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View Full Version : It's Official: Obama to Sign Gun Control Treaty July 27



J Hoggatt
07-11-2012, 06:50 AM
http://www.reagancoalition.com/articles/2012/20120706002-obama-arms-treaty.html


http://youtu.be/XZeJpXLsVCI

It's Official: Obama to Sign Gun Control Treaty July 27
7/6/12

Obama bypassed Congess to halt deportations. He bypassed Congress to provide massive amounts of aid to Palestine. So why is it so hard for some people to believe Obama is capable of restricting gun ownership?

According to Dick Morris, Obama will sign the Arms Treaty on July 27.



The purpose of which is, according to Morris:

The real purpose of this is that it will set up an international agency that will be in charge of controlling the flow of arms throughout the world. And while it will theoretically have jurisdiction over arms flows across national borders .. you know like the Interstate Commerce Clause... we see how that can be expanded. And it really will have the authority to tell member nations to adopt policies within their own countries to facilitate regulations of flows across borders. And those could include, will include, registration and may well include bans on arms and guns.

Now if this treaty is ratified by the Senate, it assumes parity with the 2nd Amendment. It is as if there is a new 27th or 28th Amendment to the Constitution. Because the Supremacy Clause of the Constitution says treaties are the law of the land and cannot be overriden by acts of Congress or acts of the state legislatures.

For those of us who value the 2nd Amendment right to bear arms, this is absolutely pivotal .. they changed the venue but it is the same fight.

Gerry Clinchy
07-11-2012, 07:49 AM
The UN is the perfect example of good intentions turning out badly.

While they do this arms treaty, they concurrently give Iran a position to give advice on controlling terrorism. Could there be anything more ironic? And Syria advising on human rights. And the US just looks the other way and smiles. How stupid is this?

Franco
07-11-2012, 08:17 AM
When I saw that the story is being attributed to Dick Morris, I decided to do a Fact Check. No one spins a story like Morris;-)

http://factcheck.org/2012/06/still-no-international-gun-ban-treaty/

Being outrageous is how Morris drives readers to his website allowing him to sell more advertising.

zeus3925
07-11-2012, 08:31 AM
http://www.reagancoalition.com/articles/2012/20120706002-obama-arms-treaty.html


http://youtu.be/XZeJpXLsVCI


Now if this treaty is ratified by the Senate, it assumes parity with the 2nd Amendment. It is as if there is a new 27th or 28th Amendment to the Constitution. Because the Supremacy Clause of the Constitution says treaties are the law of the land and cannot be overriden by acts of Congress or acts of the state legislatures.

For those of us who value the 2nd Amendment right to bear arms, this is absolutely pivotal .. they changed the venue but it is the same fight.

Bull roar! A treaty does not overide the Constitution under any circumstance. In addition, the U.S. has made it plain in international circles including the U.N. that our 2nd amendment rights are sacrosanct and can not be taken away by treaty.

M&K's Retrievers
07-11-2012, 09:06 AM
Bull roar! A treaty does not overide the Constitution under any circumstance. In addition, the U.S. has made it plain in international circles including the U.N. that our 2nd amendment rights are sacrosanct and can not be taken away by treaty.

Since when does that matter to Obama?

J Hoggatt
07-11-2012, 10:19 AM
When I saw that the story is being attributed to Dick Morris, I decided to do a Fact Check. No one spins a story like Morris;-)

http://factcheck.org/2012/06/still-no-international-gun-ban-treaty/

Being outrageous is how Morris drives readers to his website allowing him to sell more advertising.

I hope you are right------- but it seems we can't trust this administration at all.........That is my belief at this moment.

Franco
07-11-2012, 10:39 AM
I hope you are right------- but it seems we can't trust this administration at all.........That is my belief at this moment.

I agree with you that this administration can't be trusted. I'll also add that we can't trust the Repubs as well! Lets face it, both parties got us into the mess we are in and the electorate is to blame. Neither party has a workable plan to fix our economy and corrupt monetary system.

IMO, the firat major step we can take forward as Americans is too look beyond party lines and support those brave enough to take on the Big Government establishment in DC. That is not the Tea Party as they are big government, just a different color. We need a third party to arise that represents more of middle America and clean up the mess created by both Dems and Repubs. One that will support The Constitution as written, and restore Capitalism and Free Trade, which we do NOT have.

If we can get that accomplished, everything else will work out just fine.

Uncle Bill
07-11-2012, 12:50 PM
I agree with you that this administration can't be trusted. I'll also add that we can't trust the Repubs as well! Lets face it, both parties got us into the mess we are in and the electorate is to blame. Neither party has a workable plan to fix our economy and corrupt monetary system.

IMO, the firat major step we can take forward as Americans is too look beyond party lines and support those brave enough to take on the Big Government establishment in DC. That is not the Tea Party as they are big government, just a different color. We need a third party to arise that represents more of middle America and clean up the mess created by both Dems and Repubs. One that will support The Constitution as written, and restore Capitalism and Free Trade, which we do NOT have.

If we can get that accomplished, everything else will work out just fine.


So typical. Sour grapes! What we can expect from someone wearing a big hat, but no cattle. If a third party is what you are promoting, why didn't you climb aboard that approach when the little hand grenade with a bad haircut was running?

You can shoot down the Tea Party all you want, but we are the only thing that's willing to fight to rid this nation of the lefties. Romney wasn't our choice. This is NOT an election to choose Romney, it's an election to throw out Obama. You can stand on the sidelines and roar all you want about how you and what you believe in should be followed, but as yet, that view has no traction. Be as self righteous as you want...but understand that regardless of how correct your thinking might be, it's way off the grid as to being realistic.

Libertarianism is all well and good, but hellsbells, we can't even get this nation of fools to embrace conservatism, let alone move everyone 'further' right. You can climb aboard your soapbox and harp all you want about where the nation needs to go, but right now, we will be lucky to just remove the cancer in the White House, let alone fixing "everything that ails us."

Getting back to the topic the initial originator of this thread brought up... it's just a small step in attempting to protect a basic freedom we have always had, but must fight for constantly...now from a different angle. I posted the gist of this problem a while ago, but was chided for agreeing with a request from Rand Paul. How my concern about this oligarchy attempting to take away our 2nd amendment rights, regardless of who's on the same page or I agree with, is frankly puzzling to me. Why wouldn't I agree with Rand Paul on this issue?

Here's an excerpt of his statement:

"If passed by the UN and ratified by the U.S. Senate, the UN Small Arms Treaty would almost certainly FORCE the U.S. to:




***
Enact tougher licensing requirements, making law-abiding Americans cut through even more bureaucratic red tape just to own a firearm legally;





***
CONFISCATE and DESTROY ALL "unauthorized" civilian firearms (all firearms owned by the government are excluded, of course);





***
BAN the trade, sale and private ownership of ALL semi-automatic weapons;





***
Create an INTERNATIONAL gun registry, setting the stage for full-scale gun CONFISCATION.





I'm sure I don't have to tell you that this is NOT a fight we can afford to lose.

Ever since its founding 65 years ago, the United Nations has been hell-bent on bringing the United States to its knees.

To the petty dictators and one-world socialists who control the UN, the United States of America isn't a "shining city on a hill" -- it's an affront to their grand designs for the globe.

These anti-gun globalists know that so long as Americans remain free to make our own decisions without being bossed around by big government bureaucrats, they'll NEVER be able to seize the worldwide power they crave.

And the UN's apologists also know the most effective way to finally strip you and me of ALL our freedoms would be to DESTROY our gun rights.

That's why I was so glad to hear that the National Association for Gun Rights is leading the fight to stop this assault on our Constitution!"

This was actually a plea from Rand Paul soliciting donations for the NAGR, a group I'm a member of, and encourage others on this BB to join. It's in our self interest to belong to such organizations for obvious reasons.

This is not the total war, but it IS a battle we must win. It's inconceivable to me that anyone involved with retrievers, weather used for trials, or tests, or just hunting, can not see this regime's intent to take away our gun-owning rights. When Hillary signs that UN treaty, this nation will be bound by that until we have a Congress that will deny it, and that won't happen with the messiah-in-power, and his minions in charge. And this matters not who brought it to your attention...Dick Morris is just as good as anyone else, and I thank him for bringing it to the attention of any gun owner that reads his column, Franco's views of him notwithstanding.

UB

luvmylabs23139
07-11-2012, 01:18 PM
Good news is it would actually require 2/3 of the senate for it to really be official. Hilery's signature is not worth the ink it is signed with.

Buzz
07-11-2012, 01:21 PM
Fear mongering...

shawninthesticks
07-11-2012, 01:38 PM
I agree with you that this administration can't be trusted. I'll also add that we can't trust the Repubs as well! Lets face it, both parties got us into the mess we are in and the electorate is to blame. Neither party has a workable plan to fix our economy and corrupt monetary system.

IMO, the firat major step we can take forward as Americans is too look beyond party lines and support those brave enough to take on the Big Government establishment in DC. That is not the Tea Party as they are big government, just a different color. We need a third party to arise that represents more of middle America and clean up the mess created by both Dems and Repubs. One that will support The Constitution as written, and restore Capitalism and Free Trade, which we do NOT have.

If we can get that accomplished, everything else will work out just fine.

How can this be done?I've never been to political but I have been trying to pay closer attention to whats is going on in our country and it drives me crazy that I cant find a news station that reports on the facts in a non bias way.I am neither rep/dem.as I see faults on both sides and believe that our options are horrible. We shouldnt have to say "well this is our best choice" because they have the capital to over power the less financially stable man and buy the votes.So I to believe that something/someone different is needed. What is the answer? Both sides IMO seem more concered about voting with their party or belittling the opposite instead of voting on what is best for the people. Their motives are not whats best for us but whats best for keeping their party in control. Frusrtated regards!

Uncle Bill
07-11-2012, 01:59 PM
Good news is it would actually require 2/3 of the senate for it to really be official. Hilery's signature is not worth the ink it is signed with.

Not necessarily. International treatys have some unintended circumstances at times. While needing Senate ratification for removing the 2nd amendment, consider the manufacturers. The Treaties carry some ramifications that must be adherred to before they get overturned.

Here was a warning in Reuters last spring.

UB


The Full Article Here:
http://www.reuters.com/article/politicsNews/idUSTRE59E0Q92009101

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The United States reversed policy on Wednesday
and said it would back launching talks on a treaty to regulate arms
sales as long as the talks operated by consensus, a stance critics
said gave every nation a veto.

The decision, announced in a statement released by the U.S. State
Department, overturns the position of former President George W.
Bush's administration, which had opposed such a treaty on the grounds
that national controls were better.

On Wednesday Obama Took the First Major Step in a Plan to Ban All
Firearms in the United States. The Obama administration intends to
force gun control and a complete ban on all weapons for US citizens
through the signing of international treaties with foreign nations. By
signing international treaties on gun control, the Obama
administration can use the US State Department to bypass the normal
legislative process in Congress.

Once the US Government signs these
international treaties, all US citizens will be subject to those gun
laws created by foreign governments. These are laws that have been
developed and promoted by organizations such as the United Nations and
individuals such as George Soros and Michael Bloomberg. The laws are
designed and intended to lead to the complete ban and confiscation of
all firearms.

The Obama administration is attempting to use tactics and methods of
gun control that will inflict major damage to our 2nd Amendment before
US citizens even understand what has happened. Obama can appear before
the public and tell them that he does not intend to pursue any
legislation (in the United States) that will lead to new gun control
laws, while cloaked in secrecy, his Secretary of State, Hillary
Clinton is committing the US to international treaties and foreign gun
control laws.

Does that mean Obama is telling the truth? What it means
is that there will be no publicized gun control debates in the media
or votes in Congress. We will wake up one morning and find that the
United States has signed a treaty that prohibits firearm and
ammunition manufacturers from selling to the public. We will wake up
another morning and find that the US has signed a treaty that
prohibits any transfer of firearm ownership. And then, we will wake up
yet another morning and find that the US has signed a treaty that
requires US citizens to deliver any firearm they own to the local
government collection and destruction center or face imprisonment.

This is not a joke nor a false warning. As sure as government health
care will be forced on us by the Obama administration through whatever
means necessary, so will gun control.

Franco
07-11-2012, 02:07 PM
How can this be done?I've never been to political but I have been trying to pay closer attention to whats is going on in our country and it drives me crazy that I cant find a news station that reports on the facts in a non bias way.I am neither rep/dem.as I see faults on both sides and believe that our options are horrible. We shouldnt have to say "well this is our best choice" because they have the capital to over power the less financially stable man and buy the votes.So I to believe that something/someone different is needed. What is the answer? Both sides IMO seem more concered about voting with their party or belittling the opposite instead of voting on what is best for the people. Their motives are not whats best for us but whats best for keeping their party in control. Frusrtated regards!

You are not alone and a part of the fastest growing segment of voters, Independents. IMO, the Dems have moved far to the left and the Repubs far to the right and like you, I can't identify with either platform. Both represent out of control government.

Trust your gut, when it comes to candidates no matter which party they belong to. The media generally ignores the ones telling the truth. And, beware of those candidates promising freebees. We are in a tough financial situation and there is no painless cure.

This country won't be able to continue very much longer financially with what both parties are offering. Neither has the balls to be honest with the American people or they just don't understand the problems they have created. Politicians have been buying votes for too long on the backs of the American tax payer. Time for some Tough Love from all concerned or we can continue down the path to nowhere!

In regards to where to get the news straight, that is a tough one. I spend most of my time watching Fox Business Channel (not to be confused with Fox News) and Bloomberg TV. I do watch CNN and MSNBC too. It is the only way of getting both sides, then use your gut to determine what is real and what isn't. Or, you'll wind up like UB;-) And, I read many political sites for balance and perspective.


Buzz, yes it is fear mongering from Morris. How dare anyone attempt to stop the Russians from selling AK47's and other assualt type weapons to Muslim terrorist! Though the assault weapons of choice in the future will be made in China.

Here ya go UB, just for you...
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s480x480/556506_10150942833870954_1633595314_n.jpg

charly_t
07-11-2012, 03:11 PM
How can this be done?I've never been to political but I have been trying to pay closer attention to whats is going on in our country and it drives me crazy that I cant find a news station that reports on the facts in a non bias way.I am neither rep/dem.as I see faults on both sides and believe that our options are horrible. We shouldnt have to say "well this is our best choice" because they have the capital to over power the less financially stable man and buy the votes.So I to believe that something/someone different is needed. What is the answer? Both sides IMO seem more concered about voting with their party or belittling the opposite instead of voting on what is best for the people. Their motives are not whats best for us but whats best for keeping their party in control. Frusrtated regards!

Ditto ! I think a lot of people feel and think this way. I well remember being on a horse ( when I was a child ) that had decided to run and did........I had no control ( was scared spitless ) and that is exactly how I feel now.........we have NO control.

Eric Johnson
07-11-2012, 06:55 PM
"Reid v. Covert, 354 U.S. 1 (1957), was a landmark United States Supreme Court case in which the Court ruled that the Constitution supersedes international treaties ratified by the United States Senate. According to the decision, "this Court has regularly and uniformly recognized the supremacy of the Constitution over a treaty," although the case itself was with regard to an executive agreement, not a "treaty" in the U.S. legal sense, and the agreement itself has never been ruled unconstitutional."

Cody Covey
07-12-2012, 09:54 AM
The signing of a treaty means absolutely nothing without congress. There is no point in time when they have to follow it until overturned. If congress doesn't approve of the treaty via a vote it doesn't exist no matter who signs it. And thankfully our current congress would never be able to approve this.