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Thread: New Category of Owner Handler Amateur for FT Being Discussed

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Shih View Post

    The members of the RAC asked people to contact them with comments. The proposal was discussed at the FT I attended last year.
    Ted
    Thanks for posting. Don't know why you get under some skin, but keep bringing up the issues. It seems to me the true amateur/owner handler is being squeezed out of the FT/HT game yet is expected to work and be silent and if you protest there is an attempt to hush your discord. Just sayin
    Ed Wojciechowski

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  2. #72
    Senior Member Doug Main's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by waycool View Post

    I believe the "co-habitation" item is part of AKC's description of Amateur Status and not related to a Stake restriction per se'.. The issue there is obvious... co-habitants, one claims to be amateur .. other is a pro... double your money double your fun.. but double jeopardy

    Carry on.. there is no good answer but the banter is FUN !

    FYI I believe this provision of the current rules covers that situation.
    No person shall be entitled to status as an Amateur if
    it is determined that it is inappropriate for such person to
    judge or to compete as an Amateur by virtue of a relationship
    or an association with a professional other than as a client.

  3. #73
    Senior Member Dave Farrar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BonMallari View Post
    Mr Daley is a really good man....gonna be tough act to follow
    I met him at hunt test a few weeks ago. He was running a junior dog in front of me. REALLY nice guy that gave me a few tips. I didn't know who he was until that evening after I got home and looked him up on EE.
    DUCKDAWG'S MAC'S MAGICAL MR. OCTOBER JH -- Reggie

  4. #74
    Senior Member roseberry's Avatar
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    how about the:
    owner, i train alone am. no one who has a training group can enter. you set up your own test and throw stand alones.
    owner, i own my own business am. for those who only train on sundays after church. run on a stop watch cause your in a hurry.
    owner, my kids play travel ball am. no one who trains on weekends can enter. and the event is at least 300 miles from all participants homes.
    owner, cross over limited. no one with a box larger than a 3 hole cross over can enter.
    owner, my wife is my only bird boy and she can't hit the ground with a bird am. for guys who only train with their wives.
    owner, my dog has never even met a pro am.
    owner, i tried, but not one person is willing to co-own my dog am.
    owner, limited to 3 ex-wives single am. this is a very competitive event for guys who couldn't "be fixed" by three or more women.
    non owner, good dogs i sold am. entries limited for people to run great dogs they sold to someone else because they thought the one they kept was better.
    owner, i aint got no water am. a land only event for owner/trainers who don't have good water.
    owner with manager or babe wwe style am. an event like pro wrestling where you can cheat, but only while your manager or your hot female sidekick distracts the judges.(could also be a midget)
    john mccallie

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breck View Post
    "If the community supports tstop to peproposal, a club could elect to have one of the following Amateur stakes:

    1. Traditional Amateur
    2. Owner/Handler Amateur
    3. Single Family Owner/Handler Amateur

    If a club elected to hold a Single Family O/H Amateur, a dog that was co-owned by two individuals who were not part of the same household would not be eligible to run."
    .
    .
    Hum? Those agreeing to co-ownership deals and being funded to run dogs in Am may lose out.
    Candidate 1 -

    36 placing dogs - 14 co-0wned - 6 sold - Handled NAFC - Judged National - 63 AA assignments in 25 years - RHOF as Amateur

    Candidate 2 -

    61 placing dogs - 6 co-owned -14 sold - handler owner NAFC - judged National - 38 AA assignments in 40 years - Campaigned
    circuit in Station Wagon days with a load of other peoples dogs - RHOF as Amateur

    Candidate 3 -

    10 placing dogs - 7 co-owned - judged National - 37 AA assignments in 25 years -

    Maybe this is the reason the issue is coming forward - the cheaters are emboldened .
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  6. #76
    Senior Member Breck's Avatar
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    Hint for Candidate X
    Over 5000 owner entries (some under aka's)
    "Darla" AFC Candlewoods Lil Smokin Tequila (2002-2013)(fondly remembered)
    "Smoke" Smokin Auggies Menace, QAA (2003- )(retired nut case, ask Rando)
    "Simba" Humewood Simba (1999-2014)(my 1st dog)

    .
    Per favore, non mi rompere i coglioni.
    Grazie




  7. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Littlejohn View Post
    Perhaps everyone should be given "Participant" ribbons to pacify those who contend that competition in the Amateur stakes is unfair.
    The steeper the climb, the greater the reward.
    Why would a pro want to run their dog in the am stakes. This whole thing stinks to me. I'm new to the whole thing. Just got my first lab and I am interested in training her and getting her titled. I also plan to hunt the heck out of her. After reading this discussion it makes me sick of the whole idea. It just seems like some sort of racket. Pros running their dogs in am stakes to get titles. Am' running their dogs that were trained by pros. And this crap about clubs going out of business if they don't support the racket.


    It seems pretty simple simple to me. If your dog was trained by a pro it is a pro. Therefore compete with the pros and stay out of the Am's. Why cry about. If you want to be an AM then put in the work yourself and be one.

    I may be reading to much into this but it seems to me this has nothing to do with logic and a whole lot to do with people making money. Anyways, like I said I am new to this and welcome anyone to set me straight if I am wrong on this assumption.

  8. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by PATG View Post
    why is it that the guys that play w/ the pros and call themselves AM. think that it is a
    a funny idea? There are guys that actually like to play and do work for a living , does this really hurt you guys that have dogs all over the country?
    Not sure there is much room for the guy/gal who works full time and trains his/her own dogs. We are behind the 8-ball. Every time something like this is brought up, you hear from the powers to be in the amateur game and a lot of them shut down any idea that changes "the way it's done". Most folks who are and have always been successful don't want change. I took a course on "change Management" once and the first thing you learn is the folks who excel in a current process are against change. I have much respect for the amateur who works hard and trains his/her own dogs and are successful. The person who I have much respect for in this game was an amateur who had a full time job working his butt off and yet trained 3 FC/AFC's, 2 of them National Amateur finalist. Now that my friend is a "amateur". I don't have a real problem with the current system but I had recommended to Ted a few changes, one of which to limit the number of dogs an amateur can run. Like I said before, I am a republican, , so I have no problem with the folks that are fortunate enough to own multiple dogs, have them pro trained or be able to travel all over to train and run field trials. However, like I said before even the NFL has a salary cap and its the most popular sport in the country, the Seattle's of the world can win a super bowl, not just the cowboys or patriots. I say keep training hard, I don't foresee anything changing.
    Last edited by russell.jason2; 04-16-2014 at 10:07 PM.

  9. #79
    Senior Member Ted Shih's Avatar
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    Jason

    If you or Bruce or anyone else feel strongly that there ought to be a limit on the number of dogs that a handler can run in the Amateur, I suggest that you contact the members of the RAC. As I mentioned, the RAC brought up the possibility of imposing a restriction on the number of dogs that could be run by a handler in the Amateur. The RAC asked for input. The proposal was not supported.

    If you feel strongly about it, then maybe you can re-ignite the process. Don't say - "oh well" the "powers that be" won't listen to me.

    There is a process for changing the Rules in our sport

    1. You submit a proposal to the RAC
    2. The RAC presents the proposal to the member clubs for discussion
    3. If there is sufficient interest, the matter is placed for a vote to the membership

    Making proposals on RTF may make you feel good, but it doesn't accomplish anything

    If you really want to try and change things, you are going to need to get involved in the process.

    It can be difficult and it can be frustrating, but it is the only way to get things accomplished.

    Ted
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  10. #80
    Senior Member Charles C.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Shih View Post
    Jason

    If you or Bruce or anyone else feel strongly that there ought to be a limit on the number of dogs that a handler can run in the Amateur, I suggest that you contact the members of the RAC. As I mentioned, the RAC brought up the possibility of imposing a restriction on the number of dogs that could be run by a handler in the Amateur. The RAC asked for input. The proposal was not supported.

    If you feel strongly about it, then maybe you can re-ignite the process. Don't say - "oh well" the "powers that be" won't listen to me.

    There is a process for changing the Rules in our sport

    1. You submit a proposal to the RAC
    2. The RAC presents the proposal to the member clubs for discussion
    3. If there is sufficient interest, the matter is placed for a vote to the membership

    Making proposals on RTF may make you feel good, but it doesn't accomplish anything

    If you really want to try and change things, you are going to need to get involved in the process.

    It can be difficult and it can be frustrating, but it is the only way to get things accomplished.

    Ted
    Who decides if there is "sufficient interest"? This stuff can't make it to a vote, but the ridiculous layout blind vote made it down to the clubs?

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