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Thread: Dog has preference for birds over bumpers

  1. #1
    Senior Member Bridget Bodine's Avatar
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    Default Dog has preference for birds over bumpers

    Curious to the replies here....this was a situation that was explained to me the day the Force on Marks thread came up.
    a not so well bred dog , has a preference to pick up birds , but does not care for bumpers so much.As a pup would not retrieve a bumper unless a wing was tied to it.
    Dog gets FF'd, FTP , single T , swim by etc.(all done this spring} After FTP dog is much more responsible about picking up bumpers. Dog is pretty ok when birds are thrown, usually adequate when bumpers are thrown.
    Owner was hand throwing bumper marks last week , (he can throw halfway across the country) and the dog lollygagged out to get a mark and started sniffing at something and forgot about the mark.
    WHAT would YOU do????
    The owner did what I would do and said "fetch!! nick Fetch!!" The dog ran with style and enthusiasm on the rest of his marks and got the job done.
    So is there ever a time to force on marks ?
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  2. #2
    Senior Member Duckquilizer's Avatar
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    Default

    Nope...NEVER! Oh did I just say never???
    Kendall Layne

    HR(2xHRCH) Ashland's Big Black Ruby to Go SH
    Dorie's Lady of the Lake(1K bird club)

    Never play leap frog with a unicorn.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Jennifer Henion's Avatar
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    Default

    Sounds like the dog is not cut out for that particular job.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Bridget Bodine's Avatar
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    Default

    he loves birds and enjoys hunting.....training not so much ....
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    Sight To Sea Labradors
    Southern Cross at Sight to Sea SH "Crosby" (by NAFC FC AFC Cody Cut a Lean Grade)
    Tealwood's Willing at Sight to Sea JH ( by CH I am Able)
    Briarglen's Running on Faith JH (by FC Fish River's Out of the Park)
    Glendair's Come Home to the Sea ( By Ch Topform's Edward MH, QAA)
    Sight To Sea's Take Aim SH (by Sight to Sea's Southern Comfort SH )Aug 23 2003-Feb 2013 Go get em , Man!

    Manager of www.DeCoverlykennels.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Duckquilizer View Post
    Nope...NEVER! Oh did I just say never???
    Theres no "never's" or always in dog training. There are appropriate times to force a dog on marks by a qualified trainer.
    "Women are like labradors...,they all have their quarks."~Phil Robertson

  6. #6
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    I will ask it another way. If you were doing cheaty singles with a young dog and he failed to go what would you do?

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    Administrator Chris Atkinson's Avatar
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    Perhaps this situation could be better categorized as "lack of effort", which may warrant some form of correction. I primarily say this because the description states that the dog performed enthusiastically after.

    Mentors I've tried to follow state that the way you know if you used enough correction can be determined by whether or not the dog gave the desired response. In this case, it appears that the dog did.
    "Determining and applying the criteria for when and when not to use correction is the essence of the art of dog training. I make a distinction between a mistake and a lack of effort." - Mike Lardy - Volume I "After Collar Conditioning"

  8. #8
    Senior Member DarrinGreene's Avatar
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    I think there's a clear difference between forcing a dog to pick up a bumper that he knows he's supposed to pick up, and forcing a dog off the line in order to improve style (the subject of the original thread).

    The fact that a mark happened to have been thrown is somewhat irrelevant. It's a apples to oranges comparison.

    This one is another of those situations where there is likely other avoidance behavior being overlooked or recognized and tolerated.
    Darrin Greene

  9. #9
    Senior Member truthseeker's Avatar
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    I have forced in certain situations, but I did not respond to the original thread because I did not get a real sense of the problem and if done improperly could make thing worse.

    Keith

  10. #10
    Senior Member Bridget Bodine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Atkinson View Post
    Perhaps this situation could be better categorized as "lack of effort", which may warrant some form of correction. I primarily say this because the description states that the dog performed enthusiastically after.

    Mentors I've tried to follow state that the way you know if you used enough correction can be determined by whether or not the dog gave the desired response. In this case, it appears that the dog did.
    BINGO !! The only reason I post this is because the are NEVER concrete answers in dog training.... I most certainly did not want to muddy the other thread, but in my experience (MANY dogs) there ARE absolutely times to force on a mark. Not many, but there are reasons to do it. Darrin is right , IT would not be done to "improve" style...BUT absolutely on a dog who watches a mark , goes on a good initial line , then goes a lolly gagging. You would be correcting for lack of effort.
    Now if he had to do it over and over and over again I might consider finding the dog a new job.....but sometimes you have to make them to it....
    BB
    Sight To Sea Labradors
    Southern Cross at Sight to Sea SH "Crosby" (by NAFC FC AFC Cody Cut a Lean Grade)
    Tealwood's Willing at Sight to Sea JH ( by CH I am Able)
    Briarglen's Running on Faith JH (by FC Fish River's Out of the Park)
    Glendair's Come Home to the Sea ( By Ch Topform's Edward MH, QAA)
    Sight To Sea's Take Aim SH (by Sight to Sea's Southern Comfort SH )Aug 23 2003-Feb 2013 Go get em , Man!

    Manager of www.DeCoverlykennels.com

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