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Thread: Question for akc rules junkies

  1. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Robinson View Post
    Back when my first dog and I were passing Senior hunt test, but nowhere near ready for Master, my dog was a solid duck hunter. He marked well and handled on 100 yard blinds across the pond. The guys I hunted with certainly considered him a Working Retriever, the appropriately named NAHRA title he also earned that summer.
    Any good working retriever should be able to get that 1oo yard blind...I'm sure your dog performed very well in the duck blind...Was the reason you weren't ready for master is because the polish wasn't there yet? As any Sr titled dog usually is ....Steve S
    "Your dog learns as much by doing his work right,by your praise and encouragement, as he does by your displeasure and correction." DLWalters

  2. #132
    Senior Member MooseGooser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve schreiner View Post
    Any good working retriever should be able to get that 1oo yard blind...I'm sure your dog performed very well in the duck blind...Was the reason you weren't ready for master is because the polish wasn't there yet? As any Sr titled dog usually is ....Steve S

    I'm out!

    Steve Good luck with your endeavors.. You and your mentality is the problem in HT games..

    I would just as soon NOT not run ANY of them,, and just work VERY hard at Training that really nice working duck dog..

    Good luck.

    Gooser
    It is far easier to spit on the work of others than it is to produce something better yourself.
    Brynmoors Prairie Sage JH ​(Sage) Just a dang fool huntin Dawg
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    HR Calypso Zoomin Loosies Mad Hader (Maddi) We loved you baby. R.I.P.
    FlatLanders Broken Pistol Ricochet SH (Flinch)


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  3. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by MooseGooser View Post
    Steve responded to my comment as follows:
    Steves question in red.

    Then HE decides to interpret it to include birds laying on the ground to deliberately distract a young dog, even though the RULES give VERY SPECIFIC EXAMPLES of their suggestions of what a GOOD judge should use..
    Where did this come from ? That was an old field trial trick to stake birds down way of line to get dogs hung up and not cast off...not me...Steve s

    Steve I am talking about live ducks in crates at the flyer station, and the dead birds at the memory bird station. The TWO stations you want to require a Senior dog to run a blind between..
    I don't believe I made that statement ...BUT...it is what will happen when you don't run the blind up the middle before the marks are thrown..Never seen flyers shot in this situation ...I wouldn't put the line to the blind as close as I would if it were a master dog...Give them a chance to handle off it a few more times before they totally turn the handler off....I made the statement that scent is quite natural in the dog world ...When you hunt and have killed several bird there is scent(and feathers ) all over the place or you pull in to your favorite duck hole and flush birds out of it...Dogs have to be taught to deal with scent from an early age in training ...I don't have a problem with your post because we have all seen ridiculous test set up by some judges...Any situation can be carried too far in difficulty... This started out about a blind before marks being legal or not ..They aren't marks until they are thrown for the dog...there is just scent spots on the ground that a dog should handle off of if necessary ...I have never seen that come into play in all my years of doggin' ...But ,if the dog did get into one I would give them several attempts to get out of it..But, they would be so far off line my co-judge would probably zero the dog for being out of control anyway...Steve S
    Last edited by steve schreiner; 10-20-2013 at 09:00 PM.
    "Your dog learns as much by doing his work right,by your praise and encouragement, as he does by your displeasure and correction." DLWalters

  4. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by MooseGooser View Post
    I'm out!

    Steve Good luck with your endeavors.. You and your mentality is the problem in HT games..

    I would just as soon NOT not run ANY of them,, and just work VERY hard at Training that really nice working duck dog..

    Good luck.

    Gooser

    Same to you , best wishes with your dogs...keep training ....Steve S
    "Your dog learns as much by doing his work right,by your praise and encouragement, as he does by your displeasure and correction." DLWalters

  5. #135
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    A dog that can not run a 40 blind with a gun station 80 yards steep angle to the left of the handler,,, and a gun station 80 yards steep angle right of the handler is not ready for any kind of senior. And is also useless for the most part as a hunting dog. I think you guys need to find a new training program if you find this legal scenario difficult or unfair.
    Waaaa Waaaaa

    Pete
    John 5 :30
    I can of my own self do nothing ,as I hear , I judge,,and my judgement is just, because I seek not my own will,,but the will of the father which hath sent me
    John 7:16 -- Jesus answered them and said my doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.
    mark 16:9 -- So then after the lord had spoken unto them,he was received up in heaven, and sat on the right hand of God
    I Tim. 2:5 --For there is one God and one mediator between God and man ,, the man Christ Jesus

  6. #136
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    There is no doubt on my mind that these highly qualified judges set up a solid challenging Senior level blind. I will admit that it danced on the fringes of the rule book though. The only regretful aspect is that the Hunt Test Committee got involved and took the "safe route" by asking them to change it. I would have preferred that the HTC didn't succumb to the pressure from a few nervous handlers with cell phones.

    JO

  7. #137
    Senior Member John Robinson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve schreiner View Post
    Any good working retriever should be able to get that 1oo yard blind...I'm sure your dog performed very well in the duck blind...Was the reason you weren't ready for master is because the polish wasn't there yet? As any Sr titled dog usually is ....Steve S
    That was my whole point, my dog was a very solid Senior Hunter at that point, it took another season of training for him to start passing Masters. The difference between Senior and Master is huge, just the way it was designed.

  8. #138
    Senior Member John Robinson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    A dog that can not run a 40 blind with a gun station 80 yards steep angle to the left of the handler,,, and a gun station 80 yards steep angle right of the handler is not ready for any kind of senior. And is also useless for the most part as a hunting dog. I think you guys need to find a new training program if you find this legal scenario difficult or unfair.
    Waaaa Waaaaa

    Pete
    Is that the set up we are talking about? I'm fine with my training program by the way, I just have a problem with pushing the rules. Are we talking about a real situation or hypothetical? It sounds real from council oaks comment.

    John

  9. #139
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    Gooser, unless you are really "out", , go back and read post 69. What is described there is what I have seen, and I believe it would have been FAR easier to run a blind between two stations that had not fired. And the real issue is what he pointed out. The test was set up to create suction. What matters is what the dog does when you stop him and cast him away from the factors. Personally, I am in the camp that believes the rule book refers to when, not where, the blind is run.
    Carol,
    Owned and handled by Cruisin' with Indiana Jones, JH
    Alternate Handler: Westwind Buffalo Soldier
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    http://newhoperetrievers.com

  10. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Robinson View Post
    Is that the set up we are talking about?
    If so, the HT committee should have jumped in and told them that 80 yards is too long for the walk up

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