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Thread: Christie v. Hillary

  1. #41
    Senior Member Henlee's Avatar
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    I have said it about a million times. The republicans and the conservatives are essentially two different parties that are trying to share the same house. I guess I could look up the history of the wig party to see if there was ever a greater need for a party to split apart, but I don't think there is. the conservative base is not going to turn out for Christie and the Moderate base is not going to turn out for Cruz. You try to figure that out into a win for the R's. McCain and Romney were hamstrung by the same phenomena. It is hard enough to win an election without your own party holding you back.

    The way congressional districts are formed is completely corrupt for either party. I am not suggesting that democrats don't partake also, but I am asserting that if it were not the case so many "extremist" would not be able to win elections. To prove my point I will remind everyone that despite single digit approval ratings 85% of incumbents are going to stay in office this next election. It is not a tie score establishment party politics is winning vs. us and it is not a close competition. Stop thinking in terms of party politics and you will see that we only have the illusion of choice in our congressional leadership.
    During break time at obedience school, two dogs were talking.
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  2. #42
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
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    I agree with you, Henlee.

    That is why I think that Rs trying to resemble Ds will not win them elections. I believe there are Ds who have principles and may not be happy with their party's direction either, but they are intimidated about speaking out against their own party as long as it keeps giving things away. There are Ds who are beginning to realize the attempting to equalize results is not the same as offering equal opportunity.

    One thing I do notice, is that what takes place on the national stage ... the name-calling of racist, wacko birds, etc. ... intimidates free speech and discussion on the personal level as well. I have two good friends who are Ds. One of them told me that she had voted for O in 2008 and intended to vote for him again. These are intelligent people ... but somehow believe than no one should speak ill of Obama for ANY reason. That totally stymies me. We have agreed not to talk politics in order to remain friends. One of these friends is in health care; one works for a university (general staff). Both have secure benefits and wages. So far they have been more insulated from the present administrations policies.

    I believe that someone like Cruz, who is greatly influenced by his father's personal knowledge of Cuban communism, has principles. Overall, look at what a beating he is taking for speaking out strongly. Freshman Senators are supposed to bow and scrape and keep their mouths shut. He's upsetting the rules. Is it any wonder that the establishment of BOTH parties want him to go away? He (and others) is disrupting their cozy status quo. We should be thankful for those in the Senate who are disrupting what has been going on there for too long. The Founding Fathers of this country were disruptive. King George wanted them to "go away", but they refused to do so.

    We easily forget how long the American Revolution went on, and how hopeless their situation looked for much of the time. They lost a lot of battles. Even some of the battles they won seemed only to have occurred through accidental natural events or crucial missteps by the opposition.

    The only thing that distinguishes "revolutions" around the world and through history are the principles upon which the revolution is based.
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
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  3. #43
    Senior Member Henlee's Avatar
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    I think a sizable bunch of mod D's would leave the party for a centrist party also. I have always tried to maintain a respect for the office of president regardless of who is in it. It has been hard at times, but I feel that is how it use to be and the way it should stay. I don't know if your friends feel the same way or not, but I would like to think so. I think Ted Cruz is trying to bring the divisional politics of the house to the senate and being treated like a pariah for it. The senate may end up doing in his political career for it or they may end up as useless as the house. Time will tell. He is not well liked by either party in the senate.
    During break time at obedience school, two dogs were talking.
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  4. #44
    Senior Member HuntClub's Avatar
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    That's all well and good, but what are we going to do with a bunch of centrists (who's only attribute is being electable)? I don't get it, everybody hates congress, people are worried about the direction of this country, and you think the answer is in the middle? The middle is status quo with the illusion of goodness based on the fact that everybody gets along and passes meaningless window dressing type legislation. The debt continues to click away, growth will continue to be tortoise like, nothing will change. The middle is like putting a band aid on a stich that requires 20 stiches. The division in the house and senate will sort itself out. We are either going to swing one way or another, back to being America or Euro America. Hopefully we aren't as dumb as I suspect we are, but the two rams are going to butt heads in the next few years and we'll see who gets dizzied and who remains standing.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Henlee View Post
    .................................................. ...............................................He is not well liked by either party in the senate.
    Well.........he might just be doing something correctly. vbg
    charly

    There ought to be one day -- just one -- when there is open season on Congressmen.
    ~Will Rogers~

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by charly_t View Post
    Well.........he might just be doing something correctly. vbg
    Totally agree. Go Ted Cruz.

  7. #47
    Senior Member Henlee's Avatar
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    That's all well and good, but what are we going to do with a bunch of centrists

    I guess I wasn't looking at it as a solution, but to get a sizable amount of people properly represented by a party that shares their beliefs. The rest can work itself out. It is not fair for moderates to be represented by conservatives who openly disdain them, but get their support because they share the same party. It is a problem.
    During break time at obedience school, two dogs were talking.
    One said to the other..."The thing I hate about obedience school is you learn ALL this stuff you will never use in the real world."

  8. #48
    Senior Member Henlee's Avatar
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    I am not a big fan of Ted Cruz. He does a lot of his antics just for show and not for substance. The Psydo-fillibuster comes to mind. I think it is far more telling about what type of person he is in how he threw Boehner and other congressional republicans who followed his plan under the bus when he was done with them. I may disagree with what they have done, but I find that sort of behavior disingenuous, short sighted and dangerous. I couldn't trust him and I would be surprised if house republicans do again in the future.
    During break time at obedience school, two dogs were talking.
    One said to the other..."The thing I hate about obedience school is you learn ALL this stuff you will never use in the real world."

  9. #49
    Senior Member menmon's Avatar
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    The reason for governing in the middle is to try to meet the needs of all people. I think when they are sworn in they say something like "for the people" not for the far right or far left. Law needs to be made for the best of all not for the wants of a few.

    Cruz is a flash in the pan. He is loud and controversial so we will here much from him like Sara Paylen but he will never accomplish anything.

    You need to look for a canidate that will please the most folks on the right and get part of what you want as opposed to hanging on to some ideology that will never happen or democrats will continue to have center stage.

    It is that simple.

  10. #50
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
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    Kinda funny to read the progressives telling the right who to nominate.

    As soon as (if) Christy is nominated they will tear into him like mad dogs after raw meat......WATCH!!!

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