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Thread: Memory Blind Question

  1. #11
    Senior Member Hunt'EmUp's Avatar
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    Hmm birds, rabbit and all manner of exciting things could be in that grass, in any case exploring that grass is WAY more exciting that running to a stupid blind pile. Either that or the dog has reached a wall in regard to distance, and he needs to be stretched out. I'd probably start running some lining drills, (W pattern, 5 Stake) with stakes, thru cover, so he KNOWS where he needs to run to, regardless of distance and then begin correcting him for choosing to screw around when he's supposed to be on a back. I'd handle this the same as popping, (no whistle) direct pressure BACK NICK BACK, lets do it again, he thinks about investigating BACK NICK BACK; again a little hesitation BACK. Let's see how long he's thinks investigation of grass is preferable to continuing to run back. Once you setup this correction in a pattern field, you can transition it to a straight back when he gets ideas of stopping on cold blinds. The thing with correcting hesitation-popping like this is you have to always be ready for it, if you miss the timing dog doesn't get the correction when he needs it and he doesn't learn to keep going. The time to correct is when he's considering stopping, not after he's already stopped. If you wait until he's stopped blow a whistle then correct; the dog will not understand why he's being corrected, or think he's being corrected for not sitting on a whistle. You'll either get a faster sit, or a confused-buggy dog .
    Last edited by Hunt'EmUp; 07-10-2014 at 02:38 PM.
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  2. #12
    Senior Member Mary Lynn Metras's Avatar
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    Move up so the blind is shorter or walk up as he is doing the blind so you are closer to correct & cast as you usually do. If you think it is an animal that was there; run in another spot just to see if he will hunt when running another blind. Go back and try the blind again so he does not get his way there. Usually try not to run to same blind many times. I know there are reasons you might have to a couple days later as finding land becomes an issue. JMHO
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  3. #13
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    I'm glad you typed all of that ...saved me from doing it. That's probably the way I would handle it. I say probably because I haven't seen it in person. It sounds like he is just doing his own thing instead of driving to the pile. Momentum is the name of the game your playing

    Quote Originally Posted by Hunt'EmUp View Post
    Hmm birds, rabbit and all manner of exciting things could be in that grass, in any case exploring that grass is WAY more exciting that running to a stupid blind pile. Either that or the dog has reached a wall in regard to distance, and he needs to be stretched out. I'd probably start running some lining drills, (W pattern, 5 Stake) with stakes, thru cover, so he KNOWS where he needs to run to, regardless of distance and then begin correcting him for choosing to screw around when he's supposed to be on a back. I'd handle this the same as popping, (no whistle) direct pressure BACK NICK BACK, lets do it again, he thinks about investigating BACK NICK BACK; again a little hesitation BACK. Let's see how long he's thinks investigation of grass is preferable to continuing to run back. Once you setup this correction in a pattern field, you can transition it to a straight back when he gets ideas of stopping on cold blinds. The thing with correcting hesitation-popping like this is you have to always be ready for it, if you miss the timing dog doesn't get the correction when he needs it and he doesn't learn to keep going. So the time to correct is when he's considering stopping, not after he's already stopped. If you wait until he's stopped blow a whistle then correct; the dog will not understand why he's being corrected, or think he's being corrected for not sitting on a whistle. You'll either get a faster sit, or a confused-buggy dog .

  4. #14
    Senior Member KwickLabs's Avatar
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    I re-read this thread three times trying to make any sense out of it. First of all, running blinds often in the same, small space is counter-productive.

    Secondly, it appears your dog is more interested in hunting than lining. If his head is down, scent is more important than following your directions.

    I'd recommend finding a BIG, short grass, mowed field (or two) and run "long" blinds (200+ yards) for a few weeks. Increase the length of your marking, too. Good distance is a critical component of running blinds. My dogs rarely have to run big marks or blinds when hunting, but we do a great deal of long blinds and marks when training.

    Make the final destination (blinds and marks) very easy to see when he gets within 20-30 yards.....give him very little reason to use his nose. The rationale is to change his expectation from "hunting for himself with his nose" to "finding with his eyes using your direction".

    You can't "distance" those contrary expectations by doing the short "stuff" in a small field with cover.
    Last edited by KwickLabs; 07-10-2014 at 03:27 PM.
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  5. #15
    Junior Member emmylan's Avatar
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    I'll throw out my 2 cents worth although there are many people on this list with more expertise. When I teach pattern blinds, I use short grass. I also leave my dog on a stay at the line and make sure he is watching while I plant the bumper piles. I also identify the piles, especially with a very young dog, by tossing a bumper to each pile. My piles are about 30 yards apart, and at first the distance from the line to each pile is about 40 to 50 yards. I normally don't need to use collar pressure. If the dog is confused I make the lesson simpler.

  6. #16

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    are you putting blinds constantly by a pile of tall brush? If so that dog has caught on to your habbit and when it gets by a clump hes expecting a bird to be there

  7. #17
    Senior Member jollydog's Avatar
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    There is a great article on cold blinds on Danny Farmer's
    website under training tips.

    www.dannyfarmer.com

    I think it will help
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  8. #18
    Senior Member MooseGooser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jollydog View Post
    There is a great article on cold blinds on Danny Farmer's
    website under training tips.

    www.dannyfarmer.com

    I think it will help
    I second this advice!
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  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by MooseGooser View Post
    I second this advice!
    I looked at the article and it appears that DF goes from DT to wagon wheel and similar drills then right to cold blinds (though uncomplicated ones.) And he also says that these are confusing and the dog at this stage may be a bit anxious. This is because (he says) the dog doesn't know there's anything out there and that he has to just go where he thinks he's being sent.

    Do you think that Walk Out blinds (which, within days, become "school blinds") provide a useful interim step?

  10. #20
    Senior Member jollydog's Avatar
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    1 Tulip:
    Danny's philosophy is from Rex Carr " you do best what you do most".
    To get good at cold blinds run cold blinds. I know the article well
    and feel you are not grasping all he is explaining.
    He doesn't worry about the dog being nervous starting cold blinds as once he
    starts he does them daily and the dogs get the hang of them rather quickly.
    He doesn't do sight blinds or pattern blinds as feel dogs could use that as a crutch and
    be overwhelmed (are use to seeing something or known blinds now nothing) when they go to cold blinds - cold blinds is what you
    do in trials so that is what he gets them use to. Remember he follows them and stays within
    10 yards behind them to help them out. I can say I am on my 4th dog using this method and have been
    Very happy with it.
    Danny would be the first to say there are a lot of ways to
    Do things this is what he has found to work best for him.
    Last edited by jollydog; 07-12-2014 at 01:04 AM.
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