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Franco
11-07-2012, 07:04 AM
Though the GOP's ideas may be closer to fixing the economy, it is their Platform and radicalization that did them in.

That's because they've done a great job of excluding the great majority of Americans. Their social agenda is right out of the Stone Age and the shift to the far right isn't anything the American people wanted a part of. The Tea Party, which says they are about Liberty stands for anything but Liberty. The American people identified candidates like Akin, Murdoch, West and a few others as being what today's GOP is all about. Romney, instead of rejecting the radical right, embraced it and that is why Obama won in a landslide.

Romney and Ryan were not the right candidates, period. They had nothing to say and they could not buy the election. Therefore, we are stuck with Obama for the next four years and unless another party emerges, one that better represents the peope, we are doomed to Dems for the future!

nolefan
11-07-2012, 07:17 AM
What planet are you from? Obama did not win in a landslide, although given the complicity of our media outlets and so-called 'journalists' refusal to do their jobs, it's a miracle that he didn't. Your comments regarding the Tea Party indicate to me that you've sat at home and gathered all your information on that subject from cable television and liberal blogsites rather than actually getting out and becoming informed and making your own decisions. You can certainly disagree with the methods, but the Tea Party is simply about fiscal responsibility and deficit spending, nothing else. Accusations to the contrary simply trumpet your ignorance on the subject.

paul young
11-07-2012, 07:23 AM
303 to 206 is not exactly a squeeker......

HPL
11-07-2012, 07:33 AM
303 to 206 is not exactly a squeeker......

One needs to look at the popular vote, which last I looked was almost a tie.

Franco
11-07-2012, 07:46 AM
What planet are you from? Obama did not win in a landslide, although given the complicity of our media outlets and so-called 'journalists' refusal to do their jobs, it's a miracle that he didn't. Your comments regarding the Tea Party indicate to me that you've sat at home and gathered all your information on that subject from cable television and liberal blogsites rather than actually getting out and becoming informed and making your own decisions. You can certainly disagree with the methods, but the Tea Party is simply about fiscal responsibility and deficit spending, nothing else. Accusations to the contrary simply trumpet your ignorance on the subject.

The proof is in the pudding and the Teas are not about Fiscal responsibility or the deficit! If they were, they wouldn't have backed Satorum in the Primaries. A candidate that never met a spending bill or pork project he didn't like. They supported Santorum because he was against birth control! Similar reasons as to why they supported the quacks Akin and Murdoch.

Buzz
11-07-2012, 07:51 AM
Franco, I love to see the denial. It puts a big smile on my face. Hopefully a new more responsible group will rise out of the ashes.

My biggest disappointment last night was seeing that Bachman held her seat. She's batcrap crazy... It boggles my mind.

Henry V
11-07-2012, 07:55 AM
T...., it is their Platform and radicalization that did them in.

That's because they've done a great job of excluding the great majority of Americans. Their social agenda is right out of the Stone Age and the shift to the far right isn't anything the American people wanted a part of. The Tea Party, which says they are about Liberty stands for anything but Liberty. The American people identified candidates like Akin, Murdoch, West and a few others as being what today's GOP is all about. Romney, instead of rejecting the radical right, embraced it and that is why Obama won in a landslide.

Romney and Ryan were not the right candidates, period. They had nothing to say and they could not buy the election. .......

Ding, ding, ding. But fortunately, the true believers on the right will instead blame the media, blame the unions, blame stupid lazy Americans that just want a government hand out, and blame Acorn, oh wait can't that do that anymore. Yes, folks in the echo chamber, keep believing that it was not a decisive victory and that these are the reasons for the loss as you prepare for the next election in two years.

Romney did not win any of his three home states. Ryan's Wisconsin was lost. Numerous Senate seats were lost due to tea party derived candidates again. Virginia, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Colorado,New Hampshire and likely Florida all lost.

The stage was set for Republicans to lose this election in the presidential primary debates when they were all trying to out right-wing each other (which the echo chamber loved) and the last act of past few weeks including 180 degree reversals on numerous issues and out right lies about things like moving jobs to China secured the loss. Mission accomplished.

gmhr1
11-07-2012, 08:00 AM
We are anti abortion that was a big point. Women want their abortions, people are standing with their hands out they want free stuff plus your trying to win 4 million +hispanics that were given what they consider a path to citizenship. Good thing for me my daughter is thrilled. Shes a teacher, she pays 700 a year to belong to the union, she was against romney because of what she feared he would do to reform education, she didnt want to lose her job. So at least shes happy.

Henry V
11-07-2012, 08:06 AM
My biggest disappointment last night was seeing that Bachman held her seat. She's batcrap crazy... It boggles my mind.

Yes she is, and it is difficult to understand how she won, but at least we lost Cravaack and both state houses switched over and both amendments were defeated.

Great to see reality has sunk in for Mitch McConnell. His quotes today include:

The voters have not endorsed the failures or excesses of the President’s first term, they have simply given him more time to finish the job they asked him to do together with (Congress).”
and
Now it’s time for the President to propose solutions that actually have a chance of passing the Republican-controlled House of Representatives and a closely-divided Senate, step up to the plate on the challenges of the moment, and deliver in a way that he did not in his first four years in office. To the extent he wants to move to the political center, which is where the work gets done in a divided government, we’ll be there to meet him half way.
LMFAO

HPL
11-07-2012, 08:10 AM
Yes she is, and it is difficult to understand how she won, but at least we lost Cravaack and both state houses switched over and both amendments were defeated.

Great to see reality has sunk in for Mitch McConnell. His quotes today include: The voters have not endorsed the failures or excesses of the President’s first term, they have simply given him more time to finish the job they asked him to do together with (Congress).” and
Now it’s time for the President to propose solutions that actually have a chance of passing the Republican-controlled House of Representatives and a closely-divided Senate, step up to the plate on the challenges of the moment, and deliver in a way that he did not in his first four years in office. To the extent he wants to move to the political center, which is where the work gets done in a divided government, we’ll be there to meet him half way.





LMFAO

And yet, by what the dems on this board are saying this morning, one would think that Obama now has an overarching mandate and can do as he pleases. Last I looked (about 3 minutes ago) the popular vote was less than 1.5 percentage points apart. That isn't an overwhelming endorsement in my opinion.

Henry V
11-07-2012, 09:07 AM
And yet, by what the dems on this board are saying this morning, one would think that Obama now has an overarching mandate and can do as he pleases. Last I looked (about 3 minutes ago) the popular vote was less than 1.5 percentage points apart. That isn't an overwhelming endorsement in my opinion.

"Mandate" is your word, not mine. You may not want to believe it, but it was a convincing win across the board given today's electoral realities. Just as the election was two years ago.

Mr. "Our goal is to make Obama a one-term President" McConnell acts as if the Obama is the entire problem and that republicans are blameless for the gridlock. Not exactly an olive branch for the next term. Look at the types of bills that the least productive Congress in history passed the past two years. Do you think many of them were anywhere near the "center" or an attempt to meet "half way"? Which ones? The 30+ times they voted to repeal the health care law? Continuing tax breaks for corporations that ship jobs overseas? Defunding planned parenthood? Protecting huge subsidize for big oil? Rejecting infrastructure bills? Weakening consumer protections? Rolling back banking regulations?

Hopefully, politics will be set aside enough to focus on important things like implementing key elements of the Simpson Bowles plan to reduce the deficit and debt, doing some progressive tax reform, constructive entitlement reform, etc. If not, we are screwed and both parties will be to blame.

HPL
11-07-2012, 09:14 AM
"Mandate" is your word, not mine. You may not want to believe it, but it was a convincing win across the board given today's electoral realities. Just as the election was two years ago.

Mr. "Our goal is to make Obama a one-term President" McConnell acts as if the Obama is the entire problem and that republicans are blameless for the gridlock. Not exactly an olive branch for the next term. Look at the types of bills that the least productive Congress in history passed the past two years. Do you think many of them were anywhere near the "center" or an attempt to meet "half way"? Which ones? The 30+ times they voted to repeal the health care law? Continuing tax breaks for corporations that ship jobs overseas? Defunding planned parenthood? Protecting huge subsidize for big oil? Rejecting infrastructure bills? Weakening consumer protections? Rolling back banking regulations?

Hopefully, politics will be set aside enough to focus on important things like implementing key elements of the Simpson Bowles plan to reduce the deficit and debt, doing some progressive tax reform, constructive entitlement reform, etc. If not, we are screwed and both parties will be to blame.

You speak as if gridlock is a bad thing. When someone is trying to move things in a way that I feel is very wrong, if I can't turn them around, then at least I want to hold them where they are. With the current admin, I applaud the reps ability to achieve what you are terming gridlock. As least we aren't proceeding down the wrong path. Any good outdoorsman knows that when you are truly lost, the best action is to hold your position until help arrives.

duckheads
11-07-2012, 09:16 AM
The GOP is dead but there are 30 states with GOP governers including NC which hasn't had a GOP governer in a long time.

Hey Franco tell us how many Libertarians got into office yesterday? I seem to have missed that number.

paul young
11-07-2012, 09:21 AM
And yet, by what the dems on this board are saying this morning, one would think that Obama now has an overarching mandate and can do as he pleases. Last I looked (about 3 minutes ago) the popular vote was less than 1.5 percentage points apart. That isn't an overwhelming endorsement in my opinion.

I've read everyone's posts twice; No one has said what you suggest.

We recently had a President elected who LOST the popular vote, so what's your point?-Paul

luvmylabs23139
11-07-2012, 09:21 AM
The GOP is dead but there are 30 states with GOP governers including NC which hasn't had a GOP governer in a long time.

Hey Franco tell us how many Libertarians got into office yesterday? I seem to have missed that number.

Add to that in NC they also picked up 3 republican seats in the house.

M&K's Retrievers
11-07-2012, 09:27 AM
303 to 206 is not exactly a squeeker......

Do you need to have someone explain the difference between the popular vote and the electoral college?

Franco
11-07-2012, 09:30 AM
The GOP is dead but there are 30 states with GOP governers including NC which hasn't had a GOP governer in a long time.

Hey Franco tell us how many Libertarians got into office yesterday? I seem to have missed that number.

The Libertarian candidates got anywhere from 1.5% to 4%. Considering that they were not covered by the media, they did OK.

You can take all the solice you want in that 30 states have Repub Govs. The bigger picture is the White House and until the GOP is willing to reform, they will only see the place from the outside.

I said long ago here on RTF that after 8 years of Bush, the GOP was done. The GOP has done nothing, zero, zilch to change its image.

Governor Gary Johnson Wins Highest Vote Total Ever for Libertarian for Presidentposted by Staff (http://www.retrievertraining.net/blogs/staff) on Nov 07, 2012
With 97% of precincts reporting, Gov. Gary Johnson for President won 1,140,804 votes for the Libertarian ticket, breaking the 32-year record held by Ed Clark, who won 921,128 votes (1.06%) in 1980.

M&K's Retrievers
11-07-2012, 09:42 AM
The Libertarian candidates got anywhere from 1.5% to 4%. Considering that they were not covered by the media, they did OK.

You can take all the solice you want in that 30 states have Repub Govs. The bigger picture is the White House and until the GOP is willing to reform, they will only see the place from the outside.

I said long ago here on RTF that after 8 years of Bush, the GOP was done. The GOP has done nothing, zero, zilch to change its image.

They managed to get rid of you.;)

Henry V
11-07-2012, 09:45 AM
Statements like these:

We are anti abortion that was a big point. Women want their abortions, people are standing with their hands out they want free stuff plus your trying to win 4 million +hispanics that were given what they consider a path to citizenship. Good thing for me my daughter is thrilled. Shes a teacher, she pays 700 a year to belong to the union, she was against romney because of what she feared he would do to reform education, she didnt want to lose her job. So at least shes happy.
and

You speak as if gridlock is a bad thing. When someone is trying to move things in a way that I feel is very wrong, if I can't turn them around, then at least I want to hold them where they are. With the current admin, I applaud the reps ability to achieve what you are terming gridlock. As least we aren't proceeding down the wrong path. Any good outdoorsman knows that when you are truly lost, the best action is to hold your position until help arrives.

Only will affirm the truth behind the title of this thread.

Franco
11-07-2012, 09:50 AM
Another message from T Boone...

Though I supported another candidate in this election, I congratulate President Obama on his re-election. We should all remember, no matter how divided Americans are during the campaign season, we have one President, and we can only succeed when we come together as a nation to find solutions to our greatest challenges.

In his last State of the Union address, President Obama spoke strongly in support of using America’s natural gas resources to reduce dependence on OPEC oil. I applauded his call for action at the time, and I will be eager to see him turn this promise into a reality during his second term.

I hope that, without the pressures of a re-election campaign bearing down upon him, the President and his new Cabinet will reach out to Americans of all political persuasions; representing all commercial sectors, the environment, those who are focused on social and economic needs and have us all work together to secure our energy future, reduce our dependence on OPEC oil and get our economy moving again.

– T. Boone Pickens

paul young
11-07-2012, 09:51 AM
Do you need to have someone explain the difference between the popular vote and the electoral college?

No, thank you very much for asking, though.

Do you need someone to explain to you how the President of the United States is elected?-Paul

Franco
11-07-2012, 10:20 AM
Obama adds to his Electoral College by winning Florida though it was so close a recount would be in order, if Florida were a deciding state as it was in 2000. He also won the popular vote.



President - National Results


November 07, 2012 - 10:24AM ET




Precincts Reporting: 97%






Name
Party
Votes
Vote %
Electoral Votes Won
States Won


http://hosted.ap.org/static/elections/images/check.gif
Obama
Dem
59,725,608
50
303
26



Romney
GOP
57,098,650
48
206
24



Others

1,848,787
2
0
0

duckheads
11-07-2012, 12:12 PM
Indiana now has a new GOP Governor and just gained a super majority in the house and senate. Seems the GOP is alive and well in Indiana!

RailRoadRetrievers
11-07-2012, 01:26 PM
Though the GOP's ideas may be closer to fixing the economy, it is their Platform and radicalization that did them in.

That's because they've done a great job of excluding the great majority of Americans. Their social agenda is right out of the Stone Age and the shift to the far right isn't anything the American people wanted a part of. The Tea Party, which says they are about Liberty stands for anything but Liberty. The American people identified candidates like Akin, Murdoch, West and a few others as being what today's GOP is all about. Romney, instead of rejecting the radical right, embraced it and that is why Obama won in a landslide.

Romney and Ryan were not the right candidates, period. They had nothing to say and they could not buy the election. Therefore, we are stuck with Obama for the next four years and unless another party emerges, one that better represents the peope, we are doomed to Dems for the future!

What is so radical that is on our platform? Who do we exclude? If we agreed upon the social aspect, then we would be democrats. We did not win this election based solely upon the fact that these people who voted, want FREE STUFF. End of story. They want free birth control, government funded abortions, gay marriage rights, free room and board, free food, free health care...... Problem is, this crap isn't free and if I morally disagree with this I shouldn't be forced to pay for it. If the liberals want to give to this charity, make it private, and let them give. Maybe the Bruce and Bon Jovi can get together and raise money for these people after they "pay" to help those on the east coast.

It is the responsibility of the church to care for its orphans, widows, and those in need, not the State and damn sure not the federal government....

Franco
11-07-2012, 01:39 PM
What is so radical that is on our platform? Who do we exclude? Anyone left of Atilla The Hun If we agreed upon the social aspect, then we would be democrats. And, if you don't agree with the Dems on Social Issues then the GOP will continue on the fast track to obscurity by evidence of this last election. The Fed doesn't belong in social issues and should be focused on The Constitution. Our government is in way too deep in folks personal lives and they need to stop!We did not win this election based solely upon the fact that these people who voted, want FREE STUFF. End of story. Not true and you can not sterotype an entire party or their voters. The GOP lost because they are out of touch with the majority of voters, period. Not to mention that they ran a wishy-washy candidate. They want free birth control, government funded abortions, gay marriage rights, free room and board, free food, free health care...... Problem is, this crap isn't free and if I morally disagree with this I shouldn't be forced to pay for it. I don't agree morally with the wars we've been fighting the last 10 years but my tax dollars still help fund it. That is a part of living in a Republic. We don't get to pick a choose where our tax dollars go. If the liberals want to give to this charity, make it private, and let them give. Maybe the Bruce and Bon Jovi can get together and raise money for these people after they "pay" to help those on the east coast.

And, you are certainly free enough to continue to vote your conscience.

It is the responsibility of the church to care for its orphans, widows, and those in need, not the State and damn sure not the federal government....

My comments in red.

RailRoadRetrievers
11-07-2012, 01:48 PM
A war is a tad bit different then whether or not you want the government to kill your baby on tax dollars or out of your own pocket.....

Society is entitled now, we owe them everything, for nothing, and you can stereotype an entire party and their voters this way, because it was the platform for which the voted and agreed.

I believe states should decide on a lot of these issues and I believe I reside in a state that aligns with my moral convictions, but that is not the case, this things are determined on the federal level, therefore I will side with the nominee that shares the same moral views and views concerning Israel and the nation financially....

murral stark
11-07-2012, 04:24 PM
And yet, by what the dems on this board are saying this morning, one would think that Obama now has an overarching mandate and can do as he pleases. Last I looked (about 3 minutes ago) the popular vote was less than 1.5 percentage points apart. That isn't an overwhelming endorsement in my opinion.

That's why the electoral college needs to go. Let the popular vote decide who wins. Based on the numbers of popular vote, it could be an entirely different outcome. For those of you that think the apocalypse is upon on us, get over it and move on. Continue doing what you currently do. take care of yourself and be happy.

BonMallari
11-07-2012, 04:41 PM
That's why the electoral college needs to go. Let the popular vote decide who wins. Based on the numbers of popular vote, it could be an entirely different outcome. For those of you that think the apocalypse is upon on us, get over it and move on. Continue doing what you currently do. take care of yourself and be happy.


the electoral college cuts both ways....if it was strictly a popular vote , then all a Pres nominee would need to do is win in Calif and NY and maybe TX or Florida and the rest of the country would be insignificant....I dont like that scenario at all...I want more states to matter in a Presidential election not less...it was bad enough that this election came down to the swing states and many states were ignored

fetchtx
11-07-2012, 04:44 PM
Two sources confirmed that if you have your own health care policy that you purchase, all rules and regs from obama care will apply to that policy also, dang I sure hope this is false.

Franco
11-07-2012, 04:47 PM
That's why the electoral college needs to go. Let the popular vote decide who wins. Based on the numbers of popular vote, it could be an entirely different outcome. For those of you that think the apocalypse is upon on us, get over it and move on. Continue doing what you currently do. take care of yourself and be happy.

Solid advice! Nothing is going to change.

Now, the Myan Apocalypse is something to consider as they were uncanny at predicting events.;-)

MooseGooser
11-07-2012, 05:21 PM
Bummed out today for sure..

But,, In reality,,, NOTHING has changed...

I guess thats what I am most bummed about..

But,, I do still expect the Republican Congress to remember WHY they were sent their after the last midterm...

NOTHING has changed...

Gooser

MooseGooser
11-07-2012, 05:25 PM
As far as Our local elections.

The county I live in was redistricted last year..

The redistricting HEAVILY favored democrats..

The district I have been relocated to,, Is Diana Degettes district..

My Republican vote in that distric is meaningless... That District has been Democrat for ever.. It wont change..

The Judge that approved that redistricting Map,, is on my Sh^% List...

We are really looking at moving.. far away,,,, really far.

Bummed again...

Gooser

I am a 59 Yr old Native of Colorado... I can honestly say I have never been more ashamed to say that I am from here...

This is NOT the Colorado I grew up in...

murral stark
11-07-2012, 06:10 PM
the electoral college cuts both ways....if it was strictly a popular vote , then all a Pres nominee would need to do is win in Calif and NY and maybe TX or Florida and the rest of the country would be insignificant....I dont like that scenario at all...I want more states to matter in a Presidential election not less...it was bad enough that this election came down to the swing states and many states were ignored

One of your fellow Republicans was complaining about the electoral college, saying that the popular vote was more even. It is no wonder the republican led congress can't get anything done. The people of the party don't believe the same things. GEEZ

murral stark
11-07-2012, 06:15 PM
Here's the one I was talking about.


"And yet, by what the dems on this board are saying this morning, one would think that Obama now has an overarching mandate and can do as he pleases. Last I looked (about 3 minutes ago) the popular vote was less than 1.5 percentage points apart. That isn't an overwhelming endorsement in my opinion."

And here is another:

One needs to look at the popular vote, which last I looked was almost a tie.

HPL
11-07-2012, 07:15 PM
One of your fellow Republicans was complaining about the electoral college, saying that the popular vote was more even. It is no wonder the republican led congress can't get anything done. The people of the party don't believe the same things. GEEZ

Two things:

1. I was not complaining about the electoral college, nor was I just saying that the popular vote was more even. It is a FACT that the electoral results give a somewhat skewed impression of the actual outcome. Looking at the electoral college outcome, one might be lead to believe that Obama was backed by a nearly overwhelming majority of the voters of the US, when he actually had the backing of a razor thin majority, (even Ohio was nearly tied in the popular vote) not exactly indicating that the country as a whole wants a "FUNDAMENTAL" change. If you were to think of it as a tug of war where one team weighs a collective 1000lbs, then the other team weighs about 986lbs and if the 1000lb team tries to take advantage of the 986lb team they may throw down the rope and pick up rocks.

2. As to me being Republican, although I do vote rep more often than other parties, I consider myself independent and have often cast votes for various libertarian candidates. Clearly my stance on reproductive rights, gay marriage, the environment, and drugs is nothing like what the republican platform espouses. You need to read what I have written more carefully.

BonMallari
11-07-2012, 07:21 PM
One of your fellow Republicans was complaining about the electoral college, saying that the popular vote was more even. It is no wonder the republican led congress can't get anything done. The people of the party don't believe the same things. GEEZ



let me ask this, Is the electoral college a representation of how each state voted, of course not...with the exception of Nebraska and one other state( which escapes me at this time) its winner take all...its the same way with the primary vote, I would rather see a proportional split of delegates based on the overall votes....the way it is now win by one vote or one million and you get the same number of delegates

I would also change the primary process...I dont want states like Iowa and SCarolina (no offense to either) determining who is in or out before I even get a chance to listen to them...do away with the caucus process,its old, archaic and non binding...my solution would be to have primaries done in regions

Larry Thompson1
11-07-2012, 07:31 PM
Bummed out today for sure..

But,, In reality,,, NOTHING has changed...

I guess thats what I am most bummed about..

But,, I do still expect the Republican Congress to remember WHY they were sent their after the last midterm...

NOTHING has changed...

Gooser

I agree nothing has changed. I do believe that change will only come due to civil unrest. If the house will give President Obama what he wants then we will have economic collapse in whitch we will indeed have civil unrest and therfore change will be inevitable. I still believe people must be responsible for thier actions, and the actions of the majority in this country is disturbing. They do not either believe in liberty or do not know what it means, i do not have the answer for that one. I do however believe that all citzens should carry a firearm in so that Darwins theory can be proven.

murral stark
11-07-2012, 07:33 PM
Two things:

1. I was not complaining about the electoral college, nor was I just saying that the popular vote was more even. It is a FACT that the electoral results give a somewhat skewed impression of the actual outcome. Looking at the electoral college outcome, one might be lead to believe that Obama was backed by a nearly overwhelming majority of the voters of the US, when he actually had the backing of a razor thin majority, (even Ohio was nearly tied in the popular vote) not exactly indicating that the country as a whole wants a "FUNDAMENTAL" change. If you were to think of it as a tug of war where one team weighs a collective 1000lbs, then the other team weighs about 986lbs and if the 1000lb team tries to take advantage of the 98lb team they may throw down the rope and pick up rocks.

2. As to me being Republican, although I do vote rep more often than other parties, I consider myself independent and have often cast votes for various libertarian candidates. Clearly my stance on reproductive rights, gay marriage, the environment, and drugs is nothing like what the republican platform espouses. You need to read what I have written more carefully.

I stand corrected.

Bruce L
11-07-2012, 08:27 PM
Ding, ding, ding. But fortunately, the true believers on the right will instead blame the media, blame the unions, blame stupid lazy Americans that just want a government hand out, and blame Acorn, oh wait can't that do that anymore. Yes, folks in the echo chamber, keep believing that it was not a decisive victory and that these are the reasons for the loss as you prepare for the next election in two years.

Romney did not win any of his three home states. Ryan's Wisconsin was lost. Numerous Senate seats were lost due to tea party derived candidates again. Virginia, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Colorado,New Hampshire and likely Florida all lost.

The stage was set for Republicans to lose this election in the presidential primary debates when they were all trying to out right-wing each other (which the echo chamber loved) and the last act of past few weeks including 180 degree reversals on numerous issues and out right lies about things like moving jobs to China secured the loss. Mission accomplished.

Ah c'mon Henry....... the Republicans won most of the confederacy and they had a great message for old white rich guys! They are moving forward, they used to be the anti abortion party and have moved forward to be the anti birth control party. I think the strategy was/is sound they was just robbed, again.