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Thread: Critical Phases of Training...

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    Default Critical Phases of Training...

    So I'm at a meeting at work today and we are discussing the critical phases of flight and when the most accidents happen (takeoffs, ascending, cruise, approach, etc, etc). And tonight I am thinking about what would be our critical phases o training and where we go wrong, where we all have the most "accidents". We can break this down into so many areas...first 6 months, ob, ff, cc, yard work, marking, etc. We have to lay the foundation right so that we can have a strong house. So I ask, what is your most critical phase of training? What part of your foundation, if you don't have it absolutely perfect, the house will fall to the ground.

    I'm thinking of this because of two reasons...one, because I have a young dog that is a good marking dog and will make a good gun dog but I don't believe he will make the advanced training because of his lack of drive and desire. This is very frustrating to me but I have to realize that this is part of it and have to adjust my training program and/or wash him out. And I came across a quote from Mr. Lardy in an article this week that I want to live by for my training..."Mike has one major rule: he will not train a bad dog, who is either uncooperative or lacks desire."

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    Senior Member Willie Alderson's Avatar
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    To me, the critical phase of training begins with basics. It is difficult for a dog to proceed to any advanced level of training without having a solid foundation of basics. My lack of experience with my first dog several years ago showed me how important those basics are. It's not impossible, but it sure makes training "easier".
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    Senior Member Hunt'EmUp's Avatar
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    The foundation (OB, CC & FF) are probably the most critical phases; figure these are the tools you always go back to. CC a dogs relationship with the collar; which you will use for the dogs entire life. and FF a dogs response to pressure; which you will also train for the dogs entire life. Get these things done right and your ~75% ahead of the game; most later problems seem to stem from deficiency in these basics. After that the next critical is handling; basically FTP and Water-force; both are important; but I've seen way more problems with dogs and improper water-force, seems after someone FFs a dog correctly they can transition that use of pressure to FTP on land; but throw in water-collar-pressure, inability to get out to dog; and things get lax in the standard dept. That seems to come back and bite you later.
    Last edited by Hunt'EmUp; 11-22-2013 at 10:31 AM.
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    Senior Member mitty's Avatar
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    I'm on my first dog. I had to go back and patch holes in basics all the time. It was not a big deal for me. What has impeded my dog's progress the most was my poor understanding of the sit standard. I thought her being steady meant I had a good "sit." I did not understand how crisp sits needed to be, though. A crisp sit affects everything, from steadiness to a clean delivery to hand to blinds.
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    Senior Member Evan's Avatar
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    Puppy conditioning - 7 weeks to 6 months
    Formal Basics (formal obedience through swim-by) 6 to 12-14 months on average
    Early Transition
    Mid Transition
    Late Transition

    The age brackets mentioned are general, and differ with each one. But to me those are the phases of training/development as I observe them. If one can be said to be most important I would choose Basics. But that could not be to the exclusion of the first 6 months of bonding, socialization, and conditioning of puppy hood.

    Evan
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    Quote Originally Posted by mitty View Post
    I'm on my first dog. I had to go back and patch holes in basics all the time. It was not a big deal for me. What has impeded my dog's progress the most was my poor understanding of the sit standard. I thought her being steady meant I had a good "sit." I did not understand how crisp sits needed to be, though. A crisp sit affects everything, from steadiness to a clean delivery to hand to blinds.
    Finding this out myself. EVERYTHING starts out with the dog sitting.
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    Senior Member Randy Bohn's Avatar
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    In my opinion basics are important and the dog allows you to make mistakes and recover with usually no harm done...BUT dogs with improper TRANSITION TRAINING won't usually let you as a trainer make to many mistakes and still forgive you....Randy
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    Senior Member polmaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Webbs515 View Post
    So I'm at a meeting at work today and we are discussing the critical phases of flight and when the most accidents happen (takeoffs, ascending, cruise, approach, etc, etc). And tonight I am thinking about what would be our critical phases o training and where we go wrong, where we all have the most "accidents". We can break this down into so many areas...first 6 months, ob, ff, cc, yard work, marking, etc. We have to lay the foundation right so that we can have a strong house. So I ask, what is your most critical phase of training? What part of your foundation, if you don't have it absolutely perfect, the house will fall to the ground.

    I'm thinking of this because of two reasons...one, because I have a young dog that is a good marking dog and will make a good gun dog but I don't believe he will make the advanced training because of his lack of drive and desire. This is very frustrating to me but I have to realize that this is part of it and have to adjust my training program and/or wash him out. And I came across a quote from Mr. Lardy in an article this week that I want to live by for my training..."Mike has one major rule: he will not train a bad dog, who is either uncooperative or lacks desire."
    He means ''Focus'' !
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    we can break all these areas down even further. I totally agree that basics is very important if not the most important. but what part of basics is the most important? the heel command, the sit command, here command, etc. what one thing can we not do without to have an advanced dog? A NFC, NAFC, MH...
    maybe i'm tying to be to detailed..lol. its just a discussion.

    1. dog has to have to have the right paper (pedigree)
    2. dog has to have desire (love to retrieve and train)
    3. dog has to handle pressure (ff to advanced training)

    I think that a complete ff program covers all of these. if a dog can handle force fetch and it is solid, then I think the dog has the best chances of being great

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    Senior Member BJGatley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Bohn View Post
    In my opinion basics are important and the dog allows you to make mistakes and recover with usually no harm done...BUT dogs with improper TRANSITION TRAINING won't usually let you as a trainer make to many mistakes and still forgive you....Randy
    Man do I agree to that wholeheartedly. At the later phase in training you should know that dog's tendencies and be able to react in the right way, but then again...We are human and they are a dog.

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