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Thread: Show vs. Field enlightenment

  1. #11
    Senior Member .44 magnum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Lash View Post
    As I said earlier, I can't understand the split. It makes absolutely no sense to have the show lab be the representative for what Labs are or should be.

    You don't need to be a judge to see that they couldn't run around very long. I'm sure the breeders are intelligent. I'm sure the judges are intelligent. I thought that it might make sense if they envisioned a dog with a different purpose than we do.

    I think anyone would agree that both types couldn't serve the same purpose.

    Why not officially have two separate breeds then? Don't know that there's enough time in a dog's life to do both though.
    So take you Lab or Labs to a dog show and enter them. If thousands of field Labradors showed up with entry fees it certainly would make a statement. All you need is a full AKC registration. Be sure your Labrador is correct height as they may wicket you.

  2. #12
    Senior Member copterdoc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Lash View Post
    ....It makes absolutely no sense to have the show lab be the representative for what Labs are or should be.....
    It's what the system inevitably produces.

    The reason that the issues are so blatantly obvious in the Labrador Retriever breed, isn't that it's a "Lab thing".

    It's because the Labrador Retriever dominates the field in performance competition and testing.
    And thus, it is being selectively bred for that arena on a much larger scale than the other Retriever breeds.

    The problem is with the Conformation system. Across the board, for ALL breeds of dogs.

    And they aren't going to change the system just because we can't use what it produces for honest-to-goodness functional purposes.
    Last edited by copterdoc; 02-23-2014 at 01:10 PM.
    Considering the fact that God limited the intelligence of man, it seems unfair that he did not also limit his stupidity". -Unknown

  3. #13
    Senior Member .44 magnum's Avatar
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    So football players have not changed from the fifties to the players 60 years into the future ? Things change. The rich only owned the dogs you are showing pictures of. The numbers were never as great as today.

    Just curious. At adult age how tall is your Labrador at the withers ? Just about every Field Lab male I run into hunting towers over my Labrador who is to standard height.

    I am betting your Field Labs today are quite taller then Labs of the past you are posting pictures of. They are beautiful specimens, but also not to standard.

    Size - The height at the withers for a dog is 22-1/2 to 24-1/2 inches; for a bitch is 21-1/2 to 23-1/2 inches. Any variance greater than 1/2 inch above or below these heights is a disqualification. Approximate weight of dogs and bitches in working condition: dogs 65 to 80 pounds; bitches 55 to 70 pounds. The minimum height ranges set forth in the paragraph above shall not apply to dogs or bitches under twelve months of age.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by .44 magnum View Post
    So football players have not changed from the fifties to the players 60 years into the future ? Things change. The rich only owned the dogs you are showing pictures of. The numbers were never as great as today.

    Just curious. At adult age how tall is your Labrador at the withers ? Just about every Field Lab male I run into hunting towers over my Labrador who is to standard height.

    I am betting your Field Labs today are quite taller then Labs of the past you are posting pictures of. They are beautiful specimens, but also not to standard.
    Ive been a High School coach for 32 yrs, and feel comfortable saying that it's very difficult to compare football players of today with those 60 yrs ago. Mainly due to weight programs and nutrition, plus the fact that, just like the Labrador breed itself, there's more of 'em.
    Ive owned 6 field trial bred bitches since 1997. All were somewhere between 21 and 23". Four were 21-21 1/2", two over 22". My tall girl measured in at 23.
    We are only as good as those that surround us.

    Birthplace to:
    •FC-BAYOU TECHE TEX-'09 Nat'l Finalist
    •FC-BUTCH's DREAM CODE of TCR-2x Nat'l Qualifier
    •FC-DREAM DANCIN'-2x Nat'l Qualifier
    Gettin' Jiggy Widdit-MH
    Dancin' Dreamer Kate-MH (•FC-"FINN",QAA-"Coal"-MNHofF, QAAs-"Tank", QAA-"Allie", MH-"Tease", QAA-"Hardy", MNH-Ruby)

    RIP Sweet mama Dancy!!!

  5. #15

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    Maybe the Retriever or gun dog clubs should get together and start a working show dogs type of event. Minimum quals or title to be called a working dog as a pre-requisite to enter, then hold the beauty contest. You could go as deep as you want, best of breed, best color of each breed and then best of show etc...

    I can feel the cost of new pups going up already.

  6. #16
    Senior Member Swack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by duckstruck View Post
    Maybe the Retriever or gun dog clubs should get together and start a working show dogs type of event. Minimum quals or title to be called a working dog as a pre-requisite to enter, then hold the beauty contest. You could go as deep as you want, best of breed, best color of each breed and then best of show etc...

    I can feel the cost of new pups going up already.
    duckstruck,

    The LRC has a requirement for their members that show champions must pass a WC to be able to use the title CH. What do you think about a field Lab having to get a conformation certificate (CC) before they can use the titles FC, AFC, MH, etc.?

    Swack
    Jeff Swackhamer

  7. #17
    Senior Member John Lash's Avatar
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    n a Labrador Filed Trial dog the only thing that matters relative to the show side is if your puppy has white between the paws from Dual CH Banchory Bolo (1915-27)

    .

    Interesting, I don't know if all dogs with Bolo spots descended from him, but Lb. has one.
    John Lash

    "If you run Field Trials, you learn to swallow your disappointment quickly."

    "Field trials are not a game for good dogs. They're for great dogs with great training." E. Graham

  8. #18
    Senior Member Swack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breck View Post
    In a Labrador Filed Trial dog the only thing that matters relative to the show side is if your puppy has white between the paws from Dual CH Banchory Bolo (1915-27)
    Attachment 17419
    .
    Attachment 17420
    Breck,

    May I ask why this is important to you?

    Swack
    Jeff Swackhamer

  9. #19
    Senior Member Breck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swack View Post
    Breck,

    May I ask why this is important to you?

    Swack
    Yes, Field Trial Champion lure.
    Mine had 'em.
    .
    Same holds for the "Zipper" between the eyes.
    "Darla" AFC Candlewoods Lil Smokin Tequila (2002-2013)(fondly remembered)
    "Smoke" Smokin Auggies Menace, QAA (2003- )(retired nut case, ask Rando)
    "Simba" Humewood Simba (1999-2014)(my 1st dog)

    .
    Per favore, non mi rompere i coglioni.
    Grazie




  10. #20
    Senior Member crackerd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by .44 magnum View Post
    So football players have not changed from the fifties to the players 60 years into the future Things change.
    Yeah, great analogy, right? Football players over the last 50-60 years have gotten bigger, faster, stronger and more athletic.

    Meanwhile, Labrador retrievers - of the conformation persuasion - have gotten bigger. And bigger...and bigger. Nobody needs to tell you what "bigger"'s a euphemism for, either.

    Quote Originally Posted by .44 magnum View Post
    Just about every Field Lab male I run into hunting towers over my Labrador who is to standard height.

    I am betting your Field Labs today are quite taller then Labs of the past...
    You might want to run into a few more of them



    from a little closer vantage, say at a field trial.

    MG

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