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Thread: Handleing on Marks????

  1. #11
    Senior Member ada5771's Avatar
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    Do you have sound on your wingers?

    If so as soon as you see the dog break down(you can tell when they put their ears up)... hit the sound first, second winger next. If she still does not succeed, may want to walk out to the fall let her find it then move up to simplify the mark. Marking takes baby steps, a 30 yard mark in cover may seem over simplified to you but it mean a great deal to the dogs confidence when it nails it every time. As stated you want the 20/80% rule you want your dog to have success on 80% of marks.
    Last edited by ada5771; 10-01-2013 at 04:44 PM.
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  2. #12
    Senior Member Tom. P.'s Avatar
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    Ada is on to something that could work for you.
    If indeed you do have sound on the wingers we have found when a young dog struggles with a mark to sound off the wingers to get there attention back to AOF. If you can possibly have a helper in the field that is the best help.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Mary Lynn Metras's Avatar
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    Sound on your wingers and put a gunner out there hidden as in HRC that can assist the dog if major problems. JMO
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  4. #14
    Senior Member GG's Avatar
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    you should never allow a dog to come in without a bird. Seed the area of the fall so your pup will find a bird when she gets to the area. Get her confidence back---that all marking is.
    NO DOG WILL PERFORM TO HIS TRAINING LEVEL UNLESS HIS HANDLER IS CAPABLE OF MAKING HIM DO SO!
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  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hunt'EmUp View Post
    Have the gunner help, set her up a dirt clod drill. Basically the gunner throws dirt clods, dog goes to the area soon gives up and leaves the area, cause there's no bird to find, then the gunner sneaks in a bird to the area. Dog is stopped corrected then directed to return to the area and hunt it up, where they find the bird. That usually helps with making them trust their eyes and make a thorough search. If you do have to handle your dog, sit her and correct her for being out of the area, then handler her to the area and tell her to hunt, don't handle her directly to the bird, make her find it. If she stops on you, either ignore her, if they sit there long enough and you didn't stop them they'll usually start moving again, or you can say NO hunt it Up, either way don't cast her, she's looking for a cast don't give her one.

    And wait I just re-read and the pup is only 9mt old, disregard the correction part (save that for later after she's confident on marks, and intentionally blowing you off) , Absolutely have the gunners help her on marks, you need to keep her confidence up. Marks are her job, she need to learn how to dig out a mark, without your help. So if she gets there put your hands in your pockets, and whistle away, have the gunners keep her in the area, they will help to teach her to find it on her own.
    So now we're handling "with" pressure on marks with a 9mo puppy that is popping and has no confidence? I think post #3 is about spot on. Put your whistle in your pocket, or as the late Shoemaker would say "put you D!?& whistle in your bra."
    "Women are like labradors...,they all have their quarks."~Phil Robertson

  6. #16
    Senior Member Bridget Bodine's Avatar
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    I don't care how you do it but do not correct and handle at this age. Have the gun help, have the marks simpler, pepper the area with several bumpers. Do stand alones where YOU are the thrower and you can help. Quit correcting and TEACH a baby how to stick to it....
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  7. #17
    Senior Member KNorman's Avatar
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    Steve,

    I think in general you've gotten good advice from the forum. Here are my 2 cents (and then some).

    I think you're dealing with two separate, yet interconnected marking problems.

    First is popping on marks. The second is abandoning the AOF and switching back to old falls.

    In my experience, popping on marks is often caused by a lack of confidence by being over eager to handle and pushing a young dog into marking situations they're not ready for. In other words, you're setting this puppy up for failure.

    I would suggest taking a step back and throwing single marks on basically golf course terrain with visible guns (a bird boy or stickmen) for awhile. Big white bumpers. As the pup develops confidence again, switch back to birds on this same terrain. An excellent place to do this is at the State Fairgrounds off Airline Hwy. The front fields there are basically flat, then you can move to the back fields that have more roll to them.

    We work young dogs there for months establishing good marking skills and confidence.

    As far as going back to old falls, I think I would abandon any multiples for now until you get the confidence back on singles. This is going to take awhile. When you do go back to a multiple set, have a bird boy to help. It makes a huge difference to keep a pup in the AOF.

    You have an excellent resource with some of the local HT trainers in your area. Rob de Veer, Jason Amerello, and Reggie O'Mara all run hunt tests and are located in the Prairieville/Saint Amant/Geismar area. You can also get birds for training from Nalton or Mark E.

  8. #18
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    sounds like you might know John Pease
    'What's worse than handling on a mark? Trying to handle on a mark' J.P.

  9. #19
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    I also train by myself, so the lack of gunner help can be an issue. I was just about to tell you to set up 2 remote wingers, or bumper boys(whichever you have) together to land in the same spot. As your dog approaches and JUST BEFORE she stops, fire the second to add momentum. You don't want her stopping to look at you anymore. Otherwise there will be no difference between stop and look to be handled, or stop and look for 2nd bird to be thrown. Do you have sound on your wingers? You can use that to draw her to the area as she slows down too, similar to gunner's hey,hey. The previous suggestions about shortening up and working on mowed grass are good steps too, but it sounds like this only happens when you get into cover. Since I only have bumper boys I will often put a bird out for my dog to retrieve and fire the bumper boy at it for her to mark off. Salting the area will definitely give more confidence to a hesitant dog. I used the salting technique on blind work for a bit, till my dog believed me there really was something out there to get when I sent her back and she started to break down and hunt after a few whistles. Good luck remember she is still a pup, maybe your others learned young, but they are all different beasts

  10. #20
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    Sorry for repeating info already given, somehow I missed reading the 2nd page of this post before I wrote my reply! Lots of good info here, good luck

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