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Thread: Snakes!!!

  1. #1
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    Default Snakes!!!

    We are retiring to the inner banks of NC where I hear there are a lot of moccasins, and some rattlers. Our pup will be 6 months old when we make the move. All my lab experience has been in PA where snakes were never an issue. I dont want him to be afraid of sticks and hoses but don't want him getting bit in the face.

  2. #2
    Senior Member waycool's Avatar
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    I've seen tons of dogs desnaked... never really saw an issue with them being "scared of a hose" They know the difference..... Not the worst idea to carry some Dex when in snakey (technical term) areas
    Steve Lithgow
    Las Cruces, NM
    "The thing that makes them good... is the thing that makes them bad" ~Pete Richardson Marble Mtn Walkers, Vermont
    "You can't make chicken salad out of chicken sh*t.... " ~Ron Schaitel
    "What's the difference between a pro and an amateur..... ""About a tenth of a second"" ~Bill Gibbons
    "Ugh... my dog broke....! ""There's never been one worth a flip that hasn't"" ~John Steger

  3. #3
    Senior Member 2tall's Avatar
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    All my dogs got the rattlesnake vaccine last year here in New Mexico. I plan on getting the boosters before we head back east next month. Here's hoping it is effective on the eastern vipers! Anybody know?
    Carol,
    Owned and handled by Cruisin' with Indiana Jones, JH
    Alternate Handler: Westwind Buffalo Soldier
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  4. #4
    Senior Member EdA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2tall View Post
    All my dogs got the rattlesnake vaccine last year here in New Mexico. I plan on getting the boosters before we head back east next month. Here's hoping it is effective on the eastern vipers! Anybody know?
    From Red Rock Biologics manufacturer of the vaccine

    What types of snakes does this vaccine protect against?

    Crotalus Atrox Toxoid (rattlesnake vaccine for dogs) was developed to provide protection for dogs against Western Diamondback Rattlesnake venom. It is most effective against this snake's venom. Venom from many other snakes found throughout the United States is similar to the venom of the Western Diamondback Rattlesnake. Thus, this vaccine may also provide protection against the venoms of the Western Rattlesnake (including the Prairie, Great Basin, Northern and Southern Pacific varieties), Sidewinder, Timber Rattlesnake, Massasauga and the Copperhead. Partial protection may be obtained against Eastern Diamondback Rattlesnake venom.This vaccine does not provide protection against venom from the Water Moccasin (Cottonmouth), Mojave Rattlesnake or Coral Snake.

  5. #5
    Member jrrichar's Avatar
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    2Tall from what I read from the initial trial by Red Rock Biologics (from a research scientist perspective) I think that the vaccine is probably worthless regardless of the snake including the western diamondback, which it was created against. There is simply not enough good scientific information to warrant support of the vaccine (this actually comes from the foremost expert on venom attacks in the country and was written in response to a question from a hunting forum). For example, 38 dogs were run in the only trial the company has released and 4 died from a snakebite (I would assume rattler), which is 11%. According to the snakebite expert, about 12-15% of all dogs will die as the result of a rattlesnake bite, so the difference is not significant.

    This is similar to the lyme vaccine, which many people were excited for and the research was horrible in a rush to market. It failed in humans so got booted to vets and for awhile was supported until the AVMA took the poor research and possibility of adverse effects into consideration and advised against its use.

    Personally, I have decided to forego the vaccine (based on our vet, the expert's opinion, and the science) and instead invest in a high quality rattlesnake avoidance clinic. It still does not mean my dog can't accidentally step on one, but everyones decision is their own.

  6. #6
    Senior Member HPL's Avatar
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    Just remember that MOST snakes that you come across in the water are NOT water moccasins and are NOT venomous. Find someone who really knows the difference and once you see a REAL water moccasin you won't mistake the innocuous water snakes for one. Same goes for terrestrial snakes: most are NOT venomous and are, in fact, VERY beneficial. Many harmless snakes have similar coloration to rattlers and many have rhomboid patterns, increasing the similarity. Get your dog "snake proofed", learn how to recognize the actual dangerous snakes, and keep your eyes open. You probably won't see many snakes during duck season (pretty chilly for reptiles that time of year).
    Any doctrine that weakens personal responsibility for judgment and for action helps create the attitudes that welcome and support the totalitarian state.
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  7. #7
    Senior Member huntinman's Avatar
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    Hunted hounds and labs in South Carolina all through my teens and early twenties. Never had one bit by a snake. I was in the woods or field almost daily. It could happen... But a tree could fall on you too.
    Bill Davis

  8. #8
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    Big thing to look out for around Blount's Creek is gators, they love dogs, especially black labs. We normally walk the area of the falls and if there are any snakes given the opportunity they will move or either you will step on it and it will bite you instead of your dog. The closest retriever club to you in NC is Neuse Retriever Club. If you survive training around Blount's Creek we would love to have you come train with us. By the way I have never seen a gator over 10 ft. in the Blount's Creek area!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuddyJ View Post
    Big thing to look out for around Blount's Creek is gators, they love dogs, especially black labs. We normally walk the area of the falls and if there are any snakes given the opportunity they will move or either you will step on it and it will bite you instead of your dog. The closest retriever club to you in NC is Neuse Retriever Club. If you survive training around Blount's Creek we would love to have you come train with us. By the way I have never seen a gator over 10 ft. in the Blount's Creek area!
    I am retiring from my wildlife pest control business in PA, to Blounts' Creek. Most of our PA snake calls are from Pakistanis and India cultures who are deathly afraid of any snake. So I got to see and handle a lot of common snakes. We don't have moccasins or rattlers but am fairly certain it won't be a problem with me being afraid of, or not IDing the snake. As far as gators ..... EEEK ..... now that's a new thing for me to be paranoid about. I hope my wife doesn't find this site or my water dog will become a locked in the closet dog. I am looking for the best way to snake train him -what method, how old should he be, can I train him myself or does he have to get sent away, etc.? And thanks Buddy, I will look you up when we get settled down there.

  10. #10
    Senior Member P J's Avatar
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    My husband seems to have snake proofed our dog about as well as you can using snakes he has killed, rattlers and moccasins. After killing them with a machete or pistol, he would leave them lay. He then walked her in the area with her e-collar on and when she approached it, got her nose to it, he gave her a loud verbal "NO, BAD!" while using a continuous burn on a 2 or 3 with a TT collar when she sniffed it. He has done it with both moccasins and rattlers more than once.

    Now, if she smells a snake we have seen her avoid it. Last summer he ran over one, making sure he killed it. When he got home, she smelled the tire, backed off about 10 feet and started barking at it! He had to wash the truck and tire to get her to stop.
    Paula

    Dixie's Southern Comfort IV, MH

    “The beauty of the Second Amendment is it will not be needed until they try to take it.” - Thomas Jefferson

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