The entire sport( LOL )of dog shows is a corrupt process. One person, the judge, should not decide which dog is better. Who is to say politics do not enter into decisions.
I understand the animus towards those who do not keep their dogs at healthy weights and condition. Myself I consider that cruel. To keep a sporting breed kenneled and not let run or take them into a field or for a swim baffles my understanding of dog breeding.
I blame the Field breeders as much as the show breeders also. While the Field bred lab today can run fast, his muzzle is snippy, his legs too long , and he has lost the otter tail. He looks more like a greyhound.
Some show breeders are breeding too much for bone and a typy look. The extremes in both the field and show Labradors is something old timers like me find unpleasant.
If one looks at one of America's most respected Labrador breeders, the Dickendall web site shows how much the dog they bred in the sixties has changed from the dogs they breed today. This is one breeder whose dogs have been used over and over the last forty years. They are structurally sound and hunt well. They need to be worked is all. Myself I've hunted with one for 7 seasons and he can go all day. He goes hiking with me up some very big mountains with the ease of a bear or mountain lion. He does not break down. He is also a well behaved and gentle dog. I would not trade him for any Labrador on earth today.
First Champ ... http://www.dickendall.com/flip.html
Master Hunter today .. http://www.dickendall.com/decker.html
Last edited by .44 magnum; 03-08-2014 at 12:24 PM.
I don't think I smell like a brewery. I was drinking Scotch.
Good post! I'd didn't know you spoke "Labrador"? Good to know you appreciate the history.
I thought the Sandylands history showed a progression from that of an athletic working Lab in the earliest photos toward a dog with too short a muzzle, with too much "substance", lacking the scope to perform as the breed was intended. I've always liked the look of British Justice as a pattern for Labrador breed type. http://www.huntinglabpedigree.com/pedigree.asp?id=2823
It seems things started to go too far in terms of shortened muzzles, shorter legs, and heavier bodies somewhere around Reanacre Mallardhurn Thunder http://www.huntinglabpedigree.com/pedigree.asp?id=3521 or his son Sandylands Mark http://www.huntinglabpedigree.com/pedigree.asp?id=3712.
The links to dickendall provided by .44 Magnum show the changes in that kennel from the working type Lab they began with (from Sandylands blood) to the ubiquitous Dickendall's Arnold.
These examples show what happens when breeders strive for "more". More head, more coat, and more substance. The exaggeration of "type" becomes something that was not what the Labrador retriever ever was or should have become.
Here's a couple of field Labs for comparison. First, take a look at Air Express http://www.huntinglabpedigree.com/pedigree.asp?id=298. I don't think this photo does him justice, but it's hard to find good profile pictures of field Labs. Another decent looking field Lab was Ray's Rascal http://www.huntinglabpedigree.com/pedigree.asp?id=202. I really like the write up for Rascal. Always a hunting dog, easy to train, honest, and eager to please. That's what every Lab should be regardless their appearance.
I must confess I had a hard time finding a really good picture of a really bad looking field Lab. I know there are some out there that miss the mark a mile physically, when it comes to my image of the ideal Lab. It seems I'm more familiar with the names of field Labs from the 70's and 80's than with those of today. It must go with my graying muzzle!
LOL!, Swack, yes I speak a little Labrador My first field training partner had a daughter of Trumarc's Raider when I had a Ki son. Later she bred to Air Express, and also to Westwind's Supernova Chief; the latter breeding produced AFC Back Acher's Son of a Witch. Kendall Herr, of Dickendall Labs, also lived in our area many years ago, so I saw several of her dogs back then as well. both in the ring and at hunt tests. I got familiar with the Lab pedigrees of that day of necessity However, my knowledge is "sketchy" when it comes to more recent dogs.
.44 Magnum, I looked at the photos. I noticed that the 1st CH came from Sandylands, and I must say that I much prefer his type to the more recent Decker. Do you have a photo of your dog to which of these two he more resembles?
Yes, Magnum, there is a political aspect to conformation judging. I believe it happens in almost every venue of dog sport since judging is a subjective thing, but even more subjective in the conformation ring.
"Know in your heart that all things are possible. We couldn't conceive of a miracle if none ever happened." -Libby Fudim
I don't use the PM feature, so just email me direct at the address shown above.
Females will have a different look in the muzzle then males in both show and field Labradors.
Generalizations are wrong, sorry if I came off that way. Do I wish we could have a Labrador we could agree on in it's looks. Yes. I like the first Champ from Dickendall in 1970 more then their Master hunter of today.
Bottom line every Labrador has great qualities. Just remember that some Show breeders have reached the title of Master Hunter with their lines. More should try. Not every Labrador from a littler goes on to be best in breed at Westminster, or win the National Amateur Field Trial Championship.
Is my "Show" bred Lab fat? Many have told me so, but his ribs are easily felt. Pet owners can't do anything about how their dogs look. So some of these threads about Westminster and judging can't be control by non-breeders.
I don't think I smell like a brewery. I was drinking Scotch.
What kennel name does Linda have?
I loved her interviews, particularly the second one. All those labs out at once, I loved it. Her dogs- none looked fat or overdone that I could see. And that chocolate,what a love he was! Great -thanks for sharing!
Waterspook Sables Dark Secret, MH (Sable)
Trumarcs Bankshot Bandit, MH ( Fats)
Waterspook Tomfoolery, SH ( Tommie)
IN MEMORY OF::
Waterspook Bankshot Whiz Bang,JH (Jesse)
Waterspooks Girl Named Bill, SH ( Billie- my princess.....)
Waterspook Kickin' Gunshot, SH ( Boom)
Waterspook Kickin' Good Time MH(Kick)
Waterspooks Partner In Crime, SH ( Bouncer)
Brush Creek Waterspook, JH, WC- my first girl.(Spooky)