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Thread: Marking ability???

  1. #21
    Senior Member MooseGooser's Avatar
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    Quote:

    "self deprecating form of humor."


    Bon.. I have never felt the experience of messing myself funny.


    Yes QUALITY of marks too!

    Gooser
    It is far easier to spit on the work of others than it is to produce something better yourself.
    Brynmoors Prairie Sage JH ​(Sage) Just a dang fool huntin Dawg
    HRCH Calypso Seven Bales High SH (Bailey)
    HR Calypso Zoomin Loosies Mad Hader (Maddi) We loved you baby. R.I.P.
    FlatLanders Broken Pistol Ricochet SH (Flinch)


    My Christian Name is Michael Baker..
    I have gone by "Gooser" since I was a "gossling"

  2. #22
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    Awesome comment!!!! I think that if he was just average in other training aspects along with the rate at which most of the dogs I see move I wouldn't think much about his marking. I was really interested to hear comments like I've heard from the trialers where from what I've seen from the gallery is a must have skill. At what age do y'all evaluate? In regards to some of the post he hasn't seen near enough marks for me to say that he won't one day be good but he just doesn't seem to have that undeniable ability YET!!!
    He is a Grady son and I have never seen a dog as smart!!!

  3. #23
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    We have put eight on the Derby List and helped a couple others. One thing that I noticed at a very early age four to six months they came into the area of the fall looking with a very intense look in their eyes. We mostly teach the mechanics of a mark first , indenify the gun, watch the arc of the throw, butt down, easy to get to, easy to find marks, mostly on very cut grass fields, parklike settings. As time progresses make the marks harder to get to easy to find. The good markers will let you know, the eyes are the key. Some dogs in my opinion are blessed with great eyesight (not talking about eye disorders) like people great eye sight some folks have. I used to stretch them out at a early age, then later couldn't figure out they had problems checking up on short birds. Used drive along the abandoned runway at Bong recreational area in Kenosha county Wisconsin, toss bumpers out the truck window, go about a 1/8th of a mile and send back for the bumpers, some dogs 6 or 7 months old. Used popper guns with great distances at a very early age.
    UNTIL I had the opportunity to train with Mary Hillman (Bill's wife) with Viking the 92 point Derby Champion for a couple of summers. You need a balance. I have watched Bill's DVD's and consider it good information. A very good amateur trainer and someone who I have trained with for years told me you can teach any dog to do blinds, but you can't teach them to mark. I agree with that statement. It is a trait that one can develop somewhat, but, only to a point. I have personal knowledge of at least one FC/AFC and MH double header winner who never had one derby point completely amateur trained. He just could dig those all-age marks out. Was he a pinpoint marker, no, but , he was taking birds off him in the last series of the all-age many times. There are others too, but, for the most part great markers are born, in my opinion, not made. The derby is where it starts. I had another training partner who had 27 JAMS in the ALL-AGE, but, no points, that dog could take a line though! The point what are your goals? Hunt tests, Derby, QAA or the big brass ring of the championship field trial points. Only you can decide if "it is enough dog for you" , there is marking and there is marking. I from a personal standpoint washed two dogs over the years because in my opinion they just couldn't mark. One was a year old and the other about 10 months old. I have washed a few others mostly because they had forcebreak issues and didn't want to deal with it down the road. That is typical of collar dogs as forcebreak is the foundation of the e-collar program. Just some insight, others will probably have other suggestions. Good luck either way.
    Earl Dillow

  4. #24
    Senior Member MooseGooser's Avatar
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    If you go to the top of this page, then lower left hand corner (hawk eye media) it will take you to Hilmans site. From there there is a link to his blog. Under the articles tab there is an article about teaching marking. It's very good. It makes a comparison to learning to shoot
    It is far easier to spit on the work of others than it is to produce something better yourself.
    Brynmoors Prairie Sage JH ​(Sage) Just a dang fool huntin Dawg
    HRCH Calypso Seven Bales High SH (Bailey)
    HR Calypso Zoomin Loosies Mad Hader (Maddi) We loved you baby. R.I.P.
    FlatLanders Broken Pistol Ricochet SH (Flinch)


    My Christian Name is Michael Baker..
    I have gone by "Gooser" since I was a "gossling"

  5. #25
    Senior Member MooseGooser's Avatar
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    I can't shoot either!

    It is far easier to spit on the work of others than it is to produce something better yourself.
    Brynmoors Prairie Sage JH ​(Sage) Just a dang fool huntin Dawg
    HRCH Calypso Seven Bales High SH (Bailey)
    HR Calypso Zoomin Loosies Mad Hader (Maddi) We loved you baby. R.I.P.
    FlatLanders Broken Pistol Ricochet SH (Flinch)


    My Christian Name is Michael Baker..
    I have gone by "Gooser" since I was a "gossling"

  6. #26
    Senior Member BonMallari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jchamberlain View Post
    Awesome comment!!!! I think that if he was just average in other training aspects along with the rate at which most of the dogs I see move I wouldn't think much about his marking. I was really interested to hear comments like I've heard from the trialers where from what I've seen from the gallery is a must have skill. At what age do y'all evaluate? In regards to some of the post he hasn't seen near enough marks for me to say that he won't one day be good but he just doesn't seem to have that undeniable ability YET!!!
    He is a Grady son and I have never seen a dog as smart!!!
    A must have skill :a good to great marking dog knows where the birds are their body language on the line tells you so,it's as if to say just give me a release and stsnd back and let me step on this mark
    A poor to mediocre marker looks worried and is scanning the field looking for help sometimes not always they lack the explosion off the line because they have no idea where the birds are
    A great marking dog is looking over their shoulder as they come back as if to tell you after I get done with this one I am going to come back and pick up thst one
    All my Exes live in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by lanse brown View Post
    A few things that I learned still ring true. "Lanse when you get a gift, say thank you and walk away. When you get a screwing walk away. You are going to get a lot more screwings than gifts"

  7. #27
    Senior Member Sundown49 aka Otey B's Avatar
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    I have found out with my Traveler son that when I do not HURRY to send him his marking improves 100%. He has so much desire that it sometimes gets in the way of his BRAIN.
    My Dad said to me ."Son, a man just needs three things to be happy....A good dog, a good gun and a good wife.....Thank God I have all three
    Sundown's Boss of Delta Marsh JH (Louie QAA X Delta MH)
    Traveling Through The Graded Timber JH (2012 NAFC Trav X Timber MH QAA)

    Sundown's Ruff And Tuff (Boss JH X Lil Bit) best pup I have ever raised
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  8. #28
    Senior Member MooseGooser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sundown49 aka Otey B View Post
    I have found out with my Traveler son that when I do not HURRY to send him his marking improves 100%. He has so much desire that it sometimes gets in the way of his BRAIN.

    Wow!
    Where have I heard that before!!

    And I still send to fast... Consistently.

    it really makes a difference with my dog also, if I don't send to quick.
    It is far easier to spit on the work of others than it is to produce something better yourself.
    Brynmoors Prairie Sage JH ​(Sage) Just a dang fool huntin Dawg
    HRCH Calypso Seven Bales High SH (Bailey)
    HR Calypso Zoomin Loosies Mad Hader (Maddi) We loved you baby. R.I.P.
    FlatLanders Broken Pistol Ricochet SH (Flinch)


    My Christian Name is Michael Baker..
    I have gone by "Gooser" since I was a "gossling"

  9. #29
    Senior Member EdA's Avatar
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    Some good information and some not so good information on this thread. To the OP's original question have the dog's eyes examined. Great markers gave great eyesight, you cannot teach marking but you can enhance it if you know how. Hunting short does not necessarily imply vision problems and it can improved by throwing lots of marks at varying distances. Good luck with the dog who has all the other traits.

  10. #30
    Senior Member Bruce MacPherson's Avatar
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    I will throw out a story but withhold the names, maybe help maybe not. A professional FT trainer friend of mine always told the story of a very famous dog he had in training at the time. His comment was that the dog was not the best marker he had ever seen but he was the smartest dog he'd ever trained. This particular dog did very well for himself, there definitely are some compensating factors. Also I would not always get to excited about what is going on at 8 months of age, just my thoughts.
    "The longer you let a dog go in the wrong direction the more they think they are going in the right direction" Don Remien.

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