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2008 RABIES--Report on Adverse Vaccine Reactions in Dogs & Vaccine info

61K views 291 replies 48 participants last post by  Kris L. Christine 
#1 · (Edited)
There is much confusion in the general public about the duration of immunity of canine vaccines. Below is a copy of my testimony and model disclosure submitted to Maine's Agriculture Committee in support of LD 429, the nation's first pet vaccine disclosure legislation, which was introduced on my behalf by Representative Peter Rines of Wiscasset. Anyone who wishes to have copies of the attachments referenced below, please e-mail me at ledgespring@lincoln.midcoast.com.

PERMISSION GRANTED TO CROSS-POST THIS MESSAGE.

February 27, 2005

TO: The Agriculture, Conservation and Forest Committee

RE: LD 429, An Act to Require Veterinarians to Provide Vaccine Disclosure Forms

My name is Kris Christine and I live with my family in Maine. Before I begin my testimony, I’d like to advise the committee that one of the world’s leading veterinary research scientists, Dr. W. Jean Dodds, wanted to be here today to testify in support of LD429, but could not do so because of prior commitments. With her permission, in the attachments to my testimony, I have included her letter to Representative Peter Rines dated February 17, 2005 (Attachment 5) resolutely endorsing this first-in-the-nation veterinary vaccine disclosure legislation.

I am here today to respectfully urge this committee to recommend passage of LD429 – An Act to Require Veterinarians to Provide Vaccine Disclosure Forms because pet owners need the scientifically proven durations of immunity (how long vaccines are effective for) in order to make informed medical choices for their animals.

Many Maine veterinarians have failed to inform clients that most core veterinary vaccines protect for seven or more years, and pet owners, unaware that their animals don’t need booster vaccinations more often, have unwittingly given their companions useless booster shots – taking an unnecessary toll on their finances and animals’ health. The human equivalent would be physicians vaccinating patients against tetanus once every year, two years, or three years and not disclosing that the vaccines are known to be protective for 10 years.

For years veterinarians have sent pet owners annual, biennial and triennial reminders for redundant booster shots and justified it with vaccine manufacturers’ labeled recommendations. According to the American Veterinary Medical Association’s (AVMA) Principles of Vaccination (Attachment 6), “..revaccination frequency recommendations found on many vaccine labels is based on historical precedent, not on scientific data … [and] does not resolve the question about average or maximum duration of immunity [Page 2] and..may fail to adequately inform practitioners about optimal use of the product…[Page 4] .” As the Colorado State University Veterinary Teaching Hospital states it: “…booster vaccine recommendations for vaccines other than rabies virus have been determined arbitrarily by manufacturers.”

Dr. Ronald Schultz, Chairman of Pathobiological Sciences at the University of Wisconsin School of Veterinary Medicine, is at the forefront of vaccine research and is one of the world’s leading authorities on veterinary vaccines. His challenge study results form the scientific base of the American Animal Hospital Association’s (AAHA) 2003 Canine Vaccine Guidelines, Recommendations, and Supporting Literature (Attachment 7). These studies are based on science – they are not arbitrary. The public, however, cannot access this data. The American Animal Hospital Association only makes this report available to veterinarians, not private citizens, and Maine’s pet owners are unaware that the AAHA Guidelines state on Page 18 that: “We now know that booster injections are of no value in dogs already immune, and immunity from distemper infection and vaccination lasts for a minimum of 7 years based on challenge studies and up to 15 years (a lifetime) based on antibody titer.” They further state that hepatitis and parvovirus vaccines have been proven to protect for a minimum of 7 years by challenge and up to 9 and 10 years based on antibody count. So, unless the Legislature passes LD429 requiring veterinarians to provide vaccine disclosure forms, dog owners who receive an annual, biennial, or triennial reminders for booster shots will not know that nationally-accepted scientific studies have demonstrated that animals are protected a minimum of 7 years after vaccination with the distemper, parvovirus, and adenovirus-2 vaccines (see Page 12 AAHA 2003 Guidelines attached, and Table 1, Pages 3 and 4).

"My own pets are vaccinated once or twice as pups and kittens, then never again except for rabies,” Wall Street Journal reporter Rhonda L. Rundle quoted Dr. Ronald Schultz in a July 31, 2002 article entitled Annual Pet Vaccinations may be Unnecessary, Fatal (Attachment 2). Dr. Schultz knows something the pet-owning public doesn’t – he knows there’s no benefit in overvaccinating animals because immunity is not enhanced, but the risk of harmful adverse reactions is increased. He also knows that most core veterinary vaccines are protective for at least seven years, if not for the lifetime of the animal.

The first entry under Appendix 2 of the AAHA Guidelines (Attachment 7) “Important Vaccination ‘Do’s and Don’ts” is “Do Not Vaccinate Needlessly – Don’t revaccinate more often than is needed and only with the vaccines that prevent diseases for which that animal is at risk.” They also caution veterinarians: “Do Not Assume that Vaccines Cannot Harm a Patient – Vaccines are potent medically active agents and have the very real potential of producing adverse events.” Very few pet owners have had this disclosed to them.

The AVMA’s Principles of Vaccination (Attachment 6) states that “Unnecessary stimulation of the immune system does not result in enhanced disease resistance, and may increase the risk of adverse post-vaccination events.” (page 2) They elaborate by reporting that: “Possible adverse events include failure to immunize, anaphylaxis, immunosuppression, autoimmune disorders, transient infections, and/or long-term infected carrier states. In addition, a causal association in cats between injection sites and the subsequent development of a malignant tumor is the subject of ongoing research.”(Page 2)

Referring to adverse reactions from vaccines, the Wall Street Journal article cited above (Attachment 2) reports: “In cats there has been a large increase in hyperthyroidism and cancerous tumors between the shoulder blades where vaccines typically are injected.” With modified live virus vaccines (distemper, parvovirus, hepatitis), some animals can actually contract the same disease which they are being inoculated against. If the public knew an animal’s immunity to disease is not increased by overvaccination, they would certainly not consent to expose their pets to potential harm by giving them excessive booster shots.

Veterinary vaccines are potent biologic drugs – most having proven durations of immunity much longer than the annual, biennial or triennial booster frequencies recommended by vaccine manufacturers and veterinarians. They also carry the very real risk of serious adverse side affects and should not be administered more often than necessary to maintain immunity.

The extended durations of immunity for vaccines is not “new” or “recent” science as some members of the Maine Veterinary Medical Association (MVMA) have claimed. AAHA reveals on Page 2 of their Guidelines that ideal reduced vaccination protocols were recommended by vaccinology experts beginning in 1978. A Veterinary Practice News article entitled “Managing Vaccine Changes” (Attachment 3) by veterinarian Dennis M. McCurnin, reports that: “Change has been discussed for the past 15 years and now has started to move across the country."

According to a September 1, 2004 article in the DVM veterinary news magazine (Attachment 1), the 312 member Maine Veterinary Medical Association (MVMA) “champions full disclosure of vaccine information to pet owners.” MVMA president, Dr. Bill Bryant, is quoted as stating: “Its time for something like this to come out … disclosure forms will be an important resource to have available, [and] if it goes before the Legislature, we’d likely support it.”

It is time. Pet owners have the right to know the scientifically proven durations of immunity for the veterinary vaccines given their animals, as well as the potential adverse side effects and benefits. LD 429 would make that standardized information available to all pet owners.

Respectfully submitted,
Kris L. Christine
Attachments
 
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#2 · (Edited)
VACCINATING PUPPIES--16 Weeks+ Info

PERMISSION GRANTED TO CROSS-POST THIS MESSAGE

When considering at what age a puppy should begin receiving its core vaccines, consider the information from the American Animal Hospital Association stating that the maternal antibodies in a puppy younger than 16 weeks may interfer with the immune response. Bear in mind that there are risks associated with vaccinating as well as risks associated with not vaccinating. Making an informed decision is important. Also, be aware that giving combo vaccines (multi-valent) and/or several shots at once increases the risk of adverse reactions as well as the risk that the vaccines will interfere with each other, resulting in neutralization or negation.

On Page 16 of the of the American Animal Hospital Association's 2003 Canine Vaccine Guidelines, it reports that: When vaccinating an animal, the age of the animal, the animal's immune status, and interference by maternal antibodies in the development of immunity must be considered. Research has demonstrated that the presence of passively acquired maternal antibodies significantly interferes with the immune response to many canine vaccines, including CPV [parvo], CDV [distemper], CAV-2 [hepatitis] and rabies vaccines."

They further state on Page 17 that: "Multiple vaccinations with MLV vaccines are required at various ages only to ensure that one dose of the vaccine reaches the puppy's immune system without interference from passively acquired antibody. Two or more doses of killed vaccines (except rabies) and vectored vaccines are often required to induce an immune response, and both doses should be given at a time when the passively acquired antibody can no longer interfere. Thus, when puppies are first vaccinated at 16 weeks (or more) of age (an age when passively acquired antibodies generally don't cause interference), one does of an MLV vaccine, or two doses of a killed vaccine, are adequate to stimulate an immune response."

The AAHA Canine Vaccine Guidelines also declare on Page 17 that: "If a pup fails to respond, primarily due to interference by passively acquired maternal antibody, it is necessary to revaccinate at a later time to ensure adequate immunity."

On Page 13 of the 2006 American Animal Hospital Association's Canine Vaccine Guidelines, it lists as the most common reason for vaccination failure is "the puppy has a sufficient amount of passively acquired maternal antibody (PAMA) to block the vaccine......" They elaborate by reporting that at the ages of 14 to 16 weeks of age, "PAMA should be at a level that will not block active immunization in most puppies (>95%) when a reliable product is used."

Combination Vaccines, Multiple Shots--on Page 16 of the 2003 AAHA Guidelines under Immunological Factors Determining Vaccine Safety, it states that: "Although increasing the number of components in a vaccine may be more convenient for the practitioner or owner, the likelihood for adverse effects may increase. Also, interference can occur among the components. Care must be taken not to administer a product containing too many vaccines simultaneously if adverse events are to be avoided and optimal immune responses are sought. "

The World Small Animal Veterinary Association's 2007 Vaccination Guidelines state on Page 3 that: In situations where, for example, a decision must be made that an individual pet may have to receive only a single core vaccination during its lifetime, the VGG [Vaccination Guidelines Group] would emphasise that this should optimally be given at a time when that animal is most capable of responding immunologically, i.e., at the age of 16 weeks or greater."

______________________________________________________________________________
Duration of Immunity: The Rabies Vaccine Challenge - Show #185 Animal Talk Radio Show 7/30/08 http://www.blogtalkradio.com/animaltalknat...llenge-Show-186

Duration of Immunity to Canine Vaccines: What We Know and Don't Know, Dr. Ronald Schultz http://www.cedarbayvet.com/duration_of_immunity.htm

What Everyone Needs to Know about Canine Vaccines, Dr. Ronald Schultz
http://www.puliclub.org/CHF/AKC2007Conf/Wh...%20Vaccines.htm

Vaccination: An Overview Dr. Melissa Kennedy, DVM360 http://veterinarycalendar.dvm360.com/avhc/...l.jsp?id=568351

World Small Animal Veterinary Association 2007 Vaccine Guidelines http://www.wsava.org/SAC.htm Scroll down to Vaccine Guidelines 2007 (PDF)

The 2003 American Animal Hospital Association's Canine Vaccine Guidelines are accessible online at http://www.leerburg.com/special_report.htm .

The 2006 American Animal Hospital Association's Canine Vaccine Guidelines are downloadable in PDF format at http://www.aahanet.org/PublicDocumen...s06Revised.pdf .

Veterinarian, Dr. Robert Rogers,has an excellent presentation on veterinary vaccines at http://www.newvaccinationprotocols.com/

October 1, 2002 DVM Newsletter article entitled, AVMA, AAHA to Release Vaccine Positions, http://www.dvmnewsmagazine.com/dvm/article...il.jsp?id=35171

July 1, 2003 DVM Newsletter article entitled, What Do We Tell Our Clients?, Developing thorough plan to educate staff on changing vaccine protocols essential for maintaining solid relationships with clients and ensuring quality care http://www.dvmnewsmagazine.com/dvm/article...il.jsp?id=61696

July 1, 2003, DVM Newsletter article, Developing Common Sense Strategies for Fiscal Responsibility: Using an interactive template to plan service protocol changes http://www.dvmnewsmagazine.com/dvm/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=61694

Animal Wellness Magazine Article Vol. 8 Issue 6, How Often Does he REALLY Need A Rabies Shot Animal Wellness Magazine - devoted to natural health in animals

The Rabies Challenge Animal Wise Radio Interview
Listen to Animal Wise (scroll down to The Rabies Challenge 12/9/07)

The Vaccine Challenge Animal Talk Naturally Online Radio Show » The Vaccine Challenge - Show #91

Rabies Shot Killed my Poodle May 28, 2008 Channel 5 News WCVB http://www.thebostonchannel.com:80/news/16...bos&taf=bos

US Declared Canine-Rabies Free -- CDC Announces at Inaugural World Rabies Day Symposium CDC Press Release - September 7, 2007

Rabies Prevention -- United States, 1991 Recommendations of the Immunization Practices Advisory Committee (ACIP), Center for Disease Control's Morbidity and Mortality Weekly March 22, 1991 / 40(RR03);1-19 http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00041987.htm "A fully vaccinated dog or cat is unlikely to become infected with rabies, although rare cases have been reported (48). In a nationwide study of rabies among dogs and cats in 1988, only one dog and two cats that were vaccinated contracted rabies (49). All three of these animals had received only single doses of vaccine; no documented vaccine failures occurred among dogs or cats that had received two vaccinations. "
 
#4 ·
You are more than welcome! If you would like copies of my data on canine vaccines e-mailed to you, please contact me at ledgespring@lincoln.midcoast.com. You are free to share that information with anyone and everyone you know who has a dog.

My ignorance about veterinary vaccines cost the life of my favorite yellow lab, Meadow. Making this information available to others is my attempt to redeem myself for failing my faithful friend, who never once failed me.

Kris
 
#5 ·
Everytime I have been to the vet they always want to vaccinate and revaccinte if you don't have records with that vet. I don't want to give my pets any shots I don't absolutely need too. Appreciate you taking the time to post this thread. Sorry to hear about your loss.
 
#43 · (Edited)
Everytime I have been to the vet they always want to vaccinate and revaccinte if you don't have records with that vet. I don't want to give my pets any shots I don't absolutely need too.
MTGR, not directed at you, but a general comment:

Under those circumstances you describe (vet has no records of your dog) is that a bad or good thing? Isn't it the responsibility of the owner to provide the proper medical records to a vet who is not familiar with their dog? If you can't supply any vaccination history on the animal, you give the vet no choice but to take a conservative approach.

I think one has to weigh the vaccination risk versus the risk and prevalence of the disease, and not take a blanket approach as some advocate. Is your dog a house pet that just sees the backyard and gets leash-walks down the street, or is it a field trial dog that goes south for 4 months on a winter trip, campaigns in 9 different states and is exposed to a lot of other dogs? Do you live in a Lepto or Lymes hot spot like we have here? (BTW, my dogs have been on the rabies 3 year schedule for years and years.)

Believe me, I'm not a pro-vaccine-no-matter-what fan. I used to own a mare that developed a severe vaccine reaction as an adult horse. Seemingly out of nowhere. We tried all kinds of different approaches (different manufacturers, single vac as opposed to '4-in-1, prophylactic treatment before the shot, etc) and couldn't isolate the issue to be virus/vac/strain/serovar or even drug manufacturer specific.

The first time she reacted, it was bad. The second time (to a completely different shot) it was worse, much worse. While she ended up ok, she was very sick and out of training for months. She was a very talented show horse, that got hauled around to different horseshow venues to compete, and therefore exposed to a lot of different animals and environments. The care treatment plan for her was going to be very different than the horse in the next stall who was a pet and used for local trail rides.

So I saw what a vac reaction can do, and I have an appreciation for what can go wrong. And I can't imagine how traumatic it would be to lose an animal to that. I came close. In my mare's case, she had been on the standard recommended vaccination schedule for the first 3 years of her life with no incident.

Bottom line, get educated, know your dog's history and ask good questions of your vet. Hopefully you and he/she will have a collaborative relationship and come up with a plan that works for the geography, the lifestyle and the individual needs of the dog. If you're not satisfied with that, go elsewhere. But don't rely on internet boards as the sole source of 'truth'. Keep in mind that it's an open forum and a lot of extreme opinions can be presented as fact, with careful editing of 'soundbites' as quotes, including journal articles. And any vet that thinks of vaccines - or the limitation thereof - as a 'practice-buster'...well, c'mon. I think that falls under the "don't indict an entire population due to the conveniently quoted soundbite of one" doctrine.
 
#6 ·
WSAVA'S 2007 VACCINE GUIDELINES Available Online

The recently released World Small Animal Veterinary Association 2007 Vaccine Guidelines are available online at http://www.wsava.org/SAC.htm Scroll down to Vaccine Guidelines 2007 (PDF)

Excellent information on veterinary vaccine is also available at the sites below:

Duration of Immunity to Canine Vaccines: What We Know and Don't Know, Dr. Ronald Schultz http://www.cedarbayvet.com/duration_of_immunity.htm

The 2003 American Animal Hospital Association's Canine Vaccine Guidelines are accessible online at http://www.leerburg.com/special_report.htm .

The 2006 American Animal Hospital Association's Canine Vaccine Guidelines are downloadable in PDF format at http://www.aahanet.org/PublicDocumen...s06Revised.pdf .

Veterinarian, Dr. Robert Rogers,has an excellent presentation on veterinary vaccines at http://www.newvaccinationprotocols.com/
 
#7 ·
2008 RABIES--Report on Adverse Vaccine Reactions in Dogs

2008 REPORT ON RABIES VACCINE ADVERSE REACTIONS IN DOGS

The Journal of the American Veterinary Medical Association has published a report in its April 1, 2008 issue, Vol. 232, No. 7, entitled: Postmarketing Surveillance of Rabies Vaccines for Dogs to Evaluate Safety and Efficacy."

Despite the extreme under-reporting of vaccinal adverse reactions, this report states on the second page that between April 1, 2004 and March 31, 2007, the Center for Veterinary Biologics, "nearly 10,000 adverse event reports (all animal species) were received by manufacturers of rabies vaccines..........Approximately 65% of the manufacturer's reports involved dogs."

The report further states on the second page that: "Rabies vaccines are the most common group of biological products identified in adverse event reports received by the CVB," and they give the following description of the adverse reaction followed by the % of dogs affected: Vomiting-28.1%, Facial Swelling-26.3%, Injection Site Swelling or Lump-19.4%, Lethargy-12%, Urticaria-10.1%, Circulatory shock-8.3%, Injection site pain-7.4%, Pruritus-7.4%, Injection site alopecia or hair loss-6.9%, Death-5.5%, Lack of Consciousness-5.5, Diarrhea-4.6%, Hypersensitivity (not specified)-4.6%, Fever-4.1%, Anaphylaxis-2.8%, Ataxia-2.8%, Lameness-2.8%, General signs of pain-2.3%, Hyperactivity-2.3%, Injection site scab or crust-2.3%, Muscle tremor-2.3%, Tachycardia-2.3%, and Thrombocytopenia-2.3%.

Veterinarians are not required by law to report adverse reactions to vaccines, to which the World Small Animal Veterinary Association stated in their 2007 Vaccine Guidelines that there is: "gross under-reporting of vaccine-associated adverse events which impedes knowledge of the ongoing safety of these products," and in an article entitled, A New Approach to Reporting Medication and Device Adverse Effects and Product Problems, (JAMA - June 2, 1993. Vol.269, No.21. p.2785) Dr. David Kessler, former head of the Food & Drug Administration, reported that "only about 1% of serious events are reported to the FDA."

In light of the 10,000 adverse reactions to the rabies vaccine in the JAVMA report, 65% of which were in dogs, the estimated 1% reporting of "serious" events by the former head of the FDA means that the actual number of dogs that had adverse reactions to the vaccine would be more like 650,000!!!!!

World Small Animal Veterinary Association 2007 Vaccine Guidelines http://www.wsava.org/SAC.htm Scroll down to Vaccine Guidelines 2007 (PDF)

A New Approach to Reporting Medication and Device Adverse Effects and Product Problems http://www.vaccinationnews.com/Adverse_Reactions/VAERS/credible_estimates.htm Scroll down to David Kessler statement in JAMA - June 2, 1993,vol.269, No.21, p.2785
 
#8 ·
Kris, THANK YOU for posting this information. I believe it should be mandatory by law that these companies disclose known adverse reactions before treatment.
 
#9 ·
You are welcome, Moosetogooseranch.

I believe that veterinarians should be required by law to report adverse reactions and that the USDA should make vaccine manufacturers conduct long-term duration of immunity and safety studies before they are allowed to license their vaccines.

Dog owners are generally unaware that veterinary vaccine components are proprietary and that manufacturers are not required to reveal their ingredients. Veterinary vaccine adjuvants vary among the different manufacturers, but with human vaccines, the FDA requires that the adjuvants are all the same -- so that a tetanus vaccine manufactured by one company will have the same adjuvant as all other manufacturers' tetanus vaccines. This is not true for veterinary vaccines -- the adjuvants in one brand of rabies vaccine may be different from those in another brand.

Rabies, Leptospira, Lyme, are killed, adjuvanted vaccines. Adjuvants are vaccine components (such as aluminum hydroxide, aluminum phosphate) used to enhance the immunological response.

"The World Health Organization (WHO) in 1999 classified veterinary vaccine adjuvants as Class III/IV carcinogens with Class IV being the highest risk," IARC Monographs on the Evaluation of Carcinogenic Risks to Humans: Volume 74, World Health Organization, International Agency for Research on Cancer, Feb. 23-Mar. 2, 1999, p. 24, 305, 310.)

According to the 2003 American Animal Hospital Association's Canine Vaccine Guidelines http://www.leerburg.com/special_report.htm (Page 16), "...killed vaccines are much more likely to cause hypersensitivity reactions (e.g., immune-mediated disease)." Could this be due to the combination of mercury (thimersol) and aluminum additives in the same vaccine?

Mercury (Thimersol) is commonly found as a preservative in killed, adjuvanted veterinary vaccines. The combination of the mercury (thimersol) and adjuvant components (aluminum hydroxide, aluminum phosphate) in the same vaccine are of considerable concern because of the reactive properties of aluminum, especially when in contact with mercury (thimsersol).

Please see the information below, as well as a Congressional petition to remove aluminum additives in human vaccines. Remember, mercury (thimersol) is still used in veterinary vaccines along with aluminium.

________________________________________________________________________________
Mercury and aluminium http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercuric

Aluminum amalgam http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury-aluminum_amalgam
"Due to the reactivity of aluminium amalgam, restrictions are placed on the use and handling of mercury in proximity with aluminium. In particular, mercury is not allowed aboard aircraft under most circumstances because of the risk of it forming amalgam with exposed aluminium parts in the aircraft. In the Second World War, mercury was used to sabotage aircraft."

Chemical Reactivity of Aluminum: http://www.sciencebyjones.com/chemical_reactivity.htm

Petition to Congress "Removal of Aluminum Additive in Vaccines Resolution and Petition" www.petitiononline.com/NoMadVac/petition.html "The combination of mercury plus aluminum is far worse than the sum of the two toxicities added together. The synergistic toxicity could be increased to unknown levels."
 
#10 ·
Kris,
I don'y have a dog in this fight, but it bothers me when people take bits and pieces from medical studies to support thier cause, when the findings of the study were opposite that.

A few points noted in the article:
1. Report of an adverse event does not imply that the study drug caused it.
2. 72% of the dogs receieved other vaccines or drugs at the same time, so the adverse events could be due to the other drugs.
3.The overall adverse event rate for rabies vaccine was 8.3reports/100,000 doses sold. which translates to a .0083% adverse event rate.

Most important was the study's conclusions:
1. The findings didn't suggest a high frequency or unexpected pattern of adverse events with rabies vaccine.
2.The rabies vaccines for dogs are highly efficacious and a vital component of asuccessful rabies animal control program.

The other important thing about the article is that it was from the CDC, so you can't say there was a bias from veterinarians wanting to make money from vaccinations, even though that isn't the case anyway.

Again I don't have a dog in this fight, but your posts remind me of the media, only showing enough info to support thier side, and not showing the whole story.

Buck
 
#11 ·
Buck,

If you reread the report, which is entitled Postmarketing Surveillance of Rabies Vaccines for Dogs to Evaluate Safety and Efficacy."
you will note that only the 246 adverse reactions to the rabies vaccine reported directly to the Center for Veterinary Biologics by the public, veterinarians, and pet owners had 72% of the dogs receiving other vaccines or drugs at the same time as the rabies shot. That is not the case further on in the report where they discuss the 10,000 adverse reactions reported by the rabies vaccine manufacturers, 65% of which were in dogs.

It does state that the "overall adverse report rate for rabies vaccines was determined to be 8.3 reports/100,000 doses sold." They do not state that it is 8.3 adverse reactions per 100,000 doses. If 8.3 reports is "only about 1% of serious events are reported to the FDA," as Dr. David Kessler, former head of the Food & Drug Administration, stated, then that would translate into a more accurate figure of 830 adverse reactions per 100,000 doses.

The report does state that "Rabies vaccines are the most common group of biological products identified in adverse event reports received by the CVB." It also states that "The rabies vaccines for dogs are highly efficacious and a vital component of asuccessful rabies animal control program," which I absolutely agree with.

My concern with the rabies vaccine is that there is scientific data indicating that states requiring annual or triennial boosters after the puppyhood vaccines are requiring dogs to be vaccinated against rabies too often and are needlessly exposing them to the risk of adverse side affects (1992 French challenge study led by Michel Aubert demonstrating 5 year minimum duration of immunity; serological studies by Dr. Ronald Schultz incorporated into the American Animal Hospital Association's Canine Vaccine Guidelines showing dogs have antibody titer counts at levels known to confer immunity to rabies 7 years after vaccination.)

If you are familiar with the Center for Disease Control's MMWR Recommendations and Reports March 22, 1991/40(RR03);1-19 Rabies Prevention-- United States, 1991 Recommendations of the Immunization Practices Advisory Committee http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00041987.htm , it states that"A fully vaccinated dog or cat is unlikely to become infected with rabies, although rare cases have been reported (48). In a nationwide study of rabies among dogs and cats in 1988, only one dog and two cats that were vaccinated contracted rabies (49). All three of these animals had received only single doses of vaccine; no documented vaccine failures occurred among dogs or cats that had received two vaccinations. " .
 
#12 ·
My only point is that when you cherry pick parts of a study to prove a point, that is opposite of the findings in the study, you lose credibility.

Those reading the study should be reassured of the safety and efficacy of the rabies vaccines. Not the opposite.

I'm not going to get in a debate and this will be my last post on this thread. Hopefully everyone is aware of the guidelines and can discuss them with their Veterinarian and not make decisions based on internet posts.

Buck
 
#13 ·
I personally view vaccinations, just like I view getting my annual tax returns done. I could spend lots of my valuable personal time keeping up on the updates, the laws, the studies and the changes.

Or, I could pay someone a very reasonable fee, whom I trust, to keep up on all of that stuff for me. I trust them, they take care of me reasonably, and my taxes are done with little personal expense and virtually no need for time spent.

I look at trusting a veterinarian the exact same way. I don't have the time or the desire to keep up on Kris' bolded, exclamation point marked study after study. If some of you do, great. That's good for you.

I've had dogs all of my life. I've trusted my vets all of my life. Maybe I'm in the minority, but thus far, other than a dog napping a little more than usual after a shot (and man, oh man, how I would love to see my current pup nap a little more once in a while!) I've had no adverse issues to report.

Similarly, RTF's readership represents a very broad cross-section of retriever owners. I'm not aware of RTF folks having recurring or widely-experienced problems due to vaccines.

This reminds me of a very close friend of mine who is a chiropractor. When my first child was born, we were provided with plenty of data showing that child vaccines caused autism and such. My buddy is able to get all of his kids into schools, bypassing mandatory vaccination records for his children, citing such things as personal religous beliefs, or whatever.

His point was that his kids are never sick, and don't need the vaccinations. I love my buddy like a brother. But I think back to FDR who had polio and was in a wheelchair. I think back to historical times when various diseases plagued various societies. I believe that a big reason that my buddy's kids are not having more health issues, without having to do vaccinations, is because they are riding the coat-tails of the generations that preceded who did take advantage of various medical breakthroughs, and utilize available vaccinations.

Both of my sons had major problems at birth. Both, we were told, were close to death, both, we were told had a decent chance of some sort of brain damage due to oxygen deprivation. Both, thanks to the modern medical capabilities, spent quite a bit of time in Neonatal ICU units, and both are fine today. My kids are on the modern-day vaccination schedule exactly as suggested by their pediatrician.

You guys can all do what you want regarding canine vaccines. Until I see real evidence of real people having real problems with their dogs getting sick, dying, etc. as a result of vaccines, I'm going to continue to trust my vet and use vaccinations as recommended and suggested.

I think that Buck has valid concerns. I think that those of us with vets like Ed Aycock, Nate Baxter, Rick Jackson, and the list goes on, are getting advice identical to what these guys are doing for their own animals. In the case of Nate, I know that's the case because he's my breeder and we have littermates! Our vets are here to earn a fair living, doing what they enjoy, and are not trying to hose us with extra vaccinations that may kill or seriously injure our dogs.

I've communicated privately with Buck on this matter and I know that this is all he's trying to point out. When the general readers see these studies, marked up with bolds, exclamation points, bright fonts, with excerpts pointing to suggestions that our dogs' health is in danger if we follow our vets' advice, some may make decisions that are truly not truly in the best interest of our animals.

As I've pointed out to Kris privately, some do see value in her posts. I have also asked Kris to join RTF as a dog owner and be a participant on RTF in a manner that complements her vaccination awareness posts.

I will also point out that I've had PM suggestions that Kris' posts appear to be endorsing some sort of a vaccine awareness fund. The waters can get a bit muddy when we're working to raise funds, while pointing out that others are doing something less than admirable, part of which is intended to generate sales.

I dunno guys. I trust my vets and so far, they've never done me wrong. I've been blessed with healthy dogs. Most of my buddies have had the same experience.

Chris
 
#15 ·
Great post Chris.

Just to remind everyone, there are more adverse and even more serious reactions to common aspirin, something we are being told to take to save our lives during a heart attack.
 
#16 ·
I took all the dogs in for heartworm checks yesterday and 3 of them got a Lymes booster. I have had my own dogs since 1977 and this is only the second time I have had a dog have a reaction to a vaccination.

Last night Briezy was pretty low key and had a hard time climbing into my lap to watch TV. Today she is still low key, and is very reluctant to sit and is acting very sore. I called the emergency clinic and they said it sounds like a reaction to the vaccination and that to keep an eye on her but the soreness should be gone in a few days. No fever and she is eating, drinking and having normal airing activity.

Will this make me stop vaccinating my dogs - absolutely not! I follow the guidelines that my vet recommends.

Back in the late '80's I had a puppy go into anaphylactic shock from a corona vaccination. That was the last corona vaccination she ever got but never had problems with any others. But that is one reason why I let my vet do the vaccinating - I do not do them at home.

I think everybody just needs to trust their vet and do what they feel is best for their dogs.

Andy
 
#17 ·
Andy, like you, I recently had all of my dogs to the vet to receive the boosters on vaccines as needed. My vet discussed with me what each needed and didn't need. No adverse reactions. I also had my equine vet out last Thursday to booster the vaccines they needed. He also talked with me about what was needed and not needed.

I trust my vets. I know from discussions with them that they are staying on top of research and literature regarding vaccines. After almost 20 years of using them, I know that they have my animals' best care in mind when they see them. I don't plan to make decisions based on what I read on the internet. I will discuss such information with them and I know that they will research to find the answer if they don't already know. I remember years ago when I first discussed CNM with my canine vet. She immediately did additional research, including keeping up to date via the CNM website. I referred a client of mine that has a dog with CNM to her.

So, until I have DVM or VMD behind my name, I will continue to trust my vets and vaccinate my animals.
 
#18 ·
Vicky,

You are fortunate to have a veterinarian who is up to date on current research and will openly discuss vaccine issues with you -- not every dog owner is so fortunate, and you are probably much more informed than the average dog owner.

Dog owners should do their homework on veterinary vaccines and discuss a protocol with their veterinary care provider before they vaccinate their dogs.
 
#20 ·
I agree with most of what Chis A. had to say with the caveat that it is important to me I communicate with my vet to make sure he understands the lives my dogs lead, how important my dogs are to me (including some sense of time and $$ spent on them), that he understands my concerns regarding health risk from over vaccination while at the same time wanting protection from disease.

I view my vet as a partner in the health care of my dogs. Before we administer any meds, there is a discussion of pros/cons, other options, etc.

Regarding rabies, we follow the state mandated vaccination protocol...period. For other contagious diseases, we generally reduce the vaccination frequency and monitor titers in the interim.

Tomorrow, I meet with the vet to discuss whether to vaccinate for Lyme, since Sinner will be in Wisconsin all summer.

It isn't a one-size-fits-all situation IMO.
 
#21 ·
My young dogs all got Lepto, but no vet ( including mine in CT) says the vaccine for Lyme is all that great, and having had 2 dogs with it I am more inclined to treat with the vets blessings than wait for a test that may or may not be correct due to a variety of things including the vaccine.My biggest problem is that some vets discount the possiblity of lymes if they have had the vaccine-not to mention the other TBD out there.

I have been leary of Vaccines forever, as goldens get Cancer, and there is enough proof the two are related. But, we have rabies in this area, we have lepto and we have Parvo. So my dogs as young dogs get all of these and the others. They get Lepto every year, and Rabies according to State law-every 3 years, which I do about every 2 1/2.I was very thankful for that when I met the raccoon on my porch last spring.

I think the key is communication. I have a phone call in to my genetics vet at UGA about another matter, and have picked up the phone and called Cornell to ask about these very things. I forward to my vet anything I get, but she is one of the few in this area who listens.
I trust my vet, but she also trusts me to bring her new info and to give her good information about my animals-not like when I take my car to the mechanic and tell him it Whirred and clunked.:rolleyes:
 
#22 ·
More information specifically on the rabies vaccine can be found at the following links if you are interested to learn more:

Animal Wellness Magazine Article Vol. 8 Issue 6, How Often Does he REALLY Need A Rabies Shot Animal Wellness Magazine - devoted to natural health in animals

The Rabies Challenge Animal Wise Radio Interview
Listen to Animal Wise (scroll down to The Rabies Challenge 12/9/07)

The Vaccine Challenge Animal Talk Naturally Online Radio Show » The Vaccine Challenge - Show #91

US Declared Canine-Rabies Free -- CDC Announces at Inaugural World Rabies Day Symposium CDC Press Release - September 7, 2007
 
#23 ·
My dog was a victim of a rabies vaccine reaction.
It gave her a highly aggressive cancerous tumor at the site of injection.
It changed my view on vaccines forever.
Thru this experience, I have learnt so very much, and I am so very wary.
I asked and asked my vet to report my case to the proper authorities.
He never did.
Obviously from reading your post Kris- this is not uncommon.

3 months after his rabies vaccine - our black lab got a nasal infection that has never left him. Even after spending thousands of dollars trying to help him to solve the issue, there was never any resolve. Now this condition is
slowly taking his life away......

Be thankful, very thankful if your dog has never had an adverse
reaction to vaccines.
 
#24 ·
Janice,

I am sorry to hear about your lab's reaction.

My yellow lab, Meadow, developed a malignant mast cell tumor directly on the site of a redundant rabies shot (his former veterinarian never disclosed that she was giving him a 3 year rabies shot every 2 years) and you could see the prominent syringe hole in the center of the tumor.

Repeated surgeries failed to yield clean margins, the cancer metasticized throughout his body, and he died in July.
 
#26 ·
Kris,

I'm envisioning headlines, if rabies vaccines were made optional for example, that would read something like:

"Rabies killed my poodle"... And the story would blame the government and our medical community for not properly controlling this disease.

Will you please detail what you see as the ideal solution, in your opinion? I've seen many of your posts, I understand your messages in terms of the risks that rabies vaccines apparently pose to our dogs. What is your solution? What would fix this?

Thanks,

Chris
 
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