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View Poll Results: Should handlers be allowed to take a picture of their score sheet?

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  • Yes

    42 40.78%
  • No

    61 59.22%
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Thread: AKC Hunt Test Judging Sheets

  1. #31
    Senior Member Joe Brakke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken Bora View Post
    Without an understanding of any individual judges shorthand. A snapshot of the page will be nothing more than a glance at hieroglyphs. I do feel that handlers should be able to discuss the sheets. Not at the running line but by going through the proper protocol, after the test with an offering of cold bier or other alms.
    This is so correct, also get your explanation on why you did not pass or passed and do not debate the opinion or other things that happened in your mind.

    My notes can only be read by me, because I have so much to watch on the line to insure everyone gets a fair shake and how well your dog has performed ... including but not limited .... make sure the blind is down, insure we got the right dog number, take the duck from the retrieve, wring its neck if necessary, call for guns up, call for the dog to be released, make sure honor dog is not being whipped (verbally), signal for birds to be thrown, make sure the gallery is not too noisy .... on and on ... so my writing gets a little cryptic at best. But, i will have enough notes that I understand the dogs performance so that I can give you a fair review in a discussion with my co-judge. There might be a little blood on the paper, wind torn, and possibly rained on but I will be able to read it, not so much the handler I would guess.

    I forgot, wake up the bird boy in station number 2
    Last edited by Joe Brakke; 08-19-2014 at 05:05 PM.
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  2. #32
    Senior Member Brad's Avatar
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    My vote is No. But thank you that do judge.
    Last edited by Brad; 08-19-2014 at 08:35 PM.

  3. #33
    Senior Member yellow machine's Avatar
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    It's all in how you approach people when you think there is a problem. This gentleman approached very aggressively and everybody at the ribbon ceremony were shocked at how loud and obnoxious he was. I don't care either way if somebody wants to take a picture of the scorecard or not but my god let's protect our judges and not let this happen. If this happens too often we won't have any judges anymore.
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  4. #34
    Senior Member BJGatley's Avatar
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    I voted NO...Why? I believe an eye to eye talk to a judge after the event is sufficient. JMO.

  5. #35
    Senior Member dorkweed's Avatar
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    As an HRC judge, I voted "NO"!!!

    For the simple fact that I don't want to have to try to explain my "hiroglyphics" on a forum like this!!!! For the simple fact that............even if I'm "right".................I'm still "wrong".................no matter!!!!!!!!!!
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  6. #36
    Senior Member mostlygold's Avatar
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    I agree no pictures. It has nothing to do with standing behind what you judge. It is very difficult to accurately draw out all of the factors for each series for 60 or so dogs. As day goes on drawings get less detailed. Like many others I have shorthand notes and on occasion write things the handler might not be happy to see. I also don't do my math out. By the time the third series has ended, I know whether or not a given dog has passed. I have no problem discussing things with handlers, but by and large feel most handlers should know why they failed. They aren't asking to learn what they need to work on, they are basically complaining because they did not pass. Poor line manners, poor blinds, multiple long hunts and handles. Do they really need to ask why?

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  7. #37
    Senior Member Good Dogs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yellow machine View Post
    It's all in how you approach people when you think there is a problem. This gentleman approached very aggressively and everybody at the ribbon ceremony were shocked at how loud and obnoxious he was. I don't care either way if somebody wants to take a picture of the scorecard or not but my god let's protect our judges and not let this happen. If this happens too often we won't have any judges anymore.
    There is a way to handle such situations and it's spelled out in the AKC manual dealing with misconduct. There is no excuse for the conduct described and no excuse for allowing it to go on. The HT committee has the responsibility and authority to deal w/ such situations.

  8. #38
    Junior Member Labs4us's Avatar
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    If you want to look at my Judges sheets, the numbers portion at the top are the only thing you will be able to figure out, the diagrams are mine & may or not show all the factors, but I know what the dog did. The only time I have had an issue with someone wanting to take a picture of their sheet was in a Junior test & there were multiple issues to why the dog didn't qualify. At the end of the day, prior to the ribbon ceremony if we decided your dog didn't qualify I will try to seek you out & let you know why so that you aren't standing there waiting for a ribbon & then let down. (I have been there) If people know where they stand in a test it makes things a lot easier.

  9. #39
    Senior Member Labs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Main View Post
    NO Way!

    I have no problem going over my sheets with an owner/handler and explaining why the dog either passed or failed. That's more than is required and should be plenty.

    My sheets are usually a mess. There is a lot more information than just the dog's scores. They are not meant for anyone else to critique. I doubt anyone but me would understand them. They are my notes of the dog's performance used to refresh my memory if my co-judge & I disagree.

    The rule provides:


    Also from the rules:

    What legitimate reason would the handler/owner have for taking a picture? I can think of none. There are 2 judges and both judges have already agreed. There is no appeal.

    I've been around too long, and have seen too many judges get thrown under the bus for no good reason. I don't need the aggravation.
    So, a team that just titled under you asks for the scoresheet as a memento, and asks you to sign it, you're gonna say no because there is no legitimate reason for them to have it? Classy...
    The dog will always prove you wrong

  10. #40
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    I recently posed this question to Jerry Mann, AKC Field Director, Sporting Breeds, his reply was "The Regulations state that a handler has a right to review his own dog's evaluation sheet. It does not say the handler has a right to photo or otherwise copy the sheet". Mr. Mann continued "I can not imagine why a judge would be reluctant to let a handler have a copy of, photo or otherwise have information off the judge's sheet".

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