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Thread: Shrinking Economy

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by freezeland View Post
    Get rid of Odumba$$ care and I bet employers start hiring again. Economy would start rolling again, hell even the tax revenue would even increase. I
    Anyone else here believe this or have any evidence for this? Something like 85% of jobs were unaffected by the ACA because they already had insurance.

    Besides the facts presented in my first post, net corporate profits are at or near all time highs and every town, city and state are exempting businesses (aka "the job creators") from all taxes and giving them low or no cost loans. Where is the trickle? Where are the jobs? The corporate profit and tax climate is just what your theory prescribed.

    Maybe, just maybe, it has something to do with demand and the fact that income for the 95% has been stagnant for 20+years and the cost of living has gone up and there is much less disposable income per capita. No, this could never be...... nevermind...

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by GaryJ View Post
    The economy is not doing as well as expected. Healthcare spending was over estimated - can you believe it?

    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/u-econ...123534819.html

    I can't believe I'm wasting time posting in this God forsaken forum, but Seriously? You take this bit of good news and portray it as bad? It will be interesting to see what healthcare spending does the rest of this year, and how insurance companies respond with their 2015 policy pricing.

    http://www.vox.com/2014/6/25/5841716...ured-americans


    The economy shrunk in the first quarter of 2014 and it might be all health care's fault. Believe it or not, that's a good thing.According to the Bureau of Economic Analysis, the overall GDP shrank by 2.9 percent. This has led some commentators to call it the "worst quarter" in five years.

    HEALTH SPENDING WENT DOWN WHILE THE NUMBER OF AMERICANS WITH INSURANCE WENT UP.
    But that fall was largely driven by dip in health care spending. What's good for health policy tends to look bad for the health care sector. (And vice versa.)
    The BEA initially estimated that health care spending climbed 9.1 percent in the first quarter of 2014 — a potentially worrisome increase. The agency released their second revision of that number today: now they believe that health care spending has fallen by 1.4 percent.
    That means health care spending went down while the number of Americans with insurance may have gone up.
    "Overall, the health care news is phenomenally good." said Peter Orszag, former director of the Congressional Budget Office and Office of Management and Budget. "The supposed acceleration in health spending has been shown to be false."
    This revision is precisely what we would expect, based on the Census's Quarterly Services Survey released on June 11. This survey — which collects industry information like hospital revenue, inpatient days and discharges — provided the data that the BEA used to revise its numbers.
    "OVERALL, THE NEWS IS PHENOMENALLY GOOD."
    As Orszag explained, BEA's initial estimates were mostly a guess — an educated guess, but a guess nonetheless. "It was this puzzle: we had big increase in the early GDP numbers, but no evidence from other sources to match. That generated media hoopla, even though the number was basically made up."
    Now that the data are in, they show that health spending actually declined in the first three months of 2014 relative to the end of 2013. That means the slowdown in health spending is continuing, though it's hard to pin down exactly what's driving it. Economists agree that the recession was causing part of the slowdown, but that effect should be winding down. Hospitals and other providers appear to be cutting waste and making the health care system more efficient. Obamacare is probably playing some role, but it's challenging to say how big that role is.
    Charles Roehrig, director of the Altarum Institute's Center for Sustainable Health Spending, cautions against reading too much into the numbers. Data can be noisy from one quarter to the next; it's important to put today's news in a fuller context. Given the March surge in Obamacare enrollment, it's possible that we could see a bump in spending during the second quarter. Additionally, BEA's numbers reported out today only account for health care services; other elements of health spending may have behaved differently.
    But it's hard not to be optimistic.
    "It certainly has been good news up through the end of 2013," Roehrig said. "These other underlying indicators of health care — prices and employment — in the first quarter, they stayed low. In the big picture, the news is good."
    What is health-care spending?

    Because American health-care spending is fragmented between individuals, employers and the government people can mean a lot of different things when they talk about health-care spending.
    In general, though, health-care spending refers to the official government measurement of National Health Expenditures. The vast majority of health-care spending goes towards personal health care — things like trips to the doctor and prescription drugs. A much smaller portion is spent on health-care research and government public-health activities, like programs to encourage people to eat healthier or get vaccinated against certain diseases.
    Health-care spending has sharply outpaced economic growth in recent decades. In 1970, the United States spent 7.2 percent of GDP on health care. By 2010, that had risen to 17.9 percent. That means almost one out of every five dollars in the US economy goes towards health-care spending.
    More dollars spent on health care means fewer dollars going to other things. State governments spend less on education when health-care costs go up. Rising spending on Medicaid and Medicare requires the federal government to either cut programs, raise taxes or increase the deficit. Higher insurance premiums force employers to hire fewer workers and give fewer raises For individuals, rising healthcare costs have wiped out a full decade of wage increases.

    Compounding the problem is the fact that there's little consensus on whether the increased costs of health care are leading to proportionate gains in actual health.
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  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by road kill View Post
    Hasn't it been determined that Obamacare is a tax????
    The SCOTUS decision said it was a tax only for those who opt out of getting insurance (aka the emergency room freeloaders). You know, this was the part of the law that was an idea that originated from what was formerly known as the Republican Party, exactly like that evil cap and trade idea for dealing with pollutants.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry V View Post
    Anyone else here believe this or have any evidence for this? Something like 85% of jobs were unaffected by the ACA because they already had insurance.

    Besides the facts presented in my first post, net corporate profits are at or near all time highs and every town, city and state are exempting businesses (aka "the job creators") from all taxes and giving them low or no cost loans. Where is the trickle? Where are the jobs? The corporate profit and tax climate is just what your theory prescribed.

    Maybe, just maybe, it has something to do with demand and the fact that income for the 95% has been stagnant for 20+years and the cost of living has gone up and there is much less disposable income per capita. No, this could never be...... nevermind...
    Yes, whatever you say Henry. Lets all ignore the fact no one is hiring because of this piece of dung law.
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  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry V View Post
    The SCOTUS decision said it was a tax only for those who opt out of getting insurance (aka the emergency room freeloaders). You know, this was the part of the law that was an idea that originated from what was formerly known as the Republican Party, exactly like that evil cap and trade idea for dealing with pollutants.
    It was a horrible idea when the Republicans thought it up and subsequently dumped it.
    It's even worse now that the IT savvy Democrats have implemented it.
    (I use that term loosely)

    It is a disaster by any measure, just waiting to get worse, no matter how HARD you cheer for it, it sucks!
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  6. #16
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    Henry and Buzzy....we all know that the Obama has moved out most of the major impact areas until after the next election! Or did you miss all the times he changed the Obamacare law that Congress approved....? Of course these changes were illegal.....but no matter! The real disaster called Obamacare has yet to hit our economy....

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry V View Post

    .......

    Maybe, just maybe, it has something to do with demand and the fact that income for the 95% has been stagnant for 20+years and the cost of living has gone up and there is much less disposable income per capita. No, this could never be...... nevermind...
    Henry, are you trying to tell us the reason corporations hire more employees is because they NEED to?? That more consumers are able to buy their goods or services so they MUST hire more employees to meet the DEMAND??


    Heresy!!!


    Everyone knows corporations are sitting on pins and needles, wringing their hands and waiting for the next little tax break or government incentive so they can run out and hire more people.


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  8. #18
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    Weren't there headlines regaling Obamacare saving us from contraction?

    I believe it was 4/30/14 or there abouts.

    Let me guess, you all forgot...................
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    You guys can argue Obama care till you're blue in the face, the fact that cost of living has incrased more than income has is the reason for the squeeze on the economy. The rich will get richer until we have a huge depression that the government can't borrow its way out of. You want to stimulate the economy get gas prices down along with food cost and then the middle and low-middle class will thrive.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    I can't believe I'm wasting time posting in this God forsaken forum, but Seriously? You take this bit of good news and portray it as bad? It will be interesting to see what healthcare spending does the rest of this year, and how insurance companies respond with their 2015 policy pricing.

    http://www.vox.com/2014/6/25/5841716...ured-americans
    A projection of a 9.1% increase ends up being a -1.4% decrease is bad in and of itself but then to say it was a guess. Where is the credibility in the numbers? So yes I do think it is bad.
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