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Thread: westminister

  1. #61
    Senior Member hotel4dogs's Avatar
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    While I also think the flat coated people are awesome, I do want to point out that it's *relatively* easy to get a CH on a flat coated retriever compared to a Golden retriever or a Labrador.
    The flat coats only have to beat a handful of dogs, twice (plus beat one other dog several times) to get the CH. The Goldens have to beat, in this area, at least 21 other dogs at least twice, plus 3-4 other dogs several times, to get the CH. It's not easy. The labradors are even worse with the numbers it takes to get a CH.
    The competition for the bench CH in Goldens and Labradors is fierce.

    Quote Originally Posted by jollycurl View Post
    Food for thought:

    Chessie entry: 14; 3 JHs, 3 SHs
    Curly entry: 8; 1 JH, 1MH
    Flat entry: 21; 6 JHs, 1 SH
    Golden entry: 38; 3 JHs
    Lab entry: 38; 3JHs, 1MH
    Toller entry: no titles

    These statistics are based on the dogs that were shown. I did not count absentees.

    Once again, I am humbled in the presence of the Flat-Coated Retriever people who work so hard to keep the form and function of their dogs a priority.

    Barb Gibson
    with
    CH Rosewood Little Giant UDX VER RA MHU SH MXP MJP XFP T2BP VCX WCX CCA CGC FFX-OG
    also UCH HR UUD UJJ URO1 UHIT
    (golden retriever) born 3-10-07
    a.k.a. "Tito", "The Tito Monster"
    www.GoTeamTito.com

  2. #62
    Senior Member achiro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hotel4dogs View Post
    While I also think the flat coated people are awesome, I do want to point out that it's *relatively* easy to get a CH on a flat coated retriever compared to a Golden retriever or a Labrador.
    The flat coats only have to beat a handful of dogs, twice (plus beat one other dog several times) to get the CH. The Goldens have to beat, in this area, at least 21 other dogs at least twice, plus 3-4 other dogs several times, to get the CH. It's not easy. The labradors are even worse with the numbers it takes to get a CH.
    The competition for the bench CH in Goldens and Labradors is fierce.
    I'm not sure that I understand what numbers have to do with ignoring written breed standards?
    "The thing I admire about the rat tail is that it takes commitment. It's not like one day you just decide you want one, you have to grow out that bad boy and you have to repeatedly convince the hairdresser to trust you because it's a great idea."

  3. #63
    Senior Member Hunt'EmUp's Avatar
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    I watched in on TV, the lab looked out of place in the sporting group; if they continue to put that look up in the sporting group, there's never going to be a Lab running for best in show @ Westminster. Now the golden was refreshing, moderate and well done compared to what they have put up previously. The judge must've liked the look as the dog took 3rd. I thought the flat coat was beautiful, more muscle and bone than you usually see in the breed. Seems weird that the cockers gets to put in 3 varieties of the same dog; sort've stacks the deck for that breed. Still this might be something for the Lab people to think about 2 varieties Show and Field. Seems like the breed divisions are off, why is the water dog in working (guarding)group and not the sporting group, why isn't the standard poodle in the sporting group? The ones I was rooting for the mini-pin, the corgy and the blood hound (he was Fat, with too much skin But Bloodhounds are COOL), Of course they choose a fluffy variety, at least it was a sporting breed. I'll never understand the appeal of that poodle look (the announcers can say it all they want no-one has ever hunted a dog cut like that). Still I think overall the judges put up really nice dogs for the final, it would've been hard to pick a winner.
    Last edited by Hunt'EmUp; 02-12-2014 at 10:57 AM.
    "They's Just DAWGS"
    "Hunting is a skill to be learned whether you do it early or late it still needs to be learned"
    "I train dogs, Not papers"

    GMRH HRCH Quick MH (most importantly Duck/Upland Enthusiast)
    MHR HRCH Lakota MH (most importantly Upland/Duck Enthusiast)
    SHR Storm.. the Pup (Beginning Upland & Waterfowl Enthusiast)

  4. #64
    Senior Member JS's Avatar
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    The dog in question is FAT! That's all we know. Fat is easy to fix.

    Fat has nothing to with her genetic predisposition to hunt. That dog MAY be a marking fool! MAY be able to remember a 3-retired quad. We'll never know' All we know is what we see.

    Some people choose to play a different game, that's all. And they do what they need to do to win at their game. That's what WE do. Be stupid not to. We hear a lot of people say there are probably potential NFCs laying around on peoples' sofas. Could be. Could be some of them are running around a conformation ring, too.

    Whip that dog into shape and send him to Mr. Danny. Then we'll know what he can do. Or not.

    JS
    “Don’t wave your phony patriotism in MY face! If you really love America, open your wallet and hire an American kid to build what you buy. Think of all our problems that might solve.” Doug Fraser (paraphrased) 1980

    Real Americans buy American.



    Snowshoe's All American Guy SH, UDX, WCX ... CODY ... at the bridge
    CH. Snowshoe's Girl Crazy MH, UD, WCX, SDHF, OS ... PRESLEY
    ... at the bridge
    Millpond's Baby Boomer MH*** ... BABE
    Snowshoe's Crazy For Lovin You SH ... NELSON

  5. #65
    Senior Member swampcollielover's Avatar
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    As I watched the show I got a distinct impression that many of the judges had already decided on which dog was going to win....based on the history of the dog in competition. It seems like this should be irrelevant, as each dog will show differently at different times...yet the ones with the deepest history of wins, usually carried the show....

    I agree the lab was a poor representation of the breed...but I am not a trained judge...

    Like the Golden a lot!

  6. #66
    Senior Member EdA's Avatar
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    Westminster generates these same discussions every year regarding Labradors which makes one wonder why people with field trial/hunt test/hunting Labradors care. That Best of Show Wirehaired Fox Terrier certainly was not fat like the obese Labrador that the conformation people seem to find attractive.

  7. #67
    Senior Member JS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EdA View Post
    Westminster generates these same discussions every year regarding Labradors which makes one wonder why people with field trial/hunt test/hunting Labradors care. That Best of Show Wirehaired Fox Terrier certainly was not fat like the obese Labrador that the conformation people seem to find attractive.
    That's right, Dr.! We should all petition the Westminster club to move their show to June ... then none of us would be sitting inside at the computer fussin' about it.

    Only thing I don't like are all the generalizations that come out. When I take a dog to the line, I just want a judge to watch me and see what I can do. Never mind what we look like in a picture.

    JS
    “Don’t wave your phony patriotism in MY face! If you really love America, open your wallet and hire an American kid to build what you buy. Think of all our problems that might solve.” Doug Fraser (paraphrased) 1980

    Real Americans buy American.



    Snowshoe's All American Guy SH, UDX, WCX ... CODY ... at the bridge
    CH. Snowshoe's Girl Crazy MH, UD, WCX, SDHF, OS ... PRESLEY
    ... at the bridge
    Millpond's Baby Boomer MH*** ... BABE
    Snowshoe's Crazy For Lovin You SH ... NELSON

  8. #68
    Senior Member Sharon Potter's Avatar
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    Take all the extra weight off that dog and you would still have a very out of proportion dog, with short legs and a long body. Structurally unsuited for the purpose the breed is meant for.
    Sharon Potter

    www.redbranchkennels.net

    Chesapeake Bay Retrievers...too many to list.

    Team Huntsmith

  9. #69
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    Are there any Show Judges on this forum that can explain why Show Dogs have to be heavier ? Why is that look more appealing than that of the actual Breed Standard?

  10. #70
    Senior Member luvmylabs23139's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sharon Potter View Post
    Here's a comparison: Breed standard illustration compared to the Westminster Best of Breed.

    Attachment 17239Attachment 17240
    Didn't watch and just assumed this was the usual bash the show dogs thread. Then I clicked on that pic. Yikes!
    Hihope Hiland Heathen of Perth CD, RE, CGC, TDI

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