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Thread: Silver Labs?

  1. #81
    Senior Member metalone67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Backwater View Post
    I'm confused....red is yellow??? so why can't silver be chocolate?
    Because Fox reds carry the right genetic codes proving they are in fact a shade of yellow.
    Silvers carry a dd which is not found in labs, but only in Wiemeraners.
    The foundation to a great retriever is obedience.
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  2. #82
    Senior Member DoubleHaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by copterdoc View Post

    And then tell me who "Robert Young of the AKC" is, and what position he holds, or once held, with the AKC.[/COLOR]
    He is the Web Content Editor/Web Photographer. What do I win?

  3. #83
    Senior Member Sharon Potter's Avatar
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    There's a little more to that AKC story. The spin put on it is rather interesting, but that's what spin does. AKC did send a rep to a certain kennel, and the rep said the dogs looked like Labs, and that they kinda looked like very light brown, so they should be registered chocolate. AKC went with that and registered the dogs, and that rep ended up losing his job over it.

    The bottom line is that gray/silver is a disqualifying color and will never be an acceptable color to the parent club. Unfortunately, that information isn't ever included with all the spin.
    Sharon Potter

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  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by SLAB View Post
    You might check both sides of the coin out. http://www.labradorcouncil.com/silver-lab-facts.html

    You might try both sides of the coin.
    I don't think anyone is intending to put down your dog personally. Everyone here for the most part would love on any dog they meet. The bigger issue is that the vast majority of silver dogs for sale are bred by people for color alone with no regard to performance ability or health. The link above appears to have been made by one person. I'd be very curious to know if the "Labrador Council" was actually a real organization with a Tax Code status rather than a persons' attempt to make a fictional organization to support a special interest.

  5. #85
    Senior Member Jerry Beil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul "Happy" Gilmore View Post
    I don't think anyone is intending to put down your dog personally. Everyone here for the most part would love on any dog they meet. The bigger issue is that the vast majority of silver dogs for sale are bred by people for color alone with no regard to performance ability or health. The link above appears to have been made by one person. I'd be very curious to know if the "Labrador Council" was actually a real organization with a Tax Code status rather than a persons' attempt to make a fictional organization to support a special interest.
    I think you're probably largely right, and 100% right about the folks here loving on any dog regardless of color...

    However, there is more than just breeding for color that folks take issue with. The breed is defined, and part of that definition is color. There is no allowance for silver or charcoal or grey or blue or green labs. There's also no allowance for a long haired curly version. When folks start intentionally trying to add in their little designed elements, and when dogs displaying or carrying those characteristics then get registered as AKC labs, then you end up with those characteristics in the gene pool, or more commonly in the gene pool. If the breed standard specifically states that the color is disqualifying, then folks shouldn't be trying to breed for it. If that's what someone wants to do, they should create their own breed instead of misleading people and damaging the existing breed. It's just not good practice to specifically target and breed FOR disqualifying traits. The breed can't be everything for everyone.

    Bottom line, if it can be proven that there is Weimeraner blood in there on those labs, then they're not purebred labs at all. But that's secondary to the main point that it's still a disqualifying trait, and if you want to breed and register labs as pure bred labs, that's not something that should be your goal.
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  6. #86
    Senior Member Sharon Potter's Avatar
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    I like all dogs. I don't care what color/breed/religion they are...I enjoy them all.

    What I don't like are scam artists, which from my experience 99.99% (NOTE: I didn't say ALL) of the silver breeders are, whether they intend to be or not. If they would do their homework and then just be honest about what they're doing, I'd be fine with it, but they don't and aren't. And I also think many of them have just "drank the Kool-Aid" provided by the folks who started all this awhile back, and either are so caught up in the cash end that they don't want to become more educated, thereby keeping their heads in the sand, or they're simply gullible enough to believe what they've been told and don't look further.

    The issue isn't about the dogs, it's about the people.
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  7. #87
    Senior Member Lonnie Spann's Avatar
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    if anyone knows of a silver FC x FC breeding please let me know. I need one to train for the Grand.

    L Spann
    Last edited by Lonnie Spann; 01-21-2014 at 05:26 PM.
    DISCLAIMER: The above post is the opinionated and biased view of your's truly, Lonnie Spann, and is in no way intended to reflect the opinions or views of the unfortunate individuals named below who just happen to be doomed with guilt by association.

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  8. #88
    Senior Member DoubleHaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharon Potter View Post
    If they would do their homework and then just be honest about what they're doing, I'd be fine with it, but they don't and aren't.
    This is the part I don't get. You don't have to be a rocket geneticist to know that breeding specifically for a recessive trait often brings bad things along with it. With all the rage about the various designer breeds, why not just call 'em Weimadors and charge more? Personally I would be more comfortable with someone who showed me how they bred healthy labs and healthy Weims with all their hunting instincts intact to make the dog than going crazy on a deeply recessive gene.

  9. #89
    Senior Member SloppyMouth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharon Potter View Post
    The bottom line is that gray/silver is a disqualifying color and will never be an acceptable color to the parent club.
    Never say never, Sharon. Chocolate wasn't an acceptable color at one time, either.

    I want to know how everyone KNOWS that dd has NEVER been part of Labrador genetics.

    And what about Amy Dahl's post on her research into the topic...with a man that was part of the canine genome project, who believes it's a very old mutation that has been in the breed?

  10. #90
    Senior Member suepuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleHaul View Post
    This is the part I don't get. You don't have to be a rocket geneticist to know that breeding specifically for a recessive trait often brings bad things along with it. With all the rage about the various designer breeds, why not just call 'em Weimadors and charge more? Personally I would be more comfortable with someone who showed me how they bred healthy labs and healthy Weims with all their hunting instincts intact to make the dog than going crazy on a deeply recessive gene.
    This is the problem. (highlighted area). People are lazy and greedy. They don't have to know ANYTHING and they can believe what the News tells them and the breeders that have champion 'lines' and silver is a real color, etc, and make money. It's easy. Sharon is right. If you are really concerned about doing whats right, it's not 'easy'. They are not even attempting to know basic genetics. That would be too hard....why do you need that? Someone is still gonna be suckered into buying the silver, 7 toed, dual tailed lab because it will be 'cool'. And cost ten million over time due to vet bills....

    Sue Puff
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