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Thread: My dog is a LIAR ! Initial lines on blinds?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Mac Lassiter's Avatar
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    Default My dog is a LIAR ! Initial lines on blinds?

    Had a issue that pops up every now and then, but not all the time ! But it does concern me, and not sure if there is a fix or something she will eventually work through ?

    We are transitioning to cold blinds, and had this issue show up once again this morning! I go through my blind sequence, make sure she is lined up with tail, spine, head and eyes! She seems to be locked on, or locked as good as I would expect a dog transitioning to cold blinds (Not trying to nit pick over great lines at this point) But seems to me she is telling me she has her "picture" I kick her off and she will run straight for 5 or 10 yards and then veer left or right !

    My fix at this point has just been a quick whistle sit, and a cast to get her back on line, and she will usually take a good cast back on line, but will usually start to veer off in the direction she veered on the initial line.

    I am making sure (without taking to much time nit picking on lining her up) that she and " I " are lined up but seems she's telling me one direction, and then takes another !

    Her spine and head does not move, and I have started in the last 3 weeks to really pay attention to her eyes, and she seems to give no indication that when the veer off line does occur that she is keyed on anything else other than the line she is indicating to me !

    Not sure if this is a possible bad habit that may be arising, or is this just an issue that shows up in alot of other dogs starting cold blinds ? Just don't want this to get out of hand, or become a habit if it's something I can correct !

    And yes I want to say again cause I know this will be a response! (I am making 100% sure that she is lined up Tail, Spine, Head, and Eyes) unless she's looking cross eyed her eyes are peering forward!
    "MAC"
    SHR Mac's Scars To Prove It (Josie)

  2. #2
    Senior Member mtncntrykid's Avatar
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    Which way is the wind blowing? Some dogs tend to drift towards the wind. Just a thought.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Maxs Mom's Avatar
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    I'm interested in answers here too. Having similar issues with my girl. I have always thought she is straight but before being asked I didn't pay "as" close attention. Now I am. My girl veers left too.

    Hope there are lots of good thoughts.
    Ann

    UACH Casino Farm's Belle Air MXP2 MJP2 "Belle" (BLF 5/16/03)
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    Senior Member shawninthesticks's Avatar
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    If she is constantly doing it at about the same distance .....maybe set your line up with "goal posts" at roughly the distance that she veers off line . 2 trees with a distance between them come to mind. This way she has to pick 1 of 3 slots and not create her own line at random. If you have been recalling her a lot for the lies , she's likely popping from anticipating a recall. Just thoughts that crossed my mind when I read your post , maybe a good thought maybe not.
    Shawn White

    HR Big Creek Retrievers Independence Day JH QAA "Indy "

  5. #5
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    Have you done wagon wheel yet? If so then she should understand the "go as sent" principle. If not, do it. As for transitioning to cold blinds this can be a little tricky and is really where you learn to read the dog and have to make some quick decisions as the trainer to decide what is fair to the dog. You have to ask yourself things like "is it suction to another mark or blind that is causing this problem?" or, "is it a factor that is causing her to deviate from her lines?" If it is either one of these then remove them or use a "show me" type blind style for a while to make sure the dog is fully aware of the destination and the line is the only thing that you are correcting. The standard answer is to call back for a poor initial line however this can be as detrimental to your dog as any other correction if the proper foundation has not been set.

  6. #6
    Senior Member GilWlsn's Avatar
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    Ok. This is going to blow some minds. Don't run cold blinds. Yep, can only imagine what responses this will cause. Always run at a fence post. White, orange, black, doesn't matter. This will build the confidence in the dog that there's something out there. Had a VERY reputable training in okla tell me this. Stretch them out, we are running 300 yd+ blinds. My comment when I was told this was " when you get to the game there might not be a post". The pro smiled and said...."in the dogs mind there's suppose to be ". This method of t raining is being widely used in ne okla. If you would have been at Three Rivers training day last Saturday you could have seen the benefits.
    HRCH Wilson's God of Thunder - Thor
    HR Wilson's God of Mischief - Loki

  7. #7
    Senior Member Mary Lynn Metras's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mac Lassiter View Post
    Had a issue that pops up every now and then, but not all the time ! But it does concern me, and not sure if there is a fix or something she will eventually work through ?

    We are transitioning to cold blinds, and had this issue show up once again this morning! I go through my blind sequence, make sure she is lined up with tail, spine, head and eyes! She seems to be locked on, or locked as good as I would expect a dog transitioning to cold blinds (Not trying to nit pick over great lines at this point) But seems to me she is telling me she has her "picture" I kick her off and she will run straight for 5 or 10 yards and then veer left or right !

    My fix at this point has just been a quick whistle sit, and a cast to get her back on line, and she will usually take a good cast back on line, but will usually start to veer off in the direction she veered on the initial line.

    I am making sure (without taking to much time nit picking on lining her up) that she and " I " are lined up but seems she's telling me one direction, and then takes another !

    Her spine and head does not move, and I have started in the last 3 weeks to really pay attention to her eyes, and she seems to give no indication that when the veer off line does occur that she is keyed on anything else other than the line she is indicating to me !

    Not sure if this is a possible bad habit that may be arising, or is this just an issue that shows up in alot of other dogs starting cold blinds ? Just don't want this to get out of hand, or become a habit if it's something I can correct !

    And yes I want to say again cause I know this will be a response! (I am making 100% sure that she is lined up Tail, Spine, Head, and Eyes) unless she's looking cross eyed her eyes are peering forward!
    I am curious how old your dog is? And what you have done prior to this stage.
    Popping is a confidence issue. She is saying where should I go???
    And you can't expect them to go straight at first. Correct to put her back on line like you are doing and if she doesn't take your cast you move up with her.
    I would try to let her run as far out as she can go and keep her momentum up. Stopping her creates more confusion and pops. IMO
    Also I think there is a ratio cold blinds to known blinds that you run at first so you don't over do it.
    Tony mentioned wagon wheels and I agree with him; you should do this which is very important to really have the dog understand team work at the line and look out to where you want her to go. There are other benefits to WW. IMO
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  8. #8
    Senior Member EdA's Avatar
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    So you are "transitioning to cold blinds" and not getting good initial lines? Nothing unusual about that, at this point it is much more about going somewhere when sent, stopping, and changing directions when cast. After a few hundred blinds you can start to worry about initial line.

  9. #9
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    Gil,

    I love your comment. I wasn't at the last training day for Three Rivers, but know exactly what you are talking about. I haven't run a cold blind in over a year. I have a 2 1/2 year old YLM that will hopefully complete his HRCH in the fall. Working on stretching him out and creating high confidence in our blinds. I also like to run to a post/marker set-up in front/behind/near a natural landmark (ie tree sapling, brush pile, thicket etc) which is a common practice at HT in AKC and HRC.
    2xGMPR HRCH UH Blackjack's Gen. Stonewall Jackson SH

  10. #10
    Senior Member Wayne Nutt's Avatar
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    Provided you have followed a good program to this point, I am want to quote Lardy and say "that's the way cold blinds go". Believe me it will get better. One day you will say, dang she's taking good initial lines.

    This has been my experience with Rowdy. I used to get frustrated with him over this. Not anymore. At hunt test the judges have been real complimentary about his lines.
    Wayne Nutt
    Go Nutts with dog training

    HRCH Patton's Parker Co. Shadow "Shadow"
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    HRCH Marks a Lot Midnight Hudson, SH "Hudson"-retired
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