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JDogger
11-28-2012, 10:08 PM
To grasp the reality here folks. The Rebublican, conservative, Tea party brand has been handed their walking papers in the last election. You're done. If the conservative brand ever raises it's head again, it's probably not in this generation. Elections do indeed have consequences. The consequence here is that you have lost. Try not to be to bitter. Time and tides will turn to you again. JD

murral stark
11-28-2012, 10:19 PM
OH BOY!!! This could get interesting. Where's the popcorn? LOL

M&K's Retrievers
11-28-2012, 10:32 PM
To grasp the reality here folks. The Rebublican, conservative, Tea party brand has been handed their walking papers in the last election. You're done. If the conservative brand ever raises it's head again, it's probably not in this generation. Elections do indeed have consequences. The consequence here is that you have lost. Try not to be to bitter. Time and tides will turn to you again. JD

After four more years of this crap, I believe conservatives will be stronger than ever. A lot of things have sucked since Y2K but take a man's Twinkies and your going to have one pissed off electorate. Even those 47 percenters want their Twinkies. Do you have any idea how many Twinkies you can buy on a months worth of food stamps?

Are Moon Pies next??

JDogger
11-28-2012, 10:50 PM
After four more years of this crap, I believe conservatives will be stronger than ever. A lot of things have sucked since Y2K but take a man's Twinkies and your going to have one pissed off electorate. Even those 47 percenters want their Twinkies. Do you have any idea how many Twinkies you can buy on a months worth of food stamps?

Are Moon Pies next??

My dog and I thank you Little Debbie, my pockets and my pack go to the blind full. I do need a new thermos however, the cost of a new cap on line is almost as much....JD

HPL
11-29-2012, 05:41 AM
To grasp the reality here folks. The Rebublican, conservative, Tea party brand has been handed their walking papers in the last election. You're done. If the conservative brand ever raises it's head again, it's probably not in this generation. Elections do indeed have consequences. The consequence here is that you have lost. Try not to be to bitter. Time and tides will turn to you again. JD

JD, this seems a bit schizophrenic to me. First you say that the republicans and the conservative movement are done, then you say that "time and tides will turn to them again". This election was a squeaker. My opinion is that there is very little mandate here. Since the house is still controlled by the republicans, the dems better learn to compromise, and the increase in Rep. governors might indicate that there is still a strong Rep base out there. Almost any perturbation in the economy, foreign affairs, or even the weather could change the body politic. Now, I am not really part of the group that is perceived as the rep base (although I am anti-democrat enough to be a pretty reliable rep). I am pro-choice and pro-environment but anti big government and the last drives my voting most of the time. The religious right has made it more difficult for me to vote Republican lately and in fact in 08 I just couldn't stomach Palin so voted libertarian (although if Texas had been in contention I probably would have held my nose and voted rep).

I feel compelled to add this: You just initiated a thread bemoaning (I think) the lack of civility on the forum and yet this particular topic seems specifically designed to produce rancorous responses. Although civil in on the surface, it appears a bit taunting to me. I can certainly maintain a civil discourse, but surely you were well aware of the reaction this is likely to provoke in some of the regulars here. You should act neither appalled nor offended when the nastyness begins.

PamK
11-29-2012, 10:07 AM
This election was a squeaker.

really????

HPL
11-29-2012, 10:12 AM
really????
Yes, really. Seems to me that the popular vote worked out to something like 51 or 52% to 49 or 48%. That's hardly an overwhelming endorsement for the democrats of a total rejection of the republicans.

luvmylabs23139
11-29-2012, 10:14 AM
To grasp the reality here folks. The Rebublican, conservative, Tea party brand has been handed their walking papers in the last election. You're done. If the conservative brand ever raises it's head again, it's probably not in this generation. Elections do indeed have consequences. The consequence here is that you have lost. Try not to be to bitter. Time and tides will turn to you again. JD

Maybe in the land of liberals where you live but certainly not here in NC. We increased the number of republicans we sent to the House of Representives tossing more Dums to the street.
For the first time in over 150 years we have a fully republican state, the governor, the house, and the senate.

JDogger
11-29-2012, 10:48 AM
Maybe in the land of liberals where you live but certainly not here in NC. We increased the number of republicans we sent to the House of Representives tossing more Dums to the street.
For the first time in over 150 years we have a fully republican state, the governor, the house, and the senate.

Unfortunate. Ask anyone in Kansas. Get ready for slashed services and raised taxes.

luvmylabs23139
11-29-2012, 11:04 AM
Unfortunate. Ask anyone in Kansas. Get ready for slashed services and raised taxes.
The dems were raising taxes every year for many many years. As for slashed services I hope the republicans start slashing like crazy, but likely they will be wimps. Bring on the cuts!!

menmon
11-29-2012, 11:14 AM
Did anyone make note of GDP today 2.7% in the third quarter. Can't call that gloom and doom.

LokiMeister
11-29-2012, 02:45 PM
I think before anyone starts to jump up and down we need to take a sobering look at the mandates that ObamaCare is going to shove down our throats. My 73yo dad just fell and broke his hip. In addition, he has a torn meniscus that hasn't so far responded to surgery. The surgeon that did the hip replacement said he just needs a knee replacement and to get it done before 2014. Why? Because at that point, Medicare might not even allow him to get a knee replacement, too risky, putting him under might put him under for good. Yet, he has no risk factors that would elevate the standard risks that the rest of us have.

Not to mention, a hospital in Madison, Meriter, just announced that they are laying off 140 full time staff because of the upcoming reduced payments for Medicare patients. I foresee a lot of waiting in line for a doctor and declining of procedures because the government doesn't want to pay for them. Be careful national healthcare backers, you just might get what you wished for and not like it.

murral stark
11-29-2012, 04:25 PM
Maybe in the land of liberals where you live but certainly not here in NC. We increased the number of republicans we sent to the House of Representives tossing more Dums to the street.
For the first time in over 150 years we have a fully republican state, the governor, the house, and the senate.

I just saw that the Republican candidate in NC has conceded the election in question. Let us know if it is true, that you actually don't have an all republican state govt.

murral stark
11-29-2012, 04:31 PM
"I foresee a lot of waiting in line for a doctor and declining of procedures because the government doesn't want to pay for them."

How is that any different than what is going on now? The insurance companies tell you what they are going to cover and what they are not. then to get them to pay for a claim, it almost takes an act of God to get any money out of them. Not my personal insurance, but friends of mine have insurance providers that make you jump through all kind of hoops to get them to cover anything.

LokiMeister
11-29-2012, 04:37 PM
"I foresee a lot of waiting in line for a doctor and declining of procedures because the government doesn't want to pay for them."

How is that any different than what is going on now? The insurance companies tell you what they are going to cover and what they are not. then to get them to pay for a claim, it almost takes an act of God to get any money out of them. Not my personal insurance, but friends of mine have insurance providers that make you jump through all kind of hoops to get them to cover anything.

I generally don't have a problem getting in to see a doctor and don't have the problems with the insurance companies like that.

Buzz
11-29-2012, 04:44 PM
I think before anyone starts to jump up and down we need to take a sobering look at the mandates that ObamaCare is going to shove down our throats. My 73yo dad just fell and broke his hip. In addition, he has a torn meniscus that hasn't so far responded to surgery. The surgeon that did the hip replacement said he just needs a knee replacement and to get it done before 2014. Why? Because at that point, Medicare might not even allow him to get a knee replacement, too risky, putting him under might put him under for good. Yet, he has no risk factors that would elevate the standard risks that the rest of us have.

Not to mention, a hospital in Madison, Meriter, just announced that they are laying off 140 full time staff because of the upcoming reduced payments for Medicare patients. I foresee a lot of waiting in line for a doctor and declining of procedures because the government doesn't want to pay for them. Be careful national healthcare backers, you just might get what you wished for and not like it.

Are you paying attention to the debate in Washington right now? Republicans demanding that entitlements be on the table for a deal on the "fiscal cliff." And they were ones scare mongering that Obama is cutting $700 billion out of medicare. What the hell do you think they mean by "entitlement reform" for crying out loud? Oh, I know! Lets make it a voucher system. Then look out trying to pay for dad's knee replacement. Guess what? Were going broke and a big part of the reason is the cost of medical care. Go ahead and blame it on Obama. The fact is we can't afford to pay 17% of GDP on medical care, and no one expects inflation in that market to end there. Why don't you tell us what YOUR solution is? Should we just continue until the house of cards comes down? Good grief...

Buzz
11-29-2012, 04:46 PM
I generally don't have a problem getting in to see a doctor and don't have the problems with the insurance companies like that.

When is the last time you tried to get into a specialist? I had to see a neurologist a few years ago. THREE month wait to get in. My mom recently had to see a nephrologist. Guess what? Two month wait!

But no, we don't have any waiting lists in the good old USA!

murral stark
11-29-2012, 04:47 PM
I generally don't have a problem getting in to see a doctor and don't have the problems with the insurance companies like that.

I don't either. Except if I need to see a specialst. But some of my friends have issues. Not so much getting in to see the doctor, rather getting the insurance company to pay. My very closest friend has cancer and requires lots of lab work. He just got a notice from the insurance company that "it wasn't medically necessary" to have this lab work even though his oncologist ordered the lab work and deemed it medically necessary. If the doctor deems it medically necessary, what's up with the insurance company saying it isn't? Are the people deciding whether they are going to pay or not; doctors or are they just giving an uneducated guess?

LokiMeister
11-29-2012, 04:49 PM
Are you paying attention to the debate in Washington right now? Republicans demanding that entitlements be on the table for a deal on the "fiscal cliff." And they were ones scare mongering that Obama is cutting $700 billion out of medicare. What the hell do you think they mean by "entitlement reform" for crying out loud? Oh, I know! Lets make it a voucher system. Then look out trying to pay for dad's knee replacement. Guess what? Were going broke and a big part of the reason is the cost of medical care. Go ahead and blame it on Obama. The fact is we can't afford to pay 17% of GDP on medical care, and no one expects inflation in that market to end there. Why don't you tell us what YOUR solution is? Should we just continue until the house of cards comes down? Good grief...

I didn't want national health insurance, just like a lot of other people. We are headed down the path to less care overall. I don't know what the solution is, I just know this isn't it. Hate to bring up a lightning rod, but if you want a better health plan we need to look Ron Paul's way and get rid of HMO's, etc.

LokiMeister
11-29-2012, 04:51 PM
I don't either. Except if I need to see a specialst. But some of my friends have issues. Not so much getting in to see the doctor, rather getting the insurance company to pay. My very closest friend has cancer and requires lots of lab work. He just got a notice from the insurance company that "it wasn't medically necessary" to have this lab work even though his oncologist ordered the lab work and deemed it medically necessary. If the doctor deems it medically necessary, what's up with the insurance company saying it isn't? Are the people deciding whether they are going to pay or not; doctors or are they just giving an uneducated guess?

You're going to see even more of this for more treatable ailments.

HPL
11-29-2012, 05:09 PM
I generally don't have a problem getting in to see a doctor and don't have the problems with the insurance companies like that.


Me either.

starjack
11-29-2012, 05:22 PM
My wife works for a insurance company and just talked to a good friend of mines wife she is a nurse . They both say you havent seen nothing yet . and i believe them

luvmylabs23139
11-29-2012, 05:36 PM
I just saw that the Republican candidate in NC has conceded the election in question. Let us know if it is true, that you actually don't have an all republican state govt.
We will have a republican controled state house, state senate and Governor come January!!!

The republican that conceded is for the federal house of representatives. It just means that our representation in the house in DC only flips from 7dems 6 republicans to 9 republicans 4 democrats.

jeff evans
11-29-2012, 05:48 PM
Are you paying attention to the debate in Washington right now? Republicans demanding that entitlements be on the table for a deal on the "fiscal cliff." And they were ones scare mongering that Obama is cutting $700 billion out of medicare. What the hell do you think they mean by "entitlement reform" for crying out loud? Oh, I know! Lets make it a voucher system. Then look out trying to pay for dad's knee replacement. Guess what? Were going broke and a big part of the reason is the cost of medical care. Go ahead and blame it on Obama. The fact is we can't afford to pay 17% of GDP on medical care, and no one expects inflation in that market to end there. Why don't you tell us what YOUR solution is? Should we just continue until the house of cards comes down? Good grief...


When is the last time you tried to get into a specialist? I had to see a neurologist a few years ago. THREE month wait to get in. My mom recently had to see a nephrologist. Guess what? Two month wait!

But no, we don't have any waiting lists in the good old USA!

First of all, I'm glad to see no one took that bait the OP threw out. Buzz, did you watch the judge Judy video? Do you condone that type of misuse of the system? Don't you think we should take a look at how entitlements are being used for the sake of our financial situation? Secondly, a specialist is just that a specialist and there are a fraction of neurologists compared to a general practitioner. There has always been and always will be a wait to see such a specialist. Have you ever waited more than a day or two to see your family doctor?

Brad Turner
11-29-2012, 05:51 PM
When is the last time you tried to get into a specialist? I had to see a neurologist a few years ago. THREE month wait to get in. My mom recently had to see a nephrologist. Guess what? Two month wait!

But no, we don't have any waiting lists in the good old USA!
Come on Buzz. They are "Specialists," there aren't as many of them. This is probably the main reason for your wait.

HPL
11-29-2012, 07:11 PM
I've never had trouble getting in to see the cardiologist, sometimes the day after I call for an appointment. Haven't had unacceptable waits to get my mom in to see the neurologist either, even my wife's rheumatologist is, pretty accessible.

murral stark
11-29-2012, 07:22 PM
We will have a republican controled state house, state senate and Governor come January!!!

The republican that conceded is for the federal house of representatives. It just means that our representation in the house in DC only flips from 7dems 6 republicans to 9 republicans 4 democrats.

Thanks for the clarification. I interpreted your post as you saying there were no democrats representing NC

BOtterness
11-29-2012, 09:09 PM
I have been in hospitals and at appts constantly in the last year--in multiple states. My family has had two kidney transplant surgeries, five cases of cancer between siblings and parents, two hip replacements in parents (had to get them done before the 2014 deadline because according to Obabmacare he would have been too old ) and an emergency bowel obstruction surgery, plus a few other odds and ends. We have amazing health care in America. After a year of this I am exhausted but we have always been able to get into doctors and specialists--sooner if it is an emergency situation--and everyone has always been able to get the health care they need. Yea, sometimes we jump through a few hoops etc. but our health care does an amazing job. So maybe we go to the real problem: the costs. Should people be able to afford health insurance even if it is not a benefit of their employment? Of course. So how do we lower the actual cost of our health care? just putting everyone on insurance does not do that--it loads the health care system without dealing with the true issue. Plus it adds burdens to small businesses that will now be required to provide that. I am not sure how it ever became an assumption that it is an employers responsibility to provide insurance. Why is it not the health care and insurance companies responsibility to make if feasible for everyone to purchase it?
Just some ramblings and food for thought from someone who lives in both worlds--I work under a union but also own a small business with employees.

Buzz
11-30-2012, 04:33 PM
First of all, I'm glad to see no one took that bait the OP threw out. Buzz, did you watch the judge Judy video? Do you condone that type of misuse of the system? Don't you think we should take a look at how entitlements are being used for the sake of our financial situation? Secondly, a specialist is just that a specialist and there are a fraction of neurologists compared to a general practitioner. There has always been and always will be a wait to see such a specialist. Have you ever waited more than a day or two to see your family doctor?


Jeff, sorry for the slow reply. Yes I did watch the Judge Judy video. I can assure you that it ticked me off at least as much is it probably did everyone else. No, I do not condone that misuse of the system. And it really bugged me that they guy was getting so much cash to pay for a degree in music, although I don't know what to do about that. Countries like China dictate who goes to college and what they are suited to do for a living. I don't want to see us go that route.

But I fail to see the connection to folks like those getting social security and medicare. That's what these guys are talking about when they mention entitlements. See the quote below:



WASHINGTON—Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell said he wanted changes to safety-net programs that focus on altering eligibility requirements, and suggested that if Democrats agreed both sides could move closer to a budget deal to avert the fiscal cliff.
In an interview in his Capitol Hill office, Mr. McConnell (R., Ky.) said if the White House agrees to changes such as higher Medicare premiums for the wealthy, an increase in the Medicare eligibility age and a slowing of cost-of-living increases for programs like Social Security, Republicans would agree to include more tax revenue in the deal, though not from higher tax rates.

I know that I'm going to get hit with higher taxes. I know I'm probably going to pay more in SS if the ceiling gets raised. I imagine I'll pay higher Medicare premiums. But what I really disagree with is raising the eligibility age for Medicare. I have had more than one of my cousins end up out of work in this economy and end up taking early retirement. But they were not eligible for Medicare, so they went without coverage and took a chance because they could not afford a personal policy at what they want for a 64 year old. If they follow through with that approach, we're going to see sixty somethings getting sick with no coverage and losing their homes and their retirement savings to medical expensed, mark my word.

And I can see raising the SS eligibility age, but I already will have to work until 67. Working later is fine for guys who sit at a desk and punch keys on a computer and talk on the phone. But what about the guy who does hard labor for a living? By 65, those guy's bodies are wearing out. There has to be a better way...

caryalsobrook
11-30-2012, 10:13 PM
Did anyone make note of GDP today 2.7% in the third quarter. Can't call that gloom and doom.
You forgot to mention that Gov spending was up 9+ percent also. You think that kind of Gov. spending can continue given 2.7% growth in GDP? I have an idea, let't increase gov. spending 10 trillion and then GDP will increase to maybe 20%. Good plan--yep;)