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Thread: Pup "Hates" T-Work ! Loves Pattern Blinds ?

  1. #11
    Senior Member truthseeker's Avatar
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    As a trainer, there are three thing that I need to know to get the most out of each dog I train. They are
    1) Drive
    2) Train-ability
    3) working attitude.( The willingness to please ) This category can change with maturity, but in most cases do not.

    Where they score in each, will tell me what to look for and what methods, I will use in their training.
    Without seeing this dog, I would say that the dog rates low in the working attitude category. Knowing this I would not care how fast they did the drill, only that they worked through the pressure and did it.

    Now to your post;
    The only red flag I see is the dog is breaking down on Back nick back. Most likely confusion, I would go back and cement this and move on.

    Keith

  2. #12
    Senior Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipinnpitchin View Post
    Evan I am following your program, Force work went well so I thought ? She had great drive to pile during force to pile, and Mini T, Then when we started expanding the distance that when things started getting bad.
    This is good to know. Now we can get going and fix this!
    Quote Originally Posted by flipinnpitchin View Post
    I can move up and shes fine, I think alot is her confidence, But I can go to a different location and she has great momentum the very first time she runs a pattern blind. I can handle her to the blind with very few casting problems, she picks up the blind. then I can go do several marks, replant he pattern blind, line her up and she will line it. She's very smart ! But her trainer/handler is dumb !
    Just new to the program. Can you shoot some video of the problem areas?
    Quote Originally Posted by flipinnpitchin View Post
    This is not my first dog to train, BUT is the first to ever follow a program on ! I am getting worried now cause everything went well all along up until T-Work, and she's breaking down. She has this attitude like it is killing her to do the T-Work!
    And that's why I would like to see video of T work, and just FTP.

    Evan
    "Prepare your dog in such a manner that the work he is normally called upon to do under-whelms him, not overwhelms him." ~ Evan Graham

    “People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.”

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  3. #13
    Senior Member Hunt'EmUp's Avatar
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    I think You've burned her out on T-work; continuing it will just sour her on the whole training experience. Might be best to take a break from it go on to something else; there are a lot of other drills (teaching the same principles) and marking scenarios to begin teaching; and you can always go back to finish your t-pattern up later. Sometimes it's better to take a break than continuously pound away at particular drill day after day. Often times, if you move on to another training aspect; when you go back to the original drill; you both go back with a better attitude, and you get it finished up better than if you kept pushing at it non-stop.
    Last edited by Hunt'EmUp; 11-07-2013 at 02:39 PM.
    "They's Just DAWGS"
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  4. #14
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    Move on. If you have put enough tools in the box.. i.e. that she understands that she has to go, has to stop and has to change direction... You should be good to go. Don't get bogged down thinking that you have to be perfect on the TT. It is just a process to and end goal. There are several ways to get to that end goal that does not involve the TT. Go run some pattern blinds and see what happens. Let her relax and loosen up. There are pattern blind drills out there that will teach casting with out all the boredomness of the TT. You can always come back and refresh the force if you need to, but you will not be able to UN Force her if you make her sour.

  5. #15
    Junior Member Greg Heier's Avatar
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    The "T" can take a lot out of a dog that you may not be able to put back in to the dog. If she understands what you are trying to teach.... go as sent through pressure.... stop.....change direction.... I would move on. Best of luck.

    Greg

  6. #16
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    I think you might be wise to get Carol Cassity's "Drills For Retrievers" (probably not exact title) and use some of the drills in there to further your pups progress. Maybe Evan's program includes some other drills too. If you have never tried walking baseball that is a fun one (for dog and handler), Carol's 'Swish Drill' comes to mind for line-running/momentum for a young dog.
    Maybe this pup will need more force at some point, but for right now I would probably look at some ways that you and pup BOTH can loosen up and maybe get a bit more fun back in your work.

  7. #17
    Senior Member truthseeker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by riskyriver View Post
    I think you might be wise to get Carol Cassity's "Drills For Retrievers" (probably not exact title) and use some of the drills in there to further your pups progress. Maybe Evan's program includes some other drills too. If you have never tried walking baseball that is a fun one (for dog and handler), Carol's 'Swish Drill' comes to mind for line-running/momentum for a young dog.
    Maybe this pup will need more force at some point, but for right now I would probably look at some ways that you and pup BOTH can loosen up and maybe get a bit more fun back in your work.
    You have to excuse me, This fun thing is a new concept to me. I look for desire or drive in my dogs.

    Keith

  8. #18
    Senior Member Hunt'EmUp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by truthseeker View Post
    You have to excuse me, This fun thing is a new concept to me. I look for desire or drive in my dogs.

    Keith
    HAHA Even the most dedicated-driven student doesn't enjoy doing the same 1+1 equation they already know day in day out; over and over for 3-4 weeks. Any intelligent dog will get bored, and be driven to find ways around it which = no fun for the Handler. You've got to teach 1+2,3,4,5 sometime. If a dog is perfectly happy with 1+1 forever; I begin to wonder what kind of dog I actually have? Perhaps The type that will never understand 2 or 3 .
    "They's Just DAWGS"
    "Hunting is a skill to be learned whether you do it early or late it still needs to be learned"
    "I train dogs, Not papers"

    GMRH HRCH Quick MH (most importantly Duck/Upland Enthusiast)
    MHR HRCH Lakota MH (most importantly Upland/Duck Enthusiast)
    SHR Storm.. the Pup (Beginning Upland & Waterfowl Enthusiast)

  9. #19
    Senior Member Randy Bohn's Avatar
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    you shouldn't be doing T work and pattern blinds at same time...cart before the horse....all your issues should be fixed before the big T ....sloppy sits...not sitting fast enough...etc....your probably souring your dogs attitude....Randy
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  10. #20
    Senior Member truthseeker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hunt'EmUp View Post
    HAHA Even the most dedicated-driven student doesn't enjoy doing the same 1+1 equation they already know day in day out; over and over for 3-4 weeks. Any intelligent dog will get bored, and be driven to find ways around it which = no fun for the Handler. You've got to teach 1+2,3,4,5 sometime. If a dog is perfectly happy with 1+1 forever; I begin to wonder what kind of dog I actually have? Perhaps The type that will never understand 2 or 3 .
    Ho!!!

    That's what it means, I have over trained on a concept or a portion of my program.

    Keith

    I have some that it dose not matter what we do. They will give me 100 percent every time.
    Last edited by truthseeker; 11-07-2013 at 05:41 PM. Reason: More

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