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Thread: Show vs. Field enlightenment

  1. #31
    Senior Member Cowtown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by copterdoc View Post
    Anybody that takes the WC or WCX seriously, is too far gone to be able to recover.
    It's for show dogs.

    Geez some people just like to criticize every damn thing.

  2. #32
    Senior Member Maxs Mom's Avatar
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    WC and WCX for the Goldens is considerably different than the Labrador WC. Labradors also have a CC (CCA) I don't know it's as highly sought after. I know many CH Goldens who get their CCA as it's judged differently and takes attitude into consideration. When I took my dog for her CCA one dog was DQ'd for going after the other dogs during socialization.

    At Labrador National they have a "performance" conformation class. I've not seen it yet but hope to put my husbands lab in it next fall. It allows altered dogs. They have a contest called "The Challenge" and it's about scoring Q's and points in multiple venues including conformation. They don't count the CC or WC for The Challenge if my memory is correct. So they created an additional conformation class. I'm curious how my husbands lab will do. She looks like a lab, adheres to standard but has a tiny waist.
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swack View Post
    duckstruck,

    The LRC has a requirement for their members that show champions must pass a WC to be able to use the title CH. What do you think about a field Lab having to get a conformation certificate (CC) before they can use the titles FC, AFC, MH, etc.?

    Swack
    I think that is is a good idea, , but that it should be an AKC requirement to get the title in the first place.

    john
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  4. #34
    Senior Member twall's Avatar
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    [QUOTEc;1191948]The problem is with the Conformation system. Across the board, for ALL breeds of dogs.

    And they aren't going to change the system just because we can't use what it produces for honest-to-goodness functional purposes.[/QUOTE]

    This is the pot calling the kettle black, you are the problem not me! If you did/thought my everything would be better.

    Before there were recognized breeds dogs were referred to what they did, retrievers, herders, flushers, etc. From there breeds were developed. Once a type was set a standard was developed. The standard describes what the breed is. This goes beyond just how it looks. It inclubes attributes that are often unique to that breed. In some cases it may include disqualifications.

    It much easier to blame the field Labrador faction for the breed split that the show faction. The field type labs are not shown, and have not been shown in numbers for at least a couple of decades. Ultimately, judges can only judge what is exhibited to them. As time goes by that type becomes set in peoples mind as being correct.

    Tom
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  5. #35
    Senior Member John Robinson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by copterdoc View Post
    Anybody that takes the WC or WCX seriously, is too far gone to be able to recover.
    It can be a good first step. I met a couple women at the 2011 Golden Specialty in Colorado. They were down from Canada with their show-obedience Golden's and wanted to try and get WC-WCX titles on their dogs. Golden retriever people tend to believe their breed is one of, if not the most versatile breeds ever, so many go for as many titles as possible. Anyway these women are serious trainers and competitors and were worried about the flyers because they don't have flyers in Canada, so we shot some flyers for them after the day's stake. I was wary expecting these show dogs to be disinterested reluctant retrievers. Boy was I wrong, these two dogs were high flying retrieving machines that flew out there for this new treat.

    They went on that week to get their WC or WCX. Fast forward to last years Specialty in Texas, Leanne after a couple years of training got fourth in the Qualifying. She continues to compete in Show, Obediance and Agility, but is now interested in field trials. Leanne also encouraged and helped my field trial buddy Dave Cheatum to show his field trial dog in the field-show event at the specialty where Fire earned a second place.

    Now I have to say, regardless the feel good story I just told, I think the split between field and show dogs is even larger in Goldens than Labs. Hopefully Leeanne is one of the first pioneers in leading us back to where we came from.

  6. #36
    Senior Member copterdoc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cowtown View Post
    It's for show dogs......
    You might be on to something.
    Considering the fact that God limited the intelligence of man, it seems unfair that he did not also limit his stupidity". -Unknown

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by john fallon View Post
    I think that is is a good idea, , but that it should be an AKC requirement to get the title in the first place.

    john

    Personally I think the idea of denying an extremely talented dog the title of FC or AFC because it doesn't meet some standard that defines some folk's idea of what a perty Labrador looks like is offensive and idiotic.
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  8. #38
    Senior Member Swack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    Personally I think the idea of denying an extremely talented dog the title of FC or AFC because it doesn't meet some standard that defines some folk's idea of what a perty Labrador looks like is offensive and idiotic.
    Buzz,

    I was playing the devil's advocate. Several people have commented in various threads that they think show Labs should have to prove they can retrieve to be called a Champion Labrador retriever. Their logic is that the dog's are representing the breed and should be able to do the work.

    Using the same logic, but from the other side of the fence, why shouldn't a field Lab be required to meet some minimum requirements of the standard in order to represent the breed as a Field Champion Labrador retriever. After all, they too are representing the breed.

    If both of these policies were put into practice, I'd bet that show Labs would become better in the field and field Labs would be more likely to meet the basic requirements of the standard.

    Just food for thought.

    Swack
    Jeff Swackhamer

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    Personally I think the idea of denying an extremely talented dog the title of FC or AFC because it doesn't meet some standard that defines some folk's idea of what a perty Labrador looks like is offensive and idiotic.

    I agree with Swack, and...if it had startes 40 years ago, the lack of dual champions the breed is experiencing now would not be so pronounced...

    It is short sighted mindsets such as the one you experss that have paid a large part in getting us to this point.

    john
    Last edited by john fallon; 02-24-2014 at 06:30 PM.
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  10. #40
    Senior Member suepuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swack View Post
    Buzz,

    Using the same logic, but from the other side of the fence, why shouldn't a field Lab be required to meet some minimum requirements of the standard in order to represent the breed as a Field Champion Labrador retriever. After all, they too are representing the breed.

    Swack
    Yet another brilliant suggestion Swack. Your emphasis was well placed.
    Sue Puffenbarger
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