance (hatchery's) but it should not excuse us of our disregard for their NATIVE water to spawn naturally.....

I agree trophies are harder to come buy but I still EVERY YEAR see photos of 50LB Chinook's being landed on the SACRAMENTO river (personally havent hit into anything over 40, 37 is my Cali record fish), and that is the hardest hit of all the rivers....(well the Klamath is EXTREAMLY bad as well)

We need to find a balance, of natural runoff being allowed to reach the ocean, here in the Delta system of N.Cali which is some of the most valuable land in the WORLD for crop, the rivers have been damed up so bad to provide water for farming (which isnt bad) and water for S. Cali (which is FREAKING HORRIBLE) the salt line is pushing Rio Vista which is almost an hour and a half up river from the intet at SF by land and which is probally at a 25 Knt clip a 3+ hr run by water.

But, just like most everything else in this DAMNED state, the brain trust that is...just SCREWS up more and more each year, month and what seems DAILY....



are you kidding me? There are MANY species of fish that are over fished almost to extinction.

Ohhhh Cody,

yes, I'm kidding you......:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Really???? Who signs on to a Retriever Training forum with a handle like nor cal ANGLER.....probally someone that spends more time in a boat, or on a bank then he/she does Training Dogs.....just saying think about that one!!!!

NCA

Nor_Cal_Angler
11-11-2010, 11:57 PM
Ohhh and Buzz...and anyone else that would like to take up my offer to research PFMC and MLPA...

Dont get the worng idea about my suggestion...(I dont really think you would) but in my book...THAT IS MY ENEMY!!!!!!!

take what you want from a glossing over of their website...but I have been to their meetings, attended confrences, placed my calls, and picked their brains....I know better....the closing of our waters is their NUMBER ONE PRIORITY!!!!!!!!!!!!

Give them an INCH and they will take our COASTLINE!!!!!!!!!!! and then start INLAND!!!!

just so you know where I stand, regards

NCA

Cody Covey
11-12-2010, 12:12 AM
I would rather keep this PG.....lol;-);-)




I am glad you see the importance of man's assistance (hatchery's) but it should not excuse us of our disregard for their NATIVE water to spawn naturally.....

I agree trophies are harder to come buy but I still EVERY YEAR see photos of 50LB Chinook's being landed on the SACRAMENTO river (personally havent hit into anything over 40, 37 is my Cali record fish), and that is the hardest hit of all the rivers....(well the Klamath is EXTREAMLY bad as well)

We need to find a balance, of natural runoff being allowed to reach the ocean, here in the Delta system of N.Cali which is some of the most valuable land in the WORLD for crop, the rivers have been damed up so bad to provide water for farming (which isnt bad) and water for S. Cali (which is FREAKING HORRIBLE) the salt line is pushing Rio Vista which is almost an hour and a half up river from the intet at SF by land and which is probally at a 25 Knt clip a 3+ hr run by water.

But, just like most everything else in this DAMNED state, the brain trust that is...just SCREWS up more and more each year, month and what seems DAILY....




Ohhhh Cody,

yes, I'm kidding you......:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Really???? Who signs on to a Retriever Training forum with a handle like nor cal ANGLER.....probally someone that spends more time in a boat, or on a bank then he/she does Training Dogs.....just saying think about that one!!!!

NCAMaybe you should look up the blue fin tuna if you don't believe we haven't over fished any species

subroc
11-12-2010, 04:01 AM
I hope the NRA stays out of the fish business!

fishdogs
11-14-2010, 11:40 AM
What evidence do you have that there is any threat to our fishing rights coming down the pike, besides more fear mongering?

Wow, I forget that this is a nationwide forum, and largely freshwater. Here are some FACTS of which you may be unaware. If my business was not involved, I would not know about these things, either.

Evidence:
-----------------------------------
Executive order signed 7-19-2010.

For Immediate Release July 19, 2010
Executive Order--Stewardship of the Ocean, Our Coasts, and the Great Lakes
By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, it is hereby ordered....
http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/executive-order-stewardship-ocean-our-coasts-and-great-lakes

You have to read the reccomendations and background to see how close this came to including ALL inland bodies of water. The door is still open for it, they're just doing baby steps...The individual states used to have control over their own coastal waters...not anymore! With the stroke of his mighty pen, the President took state waters away!

Evidence
------------------------------------
Did you know that if you are an angler in saltwater, that there is a LAW that you MUST "register" with the government? https://www.countmyfish.noaa.gov/howtoregister/index.htm

States are being "encouraged" to share their fishing license information with the federal government for the purpose of counting fish.

Evidence
-------------------------------------
I do not confess to know about freshwater stocks. But I do know that the data the feds are using to shut down much of saltwater RECREATIONAL fishing, is not only several years old, but based on flawed survey techniques and bad science.

http://wwwtest.recfin.org/examples/cell.htm

This is the SAME survey that calculated RECREATIONAL EFFORT increased over 400% in a year when the Gulf of Mexico was hit by 4 hurricanes!

Evidence
------------------------------------------------
The EPA is ON RECORD as saying that any hunting/fishing reductions must go after angelers first, because the NRA lobby is too strong. (See the public record of the lead in ammunition and fishing tackle hearings)

Evidence
---------------------------------------
The Gulf Council (one of 7 regional bodies for regulating saltwater fishing) prohibited reporter covering a recent PUBLIC workshop from recording, taking pictures, or even taking notes during the workshop! A local firshing rights group had to call its attorney to ask the council what law prohibits the recording of a PUBLIC workshop (that cost over $100K in tax money)? They relented and allowed the reporter to stay.
---------------------------------------
The Environmental Defense Fund (paid by NOAA to administer the above referenced workshop), Ocean Conservancy, SOS, Pew Charitible Trust, and other environmental groups call this scare tactics. I call it a methodical, systematic, step by step picking apart of fishing rights. Like the majority of hunters, most Anglers are interested in conservation, and support size limits and closeures WHEN WARRENTED. We also occasionally eat what we catch.

I have been watching our saltwater rights get whittled down year after year. We have been SCREAMING for changes to the surveys for the last 10 years, and STILL they are using the same useless method, always falling back on, "the law required us to act on the 'BEST AVAILABLE SCIENCE' regardless of whether or not that science is flawed".

Unfortunately, for some reason anglers don't want to band together to fight...they want to leave it for someone else, and I must admit that following what is happening is immensely time consuming. That's the point. They know we're not organized, and we don't have the voice. Sure would be nice if we could get one.

My original post was not to suggest that the NRA divert any of it's energy or funds to fishing. It was to see if a fishing arm could be added, because frankly, the NRA scares the Cr-- out of the legislature!

subroc
11-14-2010, 12:13 PM
well anglers have their own organizations. If there is interest, strengthen those organzations so they have some clout. BTW, after the way some bass tournament guys treated us several years back when we attempted, with full authorization, (they refused to leave, held the event up for hours) to close a small section of river for a HT, who cares what happens to them.

fishdogs
11-15-2010, 05:37 PM
well anglers have their own organizations. If there is interest, strengthen those organzations so they have some clout. BTW, after the way some bass tournament guys treated us several years back when we attempted, with full authorization, (they refused to leave, held the event up for hours) to close a small section of river for a HT, who cares what happens to them.

No worries, soon you will need a federal permit and permission to use that same stretch of water! Access to the resource includes hunting, too!