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Thread: Banking Crisis

  1. #1
    Senior Member cotts135's Avatar
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    Default Banking Crisis

    This past week the House Banking committee had some of the CEO's from the major banks take a day off and have a chat with them. Watching this I saw the same old tired rhetoric I see from all these people in charge, whether that be the oil industry, Health care, Tobacco etc and that is " I am not responsible". For me it is time for these people to step up and admit the problems that occurred were due to some of the actions they took, and for them now to step down and hand in their resignations. These are individuals rich beyond are imagination. To continue to let them run these company's is to ask for the same problems we have now. These guys are looking out for there best interests............ not the interests of the people who now are on the hook for their failures. They will find loopholes in the laws that will enable them to continue to receive these exorbitant salaries and they will also make sure there companys will flourish with taxpayers money.
    Having said that I saw a piece on Bill Moyers journal that I thought was particularly educational. I would recommend that any of you that are concerned about this crisis take 15 minutes and watch it.
    I would be interested in your viewpoints and look forward to your comments.

    Here is the link: http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/02132009/watch.html

  2. #2
    Senior Member subroc's Avatar
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    I doubt I will watch anything by Bill Moyers.

    That said, is it always the fault of the CEOs? Do market conditions ever fluctuate and cause or exacerbate these conditions? If these companies are so inept, why is the democrat president and congress in such a hurry to bail them out? Should we just let capitalism work and let those that are destined to fail, fail? Is the government responsible in any way with their lack of oversight and inept regulation? If the government is responsible should those that made the regulation be held responsible? Lets bring Barney Frank and Chris Dodd out of congrss in handcuffs for thier inept regulations and obstructionist actions during the Bush Administration..

    Another thing, is there suppose to be a steady state in financial markets?

    It appears that some believe in a steady state for both financial markets and global climate?

    subroc

    Article [I.]
    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
    Article [II.]
    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

  3. #3
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    Maybe the democrats should talk about their manipulation of banks with “Fair Housing Accessibility” legislation and how “home ownership is an American right”

    Sad truth is banks were making the loans the Gooberment required them to make by law.


    Now how did that affect the banking business? Oh yeah...pretty much caused the failure...now why do the Dems get a free pass on this one? I forget.....

  4. #4
    Senior Member Jim Person's Avatar
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    Right on Joe, Frank and Dodd being escorted out of the capital in handcuffs and thrown in prison is long overdue. They are a big factor in the meltdown. Jim
    The mightiest oak was once a small nut that stood its ground

  5. #5
    Senior Member Goose's Avatar
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    A chat? I beg to differ. What I saw was nothing more than political grandstanding by a bunch of scum-bag politicians...especially the democrats.

    If these dirt-bag democrats were really interested in getting to the bottom of this mess they'd bring in some of their own to 'chat' with. Namely, Frank and Dodd and Gorelic and Raines and any other of the top executives at Fred and Fan who fraudulently ran these companies (and the taxpayer) into the dirt. And maybe they could ask Chris Dodd about his sweatheart deal with Countrywide Mortgage. He's never answered those questions. Does he get a pass because he's a democrat?

    Or maybe they could bring in Speaker Comrade Pelosi and ask her to raise her hand if she ever takes trips on a private jet. Seems like the democrats hate it when important people with busy schedules fly into Washington on a private jet. Let's see Comrade Pelosi's ride. Oh, I forget...she's a democrat doing the people's work.

    There's plenty of blame to go around in the private sector from fraudulent mortgage originators to the rating agencies and on up the scale to wall street executives. They're all dirt-bags too, but structured finance would never have worked like it did without politicians like Frank, Dodd, Gorelic and Raines pushing homeownership on people who should be living in apartments. They're the real culprits and should be in jail.

  6. #6
    Senior Member zeus3925's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by subroc View Post
    That said, is it always the fault of the CEOs? Do market conditions ever fluctuate and cause or exacerbate these conditions? If these companies are so inept, why is the democrat president and congress in such a hurry to bail them out? Should we just let capitalism work and let those that are destined to fail, fail? Is the government responsible in any way with their lack of oversight and inept regulation? If the government is responsible should those that made the regulation be held responsible? Lets bring Barney Frank and Chris Dodd out of congrss in handcuffs for thier inept regulations and obstructionist actions during the Bush Administration..[/FONT]
    Subroc--

    Let me jog your memory a bit. The first big bail out of the banking industry was postulated and consummated in the Bush White House. Bush was conspicuously adverse to government oversight. Remember those billions that disappeared in Iraq? Those huge no bid, no paper work contracts to his corporate buddies to reconstruct Iraq?

    I was also enraged at Congress over the bail out of Wall Street. I voted third party in protest.

    The banking industry is has become invested with shysters. They have shown a remarkable talent for developing fictitious financial instruments. They have shown only an interest in enormous salaries -- so large that most of us couldn't spend one year of their salaries in a life time. They want you and me to pay for their corporate jets and high rolling parties. The problem is they are skimming your and my capital that we have entrusted with them.

    Is government responsible? The conservative dogma has been to starve government till it is small enough to drown in a bath tub, so that it can barely function. We'll shrink government by withdrawing the inspectors and regulators. Look what that has given us. A banking system run amok, E. Coli burgers, undocumented labor, and peanut butter that kills.

    Subroc, you have been most vocal in your condemnation of the passage of the stimulus bill and Democrats in general. Where were you when "W" and the Republican minions added $5 trillion to the national debt? I doubt that you uttered a peep. I suspect your conservative outrage is so new its eyes have not opened yet. If you were as vocal then as you are now, then my apologies.
    Zeus

    I don't want to feed an ugly dog!

  7. #7
    Senior Member Jim Person's Avatar
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  8. #8
    Senior Member subroc's Avatar
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    Not hardly Sarge

    At no time and in no place did I agree with the stimulus (stimulus 1) as proposed and enacted by the Bush administration. I didn’t agree with his passage of prescription drugs. I didn’t agree with his border policy. I loved his hard line with the UN and his appointment of John Bolton. I was completely on board with his invasion of Iraq. I was completely on board with his invasion of Afghanistan. I am completely on board with the debt that is needed when the nation engages in and wages war. As far as no bid contracts go, I believe all administrations have used them. I believe the current administration will use them as well. I have no problem with them.

    Now as to banking rules for home ownership, if you ask me, derivative type products like interest only shouldn’t be allowed, even balloon payments shouldn’t be allowed. Home mortgages should be conventional loans only. But anyone that reads this that knows anything about finance will say rules like that limit the average homeowner/buyer to an onerous set of restrictions that are not fair to them and limit their options. In addition a strict set of criteria should be applied to the ability to pay the mortgage back. If Frank and Dodd were doing their job those rules and restrictions would be in place.

    Now on to war: I was adamantly against installing that dictator Aristide in Haiti by Clinton. I was and am ambivalent to Clinton’s actions in Serbia/Kosovo. As an action to show and demonstrate solidarity with our allies it had a place. But in all honesty, I didn’t really care very much about what was happening there. I chuckled at the bombing of the aspirin factory. I was on board with Clinton bombing Iraq although if Bush one had finished the job, none of this would have been necessary.

    An overview of a few things I believe as a citizen of the United States, how our nation should be run and how we should use our power.

    Feel free to peruse the last couple month’s posts on the subject of stimulus 1.

    Joe



    Quote Originally Posted by zeus3925 View Post
    Subroc--

    Let me jog your memory a bit. The first big bail out of the banking industry was postulated and consummated in the Bush White House. Bush was conspicuously adverse to government oversight. Remember those billions that disappeared in Iraq? Those huge no bid, no paper work contracts to his corporate buddies to reconstruct Iraq?

    I was also enraged at Congress over the bail out of Wall Street. I voted third party in protest.

    The banking industry is has become invested with shysters. They have shown a remarkable talent for developing fictitious financial instruments. They have shown only an interest in enormous salaries -- so large that most of us couldn't spend one year of their salaries in a life time. They want you and me to pay for their corporate jets and high rolling parties. The problem is they are skimming your and my capital that we have entrusted with them.

    Is government responsible? The conservative dogma has been to starve government till it is small enough to drown in a bath tub, so that it can barely function. We'll shrink government by withdrawing the inspectors and regulators. Look what that has given us. A banking system run amok, E. Coli burgers, undocumented labor, and peanut butter that kills.

    Subroc, you have been most vocal in your condemnation of the passage of the stimulus bill and Democrats in general. Where were you when "W" and the Republican minions added $5 trillion to the national debt? I doubt that you uttered a peep. I suspect your conservative outrage is so new its eyes have not opened yet. If you were as vocal then as you are now, then my apologies.
    Last edited by subroc; 02-15-2009 at 10:42 AM.
    subroc

    Article [I.]
    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
    Article [II.]
    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

  9. #9
    Senior Member cotts135's Avatar
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    No one has commented on the piece. It was about responsibility the CEO's of these companys failed to take and the peril we face if they remain in charge. Placing blame on one party or another is futile at this point. There is plenty of culpability for both parties. We need now to move on and fix the problem instead of pointing fingers. Here is the link:http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/02132009/watch.html

  10. #10
    Senior Member zeus3925's Avatar
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    Joe:

    Thanks for explaining your viewpoint. I think we are in synch with the banking system. However, there isn't much we can do about Frank or Dodd other than than open our wallets. Must be their constituents love them.

    I am in synch with Afghanistan, but to take on Iraq at the same time was not bright. Bush got into two wars while cutting taxes for big shots. Maybe, he didn't figure that wars cost money.
    Zeus

    I don't want to feed an ugly dog!

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