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Thread: Veterinarian speaks out on PETA & Westminister

  1. #1
    Senior Member jollycurl's Avatar
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    Default Veterinarian speaks out on PETA & Westminister

    Permission to crosspost: Only if you copy and past in a new e-mail and don't just forward

    Thank you Libbye Miller DVM for stating:

    "Adorable mixed breeds" get cancer, epilepsy, allergies, heart disease, and orthopedic problems just like purebreds. I see it every day in my veterinary practice but mixed breed dogs aren't tracked like the purebreds so they have a reputation as "healthier" that is actually undeserved in many cases."

    It is so sad that a lot of folks, including young veterinarians these days, buy into the "hybrid vigor" baloney. The vet schools have been infiltrated by the Animal Rights Extremists, who are teaching them this junk science in order to push their agenda.

    All animals have a certain amount of genetic load, which is to say there is absolutely no animal without some genetic problem of some sort of another. Know anyone who wears glasses? Has allergies? Thyroid problems? Weak knees? Flat feet? A skin condition? Arthritis? A gap between their front teeth? These are all genetic imperfections.

    No human is genet ically "clean." Neither is any individual of any species on earth. So this idea that dogs should not be bred because they might have a genetic problem, and that breeders are somehow "evil" for breeding them, is ridiculous. Every single individual of every single species has at least a few genetic conditions.

    To use PETA's logic, all breeding of all kinds (including having human babies) should halt immediately. And to be honest, Ingrid Newkirk (the woman who founded PETA) does believe exactly that. She thinks that humans should become extinct, along with dogs, cats, etc. This ridiculous scenario is precisely what she would like to see happen. So folks, if that is what you want...if you agree with Ingrid Newkirk's whacky views, send your hard earned money to PETA. They will help to ensure you are not able to own a dog or cat or hamster or any other pet in the future. They will see to it that you can't eat meat or fish or eggs or any type of animal-based nutrition. They will work to shut down places like Sea World, the zoos, etc. so you cannot observe the many wonderful animals on the Earth. Eventually, once they accomplish these things, they may turn their efforts to making it illegal for humans to procreate. If you don't agree with their extremist views, wise up and start
    supporting those who truly do love, care for and enjoy interaction with other species here on our little blue planet.

    The fanciers of the breeds, those you see exhibiting their dogs at Westminster and other dog shows, work very hard to eliminate serious genetic conditions. They screen their breeding stock with every available test. They research pedigrees before breeding into other lines, to check for similar clearances in those animals. They contribute money to research organizations to further the work being done to track down genetic problems. They contribute blood, cell samples, etc. from their own animals to help with DNA and genome studies. They have made great progress so far, and they continue to work hard at it.

    Are there unethical breeders? Certainly, there are. Just as in any group of humans, you will find the good and the bad. United States VP Elect Joe Biden, for example, managed to find a not so good one when he got his new German Shepherd puppy. I don't know who did his research for him, but they obviously didn't do their homework if they were looking for a responsible breeder. Joe has the right to get his dog from whomever he wishes, but if he was trying to set an example of purchasing from a responsible hobby breeder he went off the track this time. That's too bad, but it was his choice.

    Unfortunately, breeders like that may be a lot easier to find because of their high volume and high profile. If you are looking for a nice family pet from a breeder who will be there for you forever, you need to do due diligence. You won't get that from a pet store. You won't get that from the guy selling dogs out of his pickup truck in the WalMart parking lot. You won't get that support from a high-volume breeder, either. Yes, it takes a little more time and effort to find someone who really cares and does all the work to breed the healthiest, happiest puppies possible and then stands behind those puppies.

    This is a living being that will be part of your family, hopefully, for many years. Isn't it worth a bit of effort to find a breeder who will be there for you and that puppy forever?

    And guess what? Shows like Westminster are a very valuable resource for finding breeders who do care and who use the best possible n bsp; practices, as well as for learning more about the various breeds.

    Bravo to USA Network for broadcasting the Westminster Kennel Club show all these years. May they enjoy continued success through the ongoing inclusion of such programs. I will be eagerly watching this year's show!"

    Dr. Libbye Miller
    Ellen & the Jollycurl Curlies
    working retrievers since 1979
    to be some day owned by:
    Thriller x Bebe puppy
    co-owned by:
    CH Sun Devil Nil Volentigus Arduum MH, WCX (Bebe)
    CH Clarion's Light One Candle (Molly)
    forever in my heart:
    CH Wimberway's Curly Baybelle ROMX (Bay) 1981 - 1996
    CH Soft Maple Crossing Delancy JH (Hannah) 1997 - 2004
    CH Soft Maple O'Dark Thirty CD RN MH WCQ ROM HOF (Jet) 1997 - 2010
    CH Jollybodies Touch 'Em All Time JH (Lola) 2001 - 2013

  2. #2
    Senior Member DrCharlesBortellPhD's Avatar
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    Jollycurl, Thanks for posting. Dr. Miller’s assessment of the current trends is ’spot-on’.
    Dr Miller also alluded to another issue of extreme importance. This letter deserves my congratulatory Two Paws Up!!
    I recently posted (on another board) that to effectually fight and defeat the AR groups, such as PETA, HSUS, etc, you should make a stand and educate the general public that other alternatives other than the AR’s exists and are valid. Someone wrote that we (as dog owners) should “tread very very lightly”. I stated No. We should “Stomp Loudly”. Dr Miller has fortunately has chosen to do just that.
    Dr Miller wrote “Adorable mixed breeds" get cancer, epilepsy, allergies, heart disease, and orthopedic problems just like purebreds. I see it every day in my veterinary practice but mixed breed dogs aren't tracked like the purebreds so they have a reputation as "healthier" that is actually undeserved in many cases.". Then added “It is so sad that a lot of folks, including young veterinarians these days, buy into the "hybrid vigor" baloney. The vet schools have been infiltrated by the Animal Rights Extremists, who are teaching them this junk science in order to push their agenda.”. These statements are so important on many levels. Education is key. More so, correct education to ’professionals’ is necessary.
    Mixed breed dogs, as Dr Miller alluded to, are generally the “same” health wise, if not actually “unhealthier” because of the wide-spread genetic “problems” inherent to each breed. Consider a cross of a Labrador X a Chesapeake. Labs are prone and susceptible to diseases/ailments such as EIC, CNM, HD, etc. Chessies have DM, hypothyroidism, vWD,
    ED/HD, etc in their lines. A crossing of these two breeds can cause a hybrid of these diseases to surface, and the resulting offspring can be ’affected’ with any or all problems.
    Also consider that breeders who strictly bred a specific breed have insights on what each dog can contribute to the breeding program. These breeders have the well-being of the breed in mind. However, individuals breeding mix-breed dogs (ex the “doodle dogs”) do not always have the best interest in what the genetic pool will become, or to what that breeding will produce. Often health concerns (genetic problems) are over-looked or disregarded, just to create a ’popular’ or ’in demand’ dog. Then the other ’mix breeds’ that result from unsprayed/unneutered dogs having “accidental breedings” where no health or circumstances are considered. These breedings lead to a wide spread infusion into the gene pool of undesirable traits and diseases/ailments.
    Also, Dr Miller did not address this issue, is the concern of what the dog will become behaviorally. Breeders who strictly breed purebred dogs have expected behavior traits - personality, character, etc. When you get a purebred Lab, Chessie, whatever, you can expect that dog to be like other dogs in that breed. With mixed-breeds, you never truly know what will appear - the “mutt” may be like either breed or display traits uncommon to either the sire/dam. It is a “roll of the dice” and not a carefully selected, pre-planned line.
    Dr Miller alluded to a very important fact. That every dog is a “carrier” for some “disease or ailment”. Dr Miller said “All animals have a certain amount of genetic load, which is to say there is absolutely no animal without some genetic problem of some sort of another.
    So this idea that dogs should not be bred because they might have a genetic problem, and that breeders are somehow "evil" for breeding them, is ridiculous. Every single individual of every single species has at least a few genetic conditions.” Especially with the DNA tests available now, the “panic” to withhold certain dogs from breeding solely because they “tested” as a “carrier” for whatever disease/ailment is not only irresponsible, but is putting any breed as risk for extinction as a breed as we know it. What if 40-50% of all dogs are a “carrier” for xyz disease. Where is the viable breeding stock if these dogs are withheld and not bred?? The gene pool will become ’bottlenecked’ to a point where the breed (any breed) may not survive as it exists now. Dr Miller’s approach to stand-up, inform, and educate the public is exactly how we (as a dog community) will over come the many issues we and our dogs face. Dr Miller deserves the TWO PAWS UP!! -Charlie

  3. #3
    Senior Member John Kelder's Avatar
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    Can someone please tell me how to forward these two posts to someone's email ?,as they are not on this site .Thanks to you both . Outstanding posts .
    SEMPER FI . FROM MY COLD , DEAD HANDS .

    www.bashakilllabradors.com

  4. #4
    Senior Member Todd Caswell's Avatar
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    Copy and past


    Thank you Libbye Miller DVM for stating:

    "Adorable mixed breeds" get cancer, epilepsy, allergies, heart disease, and orthopedic problems just like purebreds. I see it every day in my veterinary practice but mixed breed dogs aren't tracked like the purebreds so they have a reputation as "healthier" that is actually undeserved in many cases."

    It is so sad that a lot of folks, including young veterinarians these days, buy into the "hybrid vigor" baloney. The vet schools have been infiltrated by the Animal Rights Extremists, who are teaching them this junk science in order to push their agenda.

    All animals have a certain amount of genetic load, which is to say there is absolutely no animal without some genetic problem of some sort of another. Know anyone who wears glasses? Has allergies? Thyroid problems? Weak knees? Flat feet? A skin condition? Arthritis? A gap between their front teeth? These are all genetic imperfections.

    No human is genet ically "clean." Neither is any individual of any species on earth. So this idea that dogs should not be bred because they might have a genetic problem, and that breeders are somehow "evil" for breeding them, is ridiculous. Every single individual of every single species has at least a few genetic conditions.

    To use PETA's logic, all breeding of all kinds (including having human babies) should halt immediately. And to be honest, Ingrid Newkirk (the woman who founded PETA) does believe exactly that. She thinks that humans should become extinct, along with dogs, cats, etc. This ridiculous scenario is precisely what she would like to see happen. So folks, if that is what you want...if you agree with Ingrid Newkirk's whacky views, send your hard earned money to PETA. They will help to ensure you are not able to own a dog or cat or hamster or any other pet in the future. They will see to it that you can't eat meat or fish or eggs or any type of animal-based nutrition. They will work to shut down places like Sea World, the zoos, etc. so you cannot observe the many wonderful animals on the Earth. Eventually, once they accomplish these things, they may turn their efforts to making it illegal for humans to procreate. If you don't agree with their extremist views, wise up and start
    supporting those who truly do love, care for and enjoy interaction with other species here on our little blue planet.

    The fanciers of the breeds, those you see exhibiting their dogs at Westminster and other dog shows, work very hard to eliminate serious genetic conditions. They screen their breeding stock with every available test. They research pedigrees before breeding into other lines, to check for similar clearances in those animals. They contribute money to research organizations to further the work being done to track down genetic problems. They contribute blood, cell samples, etc. from their own animals to help with DNA and genome studies. They have made great progress so far, and they continue to work hard at it.

    Are there unethical breeders? Certainly, there are. Just as in any group of humans, you will find the good and the bad. United States VP Elect Joe Biden, for example, managed to find a not so good one when he got his new German Shepherd puppy. I don't know who did his research for him, but they obviously didn't do their homework if they were looking for a responsible breeder. Joe has the right to get his dog from whomever he wishes, but if he was trying to set an example of purchasing from a responsible hobby breeder he went off the track this time. That's too bad, but it was his choice.

    Unfortunately, breeders like that may be a lot easier to find because of their high volume and high profile. If you are looking for a nice family pet from a breeder who will be there for you forever, you need to do due diligence. You won't get that from a pet store. You won't get that from the guy selling dogs out of his pickup truck in the WalMart parking lot. You won't get that support from a high-volume breeder, either. Yes, it takes a little more time and effort to find someone who really cares and does all the work to breed the healthiest, happiest puppies possible and then stands behind those puppies.

    This is a living being that will be part of your family, hopefully, for many years. Isn't it worth a bit of effort to find a breeder who will be there for you and that puppy forever?

    And guess what? Shows like Westminster are a very valuable resource for finding breeders who do care and who use the best possible n bsp; practices, as well as for learning more about the various breeds.

    Bravo to USA Network for broadcasting the Westminster Kennel Club show all these years. May they enjoy continued success through the ongoing inclusion of such programs. I will be eagerly watching this year's show!"

    Dr. Libbye Miller

  5. #5
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    According to a personal friend of Dr. Miller, all she wrote is the first paragraph. The balance was apparently written by a person who hides in anonymity.

    Eric

  6. #6
    Senior Member DrCharlesBortellPhD's Avatar
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    John, you wrote "Can someone please tell me how to forward these two posts to someone's email ?,as they are not on this site .Thanks to you both . Outstanding posts ."

    I am not too computer literate. So what I do is copy the 'http' address on the top of the thread. Paste that address in the e-mail. Then the person receiving can view the thread/board. Also they can read any subsequent replys/posts then too.

    I mentioned my post on another board. Was CBRS4ME. It explains my position further on "stomping loudly" if you are interested. Also a post "first dog" about the president elect's potential choice for a dog. You might find it interesting. (both recent).

    I just received an e-mail from a breeder friend (chessies) & owner of a poodle
    now too. She sent me a link to the poodle club's stance on "doodle dogs" It was interesting because they mirrored my view-points made above.

    Best Regards, Dr Charles Bortell - Charlie

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