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Thread: Ratio of Singles/Multiple marks in training

  1. #1
    Member Rusty Champion's Avatar
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    Default Ratio of Singles/Multiple marks in training

    Okay, here's a thought I had while training today... Being that I train alone 95% of the time and have never spent time with a pro, most of my training at this point is really focused on developing the marking skills of my pup to ready her for master level work. So with that in mind I've really tried to determine if it's best to setup real "meaty" singles with several factors and focus on marking more-so than memory, or would the best route be setting up triples/quads that replicate master level marks (or slightly easier until we get a higher success rate). As it stands we have a fairly good success rate with slightly easier triples than what I would expect in a master hunt test. It's difficult to determine if her marking or memory is the contributing factor to her failures in many instances though (still a young dog @ 1.6 y/o). To this point I would say my ratio of singles to multiples is in the neighborhood of 1 to 6 or so.


    So, day in and day out do you run more singles or multiples with your finished dogs? It would also be interesting to see how pro's handle multiple finished dogs that have different weaknesses and how to train for each dog potentially requiring different setups if running singles.
    Rusty Champion

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    No doubt singles are the way to go. Success in training.
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    Senior Member Charles C.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhett Riddle View Post
    No doubt singles are the way to go. Success in training.
    That's easy to say, but it's not that simple. Some of the best field trial trainers in the country run predominantly multiples. I think the answer is somewhere in the middle. Some concepts are not possible to train on without throwing multiples. It's hard to "push" a dog's memory without throwing multiples or to see how a dog will respond certain situations without multiples.

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    Senior Member i_willie12's Avatar
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    we run singles %90 of the time
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    Senior Member Raymond Little's Avatar
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    60/40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Champion View Post
    Okay, here's a thought I had while training today... Being that I train alone 95% of the time and have never spent time with a pro, most of my training at this point is really focused on developing the marking skills of my pup to ready her for master level work. So with that in mind I've really tried to determine if it's best to setup real "meaty" singles with several factors and focus on marking more-so than memory, or would the best route be setting up triples/quads that replicate master level marks (or slightly easier until we get a higher success rate). As it stands we have a fairly good success rate with slightly easier triples than what I would expect in a master hunt test. It's difficult to determine if her marking or memory is the contributing factor to her failures in many instances though (still a young dog @ 1.6 y/o). To this point I would say my ratio of singles to multiples is in the neighborhood of 1 to 6 or so.


    So, day in and day out do you run more singles or multiples with your finished dogs? It would also be interesting to see how pro's handle multiple finished dogs that have different weaknesses and how to train for each dog potentially requiring different setups if running singles.
    I think it varies with the dog in question. Some require a very high success rate to stay on top of their game, while others are more confident by nature and can be handled or re-sent on marks with little or no ill effect. Some are head-swingers and some are not. I think it boils down to being very observant and forming a regimen that fits YOUR dog. This is where the 1 or 2 dog amateur has some advantage over a Pro training a string of dogs. While they can break a set up down into singles and doubles, you can be more flexible in WHAT you set up, and challenge your dog's abilities or work them back out of a marking slump or choose to introduce some new concept or a variation of it as your time and the dog's abilities dictate.

    In general, I would say anytime you see a couple sessions where the dog's marking is not up to previous standards, it's a good reason to simplify and remove memory from the equation.-Paul
    there's no good reason to fatten up a retriever.

  7. #7
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    The OP is asking an intelligent question IMHO.
    We have had very successful home schooled dogs at the HT level

    Consider more singles than multipules however have the other stations out. If you have more than one dog; the others will hear the shots and be looking. Also consider interupted marks to improve memory. In other words throw a mark and pull off to do a blind before returning to the mark

    We train 5/6 times a week and do a full out set up about 1 time a week.

    Now on the other hand we know many successful ft trainers and some are amateur that do tripled and quads every setup.
    So maybe it depends on you and the pooch
    Good Luck
    Dk

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    Senior Member Mary Lynn Metras's Avatar
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    Singles mainly b/c we have had head swinging issues, but will run multiples for a concept. Like the above reply said you have to watch and read your dog. Every dog different in teaching!IMO
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    Senior Member BonMallari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charles C. View Post
    That's easy to say, but it's not that simple. Some of the best field trial trainers in the country run predominantly multiples. I think the answer is somewhere in the middle. Some concepts are not possible to train on without throwing multiples. It's hard to "push" a dog's memory without throwing multiples or to see how a dog will respond certain situations without multiples.
    very good answer...sometimes one mark sets up the subsequent mark and /or creates temptation for a dog to switch or return to an old fall...Singles will show if a dog can mark, multiples will show if a dog can count and remember...all you have to do is look at the 1st series of this year's NARC, it was a double w/a blind and tripped up some of the best dogs in the country...not every set up has to be a quad in order to be tough
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    Senior Member Tater 7's Avatar
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    Depends on if we are teaching or testing and the difficulty. Sometimes we will throw 3 birds as singles and then run those 3 singles together as a triple or just 2 of them as a double. Helps to create success in training when run as singles first

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