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Thread: Confused newbie with a question

  1. #1
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    Default Confused newbie with a question

    I have a started Chocolate Male who is JH titled. Before I begin to start to train him for his SH test I'm really struggling with where to start. I've done plenty of reading and looked at several programs but just thought I'd get some advice from folks more knowledgable than me.

    Also. Just on a whim today while out with my son I took a bumper and walked it out about 50 yards by a tree in a field he had never been to before. Took him back to the line and and lined him up, told him "dead bird" and then gently gave the command of "back" and he burnt a straight line and returned promptly like he'd done the drill a hundred times. Is this normal for a dog that's just has his JH? I guess I was under the assumption that since he had not been trained to sit on the whistle that he hadn't been introduced to blinds or casting.
    Admittedly I'm a novice here and often get the feeling Moses is training me more than I'm training him

    thanks in advance for any advice.
    -cn

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    Senior Member Gun_Dog2002's Avatar
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    You need to ask the resident Nutt for help


    /Paul
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    Thanks. I'm new but think I have seen his posts before. I'll give it a shot.

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    Senior Member Mary Lynn Metras's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gun_Dog2002 View Post
    You need to ask the resident Nutt for help


    /Paul
    You are certainly trying to get mileage out of that title!
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    Senior Member Wayne Nutt's Avatar
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    I will try to help but first a couple of questions: how old is ur dog and what training has he had? Are you part of a training group or a club member?
    Wayne Nutt
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  6. #6
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    Hi Wayne,
    Thanks for your help
    Hes 3 years old. He was taken to his JH title by Mike Dunn at dunn dog retrievers. In my very amateur opinion he's a great started dog, but again that's my amateur opinion.
    Here's the things I've observed
    Doesn't break
    handles single and double marks exceptionally well out to 125- 150 on land and water
    heels nicely and always delivers bird to hand. (Very soft mouth and appears to have been very well FF trained)
    very well socialized and eager to train and retrieve despite being a bench champion.
    The overall feel I get from him is he knows a lot more than I do about this game as I'm pretty new. My main concern as someone that's new is that I ensure I'm taking that right-first-step with him as we both move forward.
    i thought that natural step would be to train him to sit on the whistle which obviously had not been done but then yesterday (as described in my previous post) to my complete surprise he takes off on a permanent blind likes he's been trained to do it. Confusing.
    i don't belong to any clubs or training groups yet.
    I plan on getting involved in a club in the northeast Kansas area in the next few weeks.
    hope this helps
    -cn
    Last edited by Bluemax009; 12-31-2013 at 07:00 AM.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Bridget Bodine's Avatar
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    The first thing you need to do is talk to the trainer and find out how far along he was in training when he left. A Lot of pros will have a dog further in training than the level it is running in a test
    BB
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    Senior Member KwickLabs's Avatar
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    [”Just on a whim today while out with my son I took a bumper and walked it out about 50 yards by a tree in a field he had never been to before. Took him back to the line and and lined him up, told him "dead bird" and then gently gave the command of "back" and he burnt a straight line and returned promptly like he'd done the drill a hundred times.

    He is 3 years old. He was taken to his JH title by Mike Dunn at Dunn Dog Retrievers. In my very amateur opinion he's a great started dog, but again that's my amateur opinion. Here's the things I've observed Doesn't break handles single and double marks exceptionally well out to 125- 150 on land and water heels nicely and always delivers bird to hand. (Very soft mouth and appears to have been very well FF trained) very well socialized and eager to train and retrieve despite being a bench champion. The overall feel I get from him is he knows a lot more than I do about this game to my complete surprise he takes off on a permanent blind likes he's been trained to do it

    Is this normal for a dog that's just has his JH?”


    First of all, walking a dog out 50 yards, dropping a bumper, walking back with the dog would be called a “walk out blind” and not a cold blind. A permanent blind is more often referred to as a pattern blind which would be the next phase before cold blinds. I'd say with the training your dog has (pro), his age and your description of his abilities to date....the retrieve should not be surprising.

    I can remember back many years ago when training my first pup on her first cold blind.....she's already done walk outs and many patterns. I left her in the van and walked out of sight into a large field in a circular path so as to NOT leave a trail to the cold blind (this was to be at 100 yards). After returning to the van which was parked back from the trail to the training area and letting her out of her crate, I turned around to pick up my heeling stick. Looking back, she was gone and I soon guessed she was up the trail and out of sight.

    As I walked (up the trail) to the training area, Taffey was coming back with the bumper. My....my was that a surprise! How's she do that? Well, a fortunate coincidence revealed the how. There was a great deal of dew on the ground. I could see where she had come back from the blind but the route to the blind followed my circuitous route to the spot. Apparently, she had tracked me. That's generally why when planting cold blinds you should walk a path NOT on the line to the blind or let the dog see you.

    Drawing a parallel with your “situation” you apparently have a talented, intelligent, young dog with a solid start. With a JH title and probably running 100+ marks often, a 50 yard scamper to a known spot should be fairly simple. He saw where you went (walked the path out and back once before) and retrieved what most would call a “walk out blind”. So....no that wasn't all that surprising, but certainly you'd have every right to be pleased.

    It appears you have a very nice young dog to work with. Get a sequential program and work it. Have fun!
    Last edited by KwickLabs; 12-31-2013 at 10:31 AM.
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  9. #9
    Senior Member PalouseDogs's Avatar
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    Dogs in general, and I think retrievers in particular, are good at looking in the direction a person is looking. And, as noted, your dog may be further along in training than you think.

    A more prosaic explanation is that, if you walked straight out and straight back, the dog was following your trail. Or, you were facing into the wind when you sent you dog. Or the dog was looking out the window of your vehicle when you dropped the bumper.

    Try walking a circle, dropping the bumper on the opposite side, and sending the dog with the wind at your back.
    Kelly Cassidy (person)

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  10. #10
    Senior Member John Robinson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridget Bodine View Post
    The first thing you need to do is talk to the trainer and find out how far along he was in training when he left. A Lot of pros will have a dog further in training than the level it is running in a test
    This is what I would do. As Bridget mentioned above, it is highly likely your pro has him trained more than you think. Most pros teach handling skills fairly early as it gives them a tool to use in marking, plus they usually hold off on running even Junior until the dog is steady and has good marking skills. I would day train with your pro a few times and ask him to show you some drills you can set up on your own. Then periodically rturn to the pro and advance the dog that way.

    John

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