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Uncle Bill
09-10-2012, 11:45 AM
...BUT...I wonder how many of those Obama voters, like Paul, Buzz, Sambo, Blackstone etc., even have a clue what putting that empty suit back in office will cost them???

Wanna "fact check" these numbers? Be my guest.

"The federal tax system is about to start robbing graves again," warns Byron King, referring to what he dubs the "Countdown to Taxmageddon"

Yesterday, we had Byron over to explain what we have to (not) look forward to come New Year's Day. Today, he's back and ready to discuss what this means for you... and what you can do about it before it's too late.

You might want to pour a stiff drink before we begin...

http://agorafinancial.com/temp/timestamps/z0015.gif "Pretty much the entire U.S. workforce will take a pay cut of at least a few percent," says Byron -- assuming Congress does nothing before then.

"I suspect that when people see their January paychecks," he writes, "the paychecks with all the missing money -- they'll be collectively furious."

But it's not only the raw percentage of your taxable income at stake. "The end of Bush-era tax rates also impacts itemized deductions and personal exemptions," explains Byron. "That is, we'll experience dramatic changes to phaseouts and limitations. Thus, individual taxpayers, and many households, will lose some or all current personal exemptions and deductions, including mortgage interest, charitable contributions and more."

Meanwhile, the "employee portion" of Social Security tax -- 4.2% the last two years -- goes back to 6.2%. "This will hit everyone, down to the minimum-wage lunch ladies at the school cafeteria. Don't think that they won't notice.

"Also," Byron continues, "the new 3.8% health care tax will apply to all wages. This tax increase will increase the current Medicare hit on individuals from 2.9% to 3.8%. So if you work and receive a paycheck, the ‘employee portion' of your Medicare tax will increase from 1.45% to 2.35%. Your employer's portion will remain the same at 1.45%.

"Here's a table that illustrates the impact on a couple that brings home over $250,000 per year. In addition to the restored 2% FICA tax, this couple could be subject to marginal federal tax rates as high as 44.3% -- a 26% increase in effective tax rates just on the affected income -- with possibly higher state and local taxes on top of that.

http://5minforecast.agorafinancial.com/files/2012/09/5min_090712_chart3.gif

http://agorafinancial.com/temp/timestamps/z0045.gif "Meanwhile, for savers and investors," Byron continues as we try to catch our breath, "absent any legislative changes, more key tax rates will kick upward in 2013.

"Right away, taxes on passive, ordinary income, such as interest and dividends, will increase from 35% to 43.4%, including the health care tax," he says of earners in the highest bracket. "It's a big hit, considering that most dividend money has already been taxed before getting paid out, at state and federal corporate rates.

"The long-term capital gain rate will increase from 15% to 23.8%. This includes a basic capital gain increase from 15% to 20%, as well as a new 3.8% ‘health care tax' on interest, dividends and other passive income realized by ‘high earners' -- individuals earning more than $200,000 per year, or $250,000 for married taxpayers."

The estate and gift tax will also increase in 2013. Currently, the estate and gift tax exclusion is $5 million per person -- $10 million for a surviving spouse. Above that level, any excess is subject to a federal estate tax of 35%.

But unless the tax laws change, the maximum estate and gift tax rate will increase from 35% to 55% on Jan. 1, 2013. Worse, the exclusion reverts from $5 million to merely $1 million.

"Think about that $1 million exclusion," Byron implores. "If you own real estate such as a farm or a house in an upscale neighborhood or a couple of rental properties somewhere, you might be there now. Add in your personal property like cars, furnishings and such, plus bank and brokerage accounts. And don't forget that life insurance often winds up getting counted against that estate tax exclusion. It's not difficult for an ‘average' estate to exceed $1 million.

"Hunker down," says Byron, checking our pulse, "because this is going to get worse before it gets better."

With this in mind, Byron's recommendation in the current issue of Outstanding Investments pinpoints a company he says "pays you in what's essentially nontaxable dividends." Not a subscriber yet? Access here. (http://clicks.dailyreckoning.com//t/AQ/AAw8Rg/AAxQ5g/AAdBNA/AQ/AnzL8g/Eh7V)

UB

paul young
09-10-2012, 11:51 AM
I never said who I'm voting for, Bill. Those were not the poll parameters.-Paul

Uncle Bill
09-10-2012, 11:53 AM
Realizing the lefties and some of the so-called "astutes" don't want to hear anything from the mouth of Dick Morris, but you should at least listen to what his numbers are should the 'messiah' get re-elected. I know what it will mean to a retired individual like me, especially when Obamacare is the law of the land. I won't be able to afford to survive. YES IT WILL BE THAT BAD!!!

But the Democrat bastards have no thought as to what they will foist on this nation.

Since you don't seem to give a FRA about what will happen to your 2nd Amendment rights, will you care what happens to your earnings?

I frankly couldn't care less what you ignoramuses buy into, but you might want to listen so you at least have a clue as to what you wish to refute.

http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=-wIfI2whjiM

UB

Franco
09-10-2012, 12:13 PM
If you are going to send Obama packing, then you are going to have to do better than this!
http://www.examiner.com/article/on-nbc-sunday-romney-flip-flops-on-obamacare-blasts-congressional-republicans

Blackstone
09-10-2012, 02:33 PM
I never said who I was voting for either!

Cody Covey
09-10-2012, 02:47 PM
If you are going to send Obama packing, then you are going to have to do better than this!
http://www.examiner.com/article/on-nbc-sunday-romney-flip-flops-on-obamacare-blasts-congressional-republicans

One of the worst articles I have seen. He was saying when he lays out his alternative those provisions would be things he would push for. He has consistently said that he would eliminate Obama care but also that he would put something better in its place that wasn't a large government grab for power....there is no flip flop...nothing to see here....

gmhr1
09-10-2012, 02:47 PM
Why does Valerie Jarrett get full time secret service protection? Even while shes on vacation at Marthas vineyard. Obama just throws the money away no wonder we are 16 trillion dollars in debt. This is ridiculous Wonder if Sandra Fluke now get body guards as well?

huntinman
09-10-2012, 06:36 PM
Why does Valerie Jarrett get full time secret service protection? Even while shes on vacation at Marthas vineyard. Obama just throws the money away no wonder we are 16 trillion dollars in debt. This is ridiculous Wonder if Sandra Fluke now get body guards as well?

Maybe not, but she does have a lifetime supply of condoms...

murral stark
09-10-2012, 07:19 PM
...BUT...I wonder how many of those Obama voters, like Paul, Buzz, Sambo, Blackstone etc., even have a clue what putting that empty suit back in office will cost them???

Wanna "fact check" these numbers? Be my guest.

"The federal tax system is about to start robbing graves again," warns Byron King, referring to what he dubs the "Countdown to Taxmageddon"

Yesterday, we had Byron over to explain what we have to (not) look forward to come New Year's Day. Today, he's back and ready to discuss what this means for you... and what you can do about it before it's too late.

You might want to pour a stiff drink before we begin...

http://agorafinancial.com/temp/timestamps/z0015.gif "Pretty much the entire U.S. workforce will take a pay cut of at least a few percent," says Byron -- assuming Congress does nothing before then.

"I suspect that when people see their January paychecks," he writes, "the paychecks with all the missing money -- they'll be collectively furious."

But it's not only the raw percentage of your taxable income at stake. "The end of Bush-era tax rates also impacts itemized deductions and personal exemptions," explains Byron. "That is, we'll experience dramatic changes to phaseouts and limitations. Thus, individual taxpayers, and many households, will lose some or all current personal exemptions and deductions, including mortgage interest, charitable contributions and more."

Meanwhile, the "employee portion" of Social Security tax -- 4.2% the last two years -- goes back to 6.2%. "This will hit everyone, down to the minimum-wage lunch ladies at the school cafeteria. Don't think that they won't notice.

"Also," Byron continues, "the new 3.8% health care tax will apply to all wages. This tax increase will increase the current Medicare hit on individuals from 2.9% to 3.8%. So if you work and receive a paycheck, the ‘employee portion' of your Medicare tax will increase from 1.45% to 2.35%. Your employer's portion will remain the same at 1.45%.

"Here's a table that illustrates the impact on a couple that brings home over $250,000 per year. In addition to the restored 2% FICA tax, this couple could be subject to marginal federal tax rates as high as 44.3% -- a 26% increase in effective tax rates just on the affected income -- with possibly higher state and local taxes on top of that.

http://5minforecast.agorafinancial.com/files/2012/09/5min_090712_chart3.gif

http://agorafinancial.com/temp/timestamps/z0045.gif "Meanwhile, for savers and investors," Byron continues as we try to catch our breath, "absent any legislative changes, more key tax rates will kick upward in 2013.

"Right away, taxes on passive, ordinary income, such as interest and dividends, will increase from 35% to 43.4%, including the health care tax," he says of earners in the highest bracket. "It's a big hit, considering that most dividend money has already been taxed before getting paid out, at state and federal corporate rates.

"The long-term capital gain rate will increase from 15% to 23.8%. This includes a basic capital gain increase from 15% to 20%, as well as a new 3.8% ‘health care tax' on interest, dividends and other passive income realized by ‘high earners' -- individuals earning more than $200,000 per year, or $250,000 for married taxpayers."

The estate and gift tax will also increase in 2013. Currently, the estate and gift tax exclusion is $5 million per person -- $10 million for a surviving spouse. Above that level, any excess is subject to a federal estate tax of 35%.

But unless the tax laws change, the maximum estate and gift tax rate will increase from 35% to 55% on Jan. 1, 2013. Worse, the exclusion reverts from $5 million to merely $1 million.

"Think about that $1 million exclusion," Byron implores. "If you own real estate such as a farm or a house in an upscale neighborhood or a couple of rental properties somewhere, you might be there now. Add in your personal property like cars, furnishings and such, plus bank and brokerage accounts. And don't forget that life insurance often winds up getting counted against that estate tax exclusion. It's not difficult for an ‘average' estate to exceed $1 million.

"Hunker down," says Byron, checking our pulse, "because this is going to get worse before it gets better."

With this in mind, Byron's recommendation in the current issue of Outstanding Investments pinpoints a company he says "pays you in what's essentially nontaxable dividends." Not a subscriber yet? Access here. (http://clicks.dailyreckoning.com//t/AQ/AAw8Rg/AAxQ5g/AAdBNA/AQ/AnzL8g/Eh7V)

UB

Pretty simple. all congress has to do is renew the tax breaks for those under 250K and let the ones over 250K expire.

caryalsobrook
09-10-2012, 07:28 PM
Pretty simple. all congress has to do is renew the tax breaks for those under 250K and let the ones over 250K expire.

You care to say what difference that would make in the deficit and the increase in the debt? that answer would be interesting!:rolleyes:

murral stark
09-10-2012, 07:39 PM
You care to say what difference that would make in the deficit and the increase in the debt? that answer would be interesting!:rolleyes:

I'll answer that question with a question. Would you care to say what difference that would make in the deficit and the increase in debt it would make if you don't tax the higher wage earners more and leave the lower wage earners alone? I am not a banker but I would think that if you get more tax money from the people that can afford the extra tax, that would help something out. The tax breaks the big earners are getting now is not creating jobs, only making them richer. As you can tell, I am in the under 250K tax bracket. I'm actually under the $50K tax bracket.:cool:

caryalsobrook
09-10-2012, 07:59 PM
I'll answer that question with a question. Would you care to say what difference that would make in the deficit and the increase in debt it would make if you don't tax the higher wage earners more and leave the lower wage earners alone? I am not a banker but I would think that if you get more tax money from the people that can afford the extra tax, that would help something out. The tax breaks the big earners are getting now is not creating jobs, only making them richer. As you can tell, I am in the under 250K tax bracket. I'm actually under the $50K tax bracket.:cool:

Just to give you some perspective as to the magnatude of the deficit, let me give you some figures. the impact of raising income tax on those making over $250,000 would amount to something like this. Asuming that they would continue to spend the same, investment would decrease since savings are indeed investment in some form, and the economy would not get any worse, the increase in taxes would cover about 4-6 days of the year that the government has to borrow money to pay its bills. That would leave about 145 days of the year that they would STILL have to borrow money to pay their bills.

Now if yo truly wanted the balance the budget with tax increases and assuming that the economy would be no worse and also asuming that the interest rate would remain at about 0%(I left out this assumption when raising taxes), then EVERYBODIES'S taxes would have to be raised about 50%. I don't make $250,000/year either. If you now pay $1,000 in taxes, your taxes would have to go up to $1,500. THAT is the perspective you should think about. THAT is what you should realize when the polititians talk about the budget. THAT is the enormanity of the problem.


I think that might change your perspective.

Let me add; there are 60% less people that make over 10 million a year. there ar3 40% less people that make over 1 million a year. I do not make over $250,000 per year but I do know that if we continue down this road THERE WILL ONLY BE THOSE THAT MAKE LESS THAN $50,000 PER YEAR. And then YOU will be the rich they are talking about!!!

Ken Bora
09-10-2012, 08:07 PM
I never said who I'm voting for, Bill. Those were not the poll parameters.-Paul


I never said who I was voting for either!
We (the rtf collective) have great issue with reading comprehension, at times. The last give away by Chris of a new sponsors training vid and my last effort to give away maple syrup are prime examples. I applauded both of you for being able to understand my poll. And Franco I absolutely love your Don Quixote isk voting attitude. However, in the poll I started I felt we, (again the rtf collective) had resigned ourselves to the fact that the coming election was between the two I listed. That is why I listed no 3rd. Just to clear that up.

Uncle Bill
09-10-2012, 08:07 PM
I'll answer that question with a question. Would you care to say what difference that would make in the deficit and the increase in debt it would make if you don't tax the higher wage earners more and leave the lower wage earners alone? I am not a banker but I would think that if you get more tax money from the people that can afford the extra tax, that would help something out. The tax breaks the big earners are getting now is not creating jobs, only making them richer. As you can tell, I am in the under 250K tax bracket. I'm actually under the $50K tax bracket.:cool:

YOU??? UNDER $50K??? Ya coulda knocked me over with a feather.:confused:

I was actually going to answer this, but I just don't have the strength. Besides, anyone named Murral, that has to have a sig line trying to convince all he's a he, has my sympathies. But Hey, in this era of same sex marriage, things are looking up, so keep waving that Democrat flag, and braying for Obama, and good things are bound to happen right there in cheesehead land. (where does your state find these dudes, Stan?)

UB

Ken Bora
09-10-2012, 08:12 PM
(where does your state find these dudes, Stan?)

UB

branching off, has Stan posted in the last few days? **************
hope he didnt fall off of the bike or something.

edit- I expected him to type on the thread I started with a poll.
edit why- I re-read and knew some here would take that the wrong way and jump on it!

Uncle Bill
09-10-2012, 08:25 PM
branching off, has Stan posted in the last few days? **************
hope he didnt fall off of the bike or something.

edit- I expected him to type on the thread I started with a poll.
edit why- I re-read and knew some here would take that the wrong way and jump on it!

Agreed! I haven't heard from him recently either.

BTW, Ken, I appreciate your Boorstin quote. How succinctly it fits this message board.

I've had a TR favorite...a little more 'wordy'...that I've always wanted to post here, but keep forgetting. Now seems like the appropriate time and spot.

UB



"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, and spends himself in a worthy cause; who, at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."

Ken Bora
09-10-2012, 08:29 PM
that is a good one Bill

murral stark
09-10-2012, 08:33 PM
YOU??? UNDER $50K??? Ya coulda knocked me over with a feather.:confused:

I was actually going to answer this, but I just don't have the strength. Besides, anyone named Murral, that has to have a sig line trying to convince all he's a he, has my sympathies. But Hey, in this era of same sex marriage, things are looking up, so keep waving that Democrat flag, and braying for Obama, and good things are bound to happen right there in cheesehead land. (where does your state find these dudes, Stan?)


UB

I think I told you before, I am actually from your state. So they found me in Mitchell, SD. I think you should go back and read a post that BobMalinari posted to me. some people actually thought that Murral was a girls name. I kinda posted something pretty close to what you just posted and was chastised for it. Not really chastised, just enlightened. I suggested someone from the NW might be part of the rainbow brigade. Now you are here saying the same thing about me. What is your meaning of me being below $50 that could've knocked you over with a feather?
Bob, could you please re-post what you addressed to me, except change the name from me to Uncle Bill?

JDogger
09-10-2012, 08:37 PM
I understood your poll, Ken, Hence I voted for the mittens to win. Personally I will not vote for him and Ryan. I believe that what ever happens Nov 6th, the forces of the TP and the GOP will conspire to steal what would be a popular election. (It's happened before.)
Regardless of the outcome, nothing will substantially change.

PS Bill if you care to call me 'angry'....no one can hold a candle to you based on your posts today.

'Just sayin'.... (where have I heard that before?)

JDogger

Ken Bora
09-10-2012, 08:41 PM
I take credit for it, it was I that thought Murral was a girl.
See you are a brand new feller and were being a dork.
So... that was that.
Uncle Bill has been here forever and we all know he is a dork. So when he types the same as you typed it is more of a ducks back and water type of thing. If that makes any sence. Actualy it dosen't to me and I just typed it. Lets just say that is the way it is.

murral stark
09-10-2012, 08:53 PM
I take credit for it, it was I that thought Murral was a girl.
See you are a brand new feller and were being a dork.
So... that was that.
Uncle Bill has been here forever and we all know he is a dork. So when he types the same as you typed it is more of a ducks back and water type of thing. If that makes any sence. Actualy it dosen't to me and I just typed it. Lets just say that is the way it is.
I have toned my stuff down and am just trying to be civil and have fun. I don't think I have disrespected him in the past. Just because he's been here forever, and I have not, does that give him a free pass to insult me? If that's the way the rules go, I guess I'll just put in my time so I can call people names in the future.

Ken Bora
09-10-2012, 09:05 PM
from all reports Bill is a wonderfull feller whos dogs love him. But Bill on POTUS is the king of the cut and paste and if you argue with him he will drop to the mud quicker than a hog on a hot summer day. More than one have called him about this. Some places might make you do jello shots while doing one arm pushups......... we got Bill?:rolleyes:

murral stark
09-10-2012, 09:15 PM
from all reports Bill is a wonderfull feller whos dogs love him. But Bill on POTUS is the king of the cut and paste and if you argue with him he will drop to the mud quicker than a hog on a hot summer day. More than one have called him about this. Some places might make you do jello shots while doing one arm pushups......... we got Bill?:rolleyes:

Is he just a cantankerous old fart or what?

M&K's Retrievers
09-10-2012, 10:25 PM
Is he just a cantankerous old fart or what?

No, he's not. He is a respected member of this forum who has his opinions like everyone else. You on the other hand are a newbie who shows little or no respect.

murral stark
09-10-2012, 10:43 PM
No, he's not. He is a respected member of this forum who has his opinions like everyone else. You on the other hand are a newbie who shows little or no respect.

Where have I disrespected him to warrant the personal attacks he has thrown at me? when people type things sometimes the meaning of the actual message gets lost and it gets taken the wrong way. Kinda like hazing then. the newbies just have to take the abuse until somebody says it's ok, they can get off the hazing list. I have been putting smilies and stuff in my posts to show that I am fooling around. I have apologized to people for being rude. I think I have been pretty civil lately? Maybe not, it's all opinions.

Franco
09-10-2012, 10:48 PM
It is not about a newbie thing vs him being around RTF a long time. He is about the only one that I know of that gets a pass for name calling. Just remember that people that can't defend their postions resort to name calling. He means well though. You will see it from the far right on this board from the so-called Conservatives.

JDogger
09-10-2012, 10:54 PM
No, he's not. He is a respected member of this forum who has his opinions like everyone else. You on the other hand are a newbie who shows little or no respect.
Mike, I don't think post totals or join dates are completely relevant. Respect is frequently earned not granted. Que No? JD

Blackstone
09-11-2012, 01:48 AM
Mike, I don't think post totals or join dates are completely relevant. Respect is frequently earned not granted. Que No? JD

Exactly! If you don't give any, you probably won't get any, regardless of how long you've been around.

Ken Bora
09-11-2012, 06:40 AM
..... He is about the only one that I know of that gets a pass for name calling. . . . .

we could change that at any time you know.;-)

Chris Atkinson
09-12-2012, 10:37 AM
YOU??? UNDER $50K??? Ya coulda knocked me over with a feather.:confused:

I was actually going to answer this, but I just don't have the strength. Besides, anyone named Murral, that has to have a sig line trying to convince all he's a he, has my sympathies. But Hey, in this era of same sex marriage, things are looking up, so keep waving that Democrat flag, and braying for Obama, and good things are bound to happen right there in cheesehead land. (where does your state find these dudes, Stan?)

UB

Uncle Bill,

This is mean-spirited and hateful.

Knock it off.

OK? (please reply publicly or PM so I know you read this.)

Thanks, Chris

menmon
09-12-2012, 02:06 PM
No, he's not. He is a respected member of this forum who has his opinions like everyone else. You on the other hand are a newbie who shows little or no respect.

He is not respected by me. I tollorate him....he is right and the everyone that disagrees with him is wrong....that simple and if you go against him he belittles you....what more can you say.

huntinman
09-12-2012, 02:08 PM
He is not respected by me. I tollorate him....he is right and the everyone that disagrees with him is wrong....that simple and if you go against him he belittles you....what more can you say.

Let me get my feet off the floor. The S**t is getting deep...

Uncle Bill
09-12-2012, 02:41 PM
Thanks to you folks that have supported my right to say what I do. It comes from a fear of seeing so many in this country that are willing to allow this oligarchy to ruin a great nation...for my offspring and those I love. Realizing those of you that are just thinking it's only another Democrat/Republican election, and believe it shouldn't be viewed as the most important event this nation will go through in our lifetime, you have your head in the sand...you have been hoodwinked...like you were in '08.

I've PM'd Chris as to why I do what I do, and he has allowed me to have the priviledge to continue, with the admonition to stop the name calling. I apologize for my caustic comments.

But I do intend to continue pointing out how small minded those that support and enable this regime to continue ruining a nation I've fought for, and see becoming another Greece, should Obama be given another 4 years.

UB

huntinman
09-12-2012, 02:42 PM
give 'em hell UB