some common sense, please!

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Originally Posted by subroc

dnf777

You’re acting outraged, just as CNN intended. It illustrates, at least to me, that you are driven by left wing outrage. Rather than needing to defend the action, ask them why they are outraged. It appears you believe that gun ownership is a fringe activity or right needing your defense.

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Come on! Gimme a break! I'm not outraged. I'm a NRA lifer for cryin' out loud. There are many people who are not familiar with guns, and when they see this, it paints a bad picture. I think its perfectly legitimate for someone to ask why you need an AR15 in a crowd, near the president. And its hard to answer, if you wouldn't do such a thing yourself. You can say there's no need to defend that right, but I'd rather persuade someone who's undecided to come to "our side" of the gun control issue, than have them swayed by CNN, and those loonies make it harder to do.

Also, out of respect and courtesy to the law-enforcement officers charged with protecting the president and the public, I would not carry a weapon to such a function. They don't know if you're a good law-abiding citizen, or another dude like the LAFitness shooter in Pittsburgh, and will need to dedicate eyes on you, rather than scanning the crowd.

NRA lifer doesn't make anyone a believer in the second amendment at least in my eyes. BTW, I am as well...for the last 25+ years.

When one protests, let’s say abortion, they carry signs whether they are pro life or pro abortion, their sign states their position. In this case, the legal firearm, acted as a sign illustrating the second amendment and gun rights. I expect at a rally or protest that involved obama there was likely many left wingers that have never actually seen a firearm in real life. Their entire view of firearms could actually be movies and left wing propaganda. A leap, I know, but in this case, the secret service paid the incident little interest. They asked the armed citizen a few questions while he was acting in a legal manner as a citizen. When satisfied, they moved on. You should continue to keep this issue alive. This is just what cnn wants you to do. Maybe you could attend an anti-gun rally armed with you NRA life member card. Divide and conquer, it looks like cnn got just what they wanted

This behavior is damaging to the gun rights lobby.

The majority of Americans live in cities, have never hunted, and never owned or fired a gun. Carrying a gun and a sign about watering the tree of liberty isn't going to endear them the concept of gun rights.

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Originally Posted by Buzz

This behavior is damaging to the gun rights lobby.

The majority of Americans live in cities, have never hunted, and never owned or fired a gun. Carrying a gun and a sign about watering the tree of liberty isn't going to endear them the concept of gun rights.

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Nor is it going to hurt the cause. Those that you speak of, have already made up their mind.

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Originally Posted by subroc

NRA lifer doesn't make anyone a believer in the second amendment at least in my eyes. BTW, I am as well...for the last 25+ years.

When one protests, let’s say abortion, they carry signs whether they are pro life or pro abortion, their sign states their position. In this case, the legal firearm, acted as a sign illustrating the second amendment and gun rights. I expect at a rally or protest that involved obama there was likely many left wingers that have never actually seen a firearm in real life. Their entire view of firearms could actually be movies and left wing propaganda. A leap, I know, but in this case, the secret service paid the incident little interest. They asked the armed citizen a few questions while he was acting in a legal manner as a citizen. When satisfied, they moved on. You should continue to keep this issue alive. This is just what cnn wants you to do. Maybe you could attend an anti-gun rally armed with you NRA life member card. Divide and conquer, it looks like cnn got just what they wanted

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Whatever. My life is complete without having to convince you of anything.
If you think the secret service "asked a few questions and moved on" you're fooling yourself! I can't even respond to that. :roll:

I didn't start this thread to have my dedication to gun rights questioned. YOU, SIR, are a bigger threat to gun rights with your attitude than the largely impotent democratic politicians who are now largely aquiescent on the issue. They have learned its safer to be quiet, and let the lunatic fringe of the pro-gun movement do their talking for them. Such as carrying a para-military weapon to a presidential function. Like Evan said, its stupid!

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Originally Posted by Buzz

This behavior is damaging to the gun rights lobby.

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As a Democrat voter, since when did that start to bother you? :p

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Originally Posted by Hew

As a Democrat voter, since when did that start to bother you? :p

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Hew,
IMHO, one of the biggest mistakes the republicans made over the past decade or so, is to alienate many of the moderates of their own party, as well as the conservative democrats, or Reagan democrats. Here in western Pa, there are still alot of old union steelworkers and coalminers who are life-long hunters and outdoorsmen who could have helped tremendously, but were labeled and ran out of the party. NOt all would vote republican, granted, but maybe in local elections, senate races, etc... My feeling was the republicans were more on a mission of EXCLUSION, than inclusion and tolerance, in post clinton era. HOpefully that's changing now.:2c:

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Originally Posted by dnf777

Hew,
IMHO, one of the biggest mistakes the republicans made over the past decade or so, is to alienate many of the moderates of their own party, as well as the conservative democrats, or Reagan democrats. Right. What better way to alienate moderates than to have a moderate Republican as president and a bunch of GOP Congressmen who spent money like Democrats? Bush's domestic agenda was not conservative. His foreign policy might be considered so, but then, what has Obama changed? We're still in Iraq. He upped the ante in A-Stan. We still render prisoners to thirdworld countries. There's not a dime's bit of difference in the Patriot Act. Gitmo is still open. We deny prisoners "rights" at Bagram. Here in western Pa, there are still alot of old union steelworkers and coalminers who are life-long hunters and outdoorsmen who could have helped tremendously, but were labeled and ran out of the party. What chased them out of the party? The far-right draconian domestic agenda? LMAO. I suspect there are a lot more Republicans that got fed up with the party because it wasn't conservative enough than there are union steelworkers and coalminers who left because it was too conservative. NOt all would vote republican, granted, but maybe in local elections, senate races, etc... My feeling was the republicans were more on a mission of EXCLUSION, than inclusion and tolerance, in post clinton era. HOpefully that's changing now.:2c: Far and away more Americans consider themselves "conservative" than any other political label. I'm confident that if the GOP returns to its principles of the 80s/90s that they can win elections at every level. But if being "inclusive" and "tolerant" means that the GOP should accept elements of a socialized healthcare system or denounce a man exercising his 2nd Ammendment rights then I couldn't care less if union steelworkers, coalminers and left-leaning doctors from PA ever vote for the party again and we never win another election.

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" But if being "inclusive" and "tolerant" means that the GOP should accept elements of a socialized healthcare system or denounce a man exercising his 2nd Ammendment rights then I couldn't care less if union steelworkers, coalminers and left-leaning doctors from PA ever vote for the party again and we never win another election. "

Case in point. If those exact groups you mentioned would have voted the way they did in the 80s, McCain would be president mostl likely.

I do agree with your first part of the post. Nothing has changed. Perhaps the truth is that corporations and SIGs have our government by the short hairs, and even when people exercise their voice and vote for change.....it doesn't happen. Seems like both sides of the aisle are unhappy, and the machine in the middle just keeps on rollin'.

oh, and about denouncing that idiot for bringing his gun....I do so because I could not be more RIGHT leaning on gun rights. If I were anti-gun, I would be jumping for joy that his type are fanning the flames and giving gun owners a bad image. It's like Obama and the world leaders sitting down to a 10-course state dinner to discuss world hunger. Legal, but stupid! Bad image.

" Far and away more Americans consider themselves "conservative" than any other political label. "

I've seen that number all over the range of results, but assuming it is true, why then do only 23% of Americans admit to calling themselves republican???

That would tell me that the party has done a HORRIBLE job of including the "majority" of those who consider themselves conservative. Where did these people go? As one of them, I can tell you I'm an independent. Not because the democrats lured me away, but the recent policies and intolerances and exclusionary tactics pused me away. I'll be glad to give my vote where I feel it best serves America, whether its a dem or republican, or neither.