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Thread: Honour dog leaves before being released

  1. #11
    Senior Member Mark Littlejohn's Avatar
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    I've never sent one of my dogs to retrieve from the down position, so if they elect to lie down on honor I always breathe a little easier.

  2. #12
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    My dog has laid down on honor plenty of times. I didn't command him to, he just did it. He knew his "turn" was over, and he just laid down after running. He's not a pig by any means. Runs with a head of steam, but has an off switch too.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Shih View Post

    If it were a field trial and I were judging

    1. Drop. Honor is a test of obedience. Dog failed.
    [/SIZE][/FONT]
    Does the same apply to the dog that does not heel from the holding blind to the line? It is obedience and the dog is under judgement.

    In years past many of today's dogs would be dropped for their poor line manners. This is an area IMHO that has become too lax.

    Tim
    Last edited by Tim Carrion; 09-12-2013 at 09:41 AM.
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  4. #14
    Senior Member Ted Shih's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Carrion View Post
    Does the same apply to the dog that does not heel from the holding blind to the line? It is obedience and the dog is under judgement.

    In years past many of today's dogs would be dropped for their poor line manners. This is an area IMHO that has become too lax.

    Tim

    Depends on what "does not heel" looks like. If the dog visited the truck on the way from the holding blind to the mat, probably.
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  5. #15
    Senior Member DoubleHaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Shih View Post
    According to the FT Rule Book





    If it were a field trial and I were judging

    1. Drop. Honor is a test of obedience. Dog failed.
    2. No issue
    3. Depending on how handler got the dog to down position, no issue.
    I agree with Ted.

    Even though the question was about FTs, even in a HT, I think the dog should be dropped for wandering off. Breaking or interfering with the working dog are not the only criteria in a HT. Chapter 3, Section 5 has the similar language as Ted quoted:
    When coming to the line to be tested, and while on the line, the dog and handler shall assume such locations as may be directed by the Judges.

    Whenever used within the above context, the word “line” is understood to mean the point that a dog will commence its retrieve or the designated area for an honoring dog.
    Even if it is not a break or interfering with the working dog, wandering off is not good at all. For those who said it isn't going to get the dog dropped, what is the justification?

    Lack of attention is a minor fault, okay, but at the very least wouldn't you have to give a HT dog a severe downgrade in Trainability for wandering away when it was told to sit (or down) and perhaps Style, for not having enough desire to pay attention to those birds going down? I would think especially in a HT wandering off would be penalized. Do you let your dogs do that when hunting?

  6. #16
    Senior Member JusticeDog's Avatar
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    I knew a field champion bitch that was dropped because of an honor. She was sitting and leaned over, and reached under the judges chair and got his lunch. She pulled out his sandwich and ate it. She left him the chips and the fruit. I really never understood the problem. It all happened rather quickly.
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Shih View Post






    If it were a field trial and I were judging

    1. Drop. Honor is a test of obedience. Dog failed.
    2. No issue
    3. Depending on how handler got the dog to down position, no issue.

    And this is the dog that has the best marks and had been wonderful all trial and you had penciled it into your blue position on the way back from that really tough long retired in the last series quad. I don't think so!

    From blue to bye-bye for this. Maybe you, but not me! Minor fault at most.


    Mark

  8. #18
    Senior Member Mark Littlejohn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleHaul View Post
    I agree with Ted.

    Even though the question was about FTs, even in a HT, I think the dog should be dropped for wandering off. Breaking or interfering with the working dog are not the only criteria in a HT. Chapter 3, Section 5 has the similar language as Ted quoted:


    Even if it is not a break or interfering with the working dog, wandering off is not good at all. For those who said it isn't going to get the dog dropped, what is the justification?

    Lack of attention is a minor fault, okay, but at the very least wouldn't you have to give a HT dog a severe downgrade in Trainability for wandering away when it was told to sit (or down) and perhaps Style, for not having enough desire to pay attention to those birds going down? I would think especially in a HT wandering off would be penalized. Do you let your dogs do that when hunting?
    The OP stipulated HT and not FT.
    My response was directed to the previous posts and those who were absolute in dropping the dog, implying that they consider this action a major fault.
    Per the HT rules quoted and described scenario, this dog has not committed a major fault in my book.
    The dog would likely be marked down for trainability, but not not automatically dropped.
    I've never heard anyone ask for justification for not dropping a dog, unless a major fault were overlooked. Usually what's sought is the rationale behind the judges' consensus that a dog be dropped.

  9. #19
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    In my book, zero for trainabilty, lack of response to handler. Cannot drop for breaking with no intent to retrieve

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  10. #20
    Senior Member Scott Adams's Avatar
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    i knew a field champion bitch that was dropped because of an honor. She was sitting and leaned over, and reached under the judges chair and got his lunch. She pulled out his sandwich and ate it. She left him the chips and the fruit. I really never understood the problem. It all happened rather quickly.
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