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How do you correct?

2K views 18 replies 15 participants last post by  foresterpoole 
#1 ·
In two different situations, how do most folks correct? I'm talking about an adult 9 year old dog who knows better but occasionally just flips me the bird, figuring he has more testosterone than I do. Yes, I know, I should ALWAYS have the collar on him and transmitter in my hand, but I occasionally take it off around the home as he develops a hot spot.

How do you correct when he's 50-60-70 etc yards away and call here and he looks at you, hears you and doesn't come? I've seen a trainer drag them yelping by an ear, others walk out and when they start to come and just leave it at that. What do you do when you don't have a collar to make that dog know he better not ignore you next time?

How do you correct when he breaks during marking drills? Can't wear a collar during hunt tests, and he's collar smart, so if he breaks, ignores the whistle to sit and is hellbent on making the retrieve, how do you correct this? Run out and meet him on the way back and give a case of whoop ass or what? He breaks rarely during training, but may when he's had a few and gets really hot and anxious to go, especially in water. Not sure if correcting him while coming back with the bird is correct as he might have forgotten the reason I'm a maniac is he broke or am I over analyzing?

Thanks for the dumb questions, just wanted to see if there were any techniques different than what I use (which resembles a mad man chasing down a 90 pound dog, frothing at the mouth).
 
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#2 ·
I usually just calmly walk out and grab them by the collar and walk them back in. Don't make a big deal because then the dog just runs off.

With regard to the second question, have someone standing behind you with a heeling stick ready to wallop him on the can if he even so much as thinks of picking his backside off the ground.
 
#4 ·
You can pick up a rock,,,meander close enough to him for accuracy then hit him in the ass with the rock and time the word "here" as the rock hits his ass. Or a sling shot is better,,,but who always has a sling shot on them.

Or better yet run the dog through some sort of program designed to re-condition him away from this behavior.

but since he is 9 and he is this way,,, it means that you have done what you can and still he is like this,,,,which probably means get help some someone local that can help you.

Good luck ( even though I don't believe in luck):D
Pete
 
#6 ·
Give a "Burn"" (not a nick) and give the call in whistle. Stop your dog with the sit whistle and "Nick" a few times on the way in (Whistle Sit "Nick" Sit) and call in and repeat a few times.
The "Burn" get's your dogs attention and he realizes he better pay attention.
The "Nicks" and sit whistle re-enforces your control over your dog.

You will see results.

There are many, many opinions on breaking and what to do for different circumstances. Do a search for breaking. I guess the easy answer is do not let your dog be rewarded for breaking and don't let him get the bird in training if possible. That can be having a helper pick up the bird or take your dog off the line and return to the truck. There are many different ways and opinions on working thru this problem.

Having your dog obey your commands in the first part of this message will go a long ways in establishing control on the line and in the field. I'd work on that and get it under control quickly, and it may only take one session with the "Burn" and "Nick" sequence and that may make a big difference. The line issues with breaking will take longer and may never be fixed, it's a tough problem, especially with a dog that has been getting away with breaking for a while.

Just being honest.
 
#7 ·
Thank you Greyghost, but he's a gentleman with the collar on. I was specifically asking about when he doesn't have it on. He got a hot spot and I had to keep it off for quite a while, and now it's recurred and the collar's off and it's during those times that he occasionally breaks or won't return. For the most part he's great, but he just now and then pushes my buttons to see what he can get away with. I wish I had the luxury of a bird boy, but I don't most times, and I'm not fast enough to get to the bird before him. I've just considered not working any drills with him while he can't wear the collar, but that doesn't help if I want to run hunt tests with him again (he ran years ago and got his SH). Might want to run him again for fun, but don't want to waste his or my time.
 
#8 ·
What I always think, don't know if it is right or not, is if the dog is breaking or even fidgeting you have to go back and reestablish that sit means sit. No moving until given the signal.

Don't do it in a setup scenario, this is yard work and should be taken care of that way.

As far as the first question, it should also be taken care of in the yard. Here means here. Redo the rope with the pole training.
 
#9 ·
For the here command. First don't give a here command you can't enforce. I realize that is not always possible but try to stick to that rule. If the dog is 60 - 70 yards away with no collar on and doesn't listen stop giving the here command. This is how they learn they can get away with it. Go out and get the dog immediately and do some "here means here" drills with a check cord or choke chain. Give the command and enforce it close in then gradually stretch it out. During that session remove the cord/chain and give the command with good distance between you and the dog to complete the session. That has worked for me.
 
#10 ·
9 years old, I would sit down with him and negotiate a deal. Offer him beer and cigarettes for the carrot part of the equation and threaten to take away his arthritis medicine for the stick part of it.

Let it go. He is getting old and you need to make some allowances. …..Don
 
#11 ·
No disrespect intended at all, but I don't think making allowances is the right thing to do. He's a very athletic, big, strong dog who hunts aggressively and I need him under control. Granted those times he hunts he will have a collar on, but it's the few times he doesn't that are a problem. I will follow advice to go back to basic yard work as a refresher and find my check cord. Now, were he thirteen and losing hearing, I could see letting it slide, but I know what he hears and when.
 
#12 ·
The two responses you received are what I would do. For Here, put on your sneakers and go get him. Shake him up or pinch his ear and bring him back at heel.

For breaking without the collar, try the healing stick to prevent the break and if he breaks anyway, try to pick up the retrieve object before he get to it, bring him back and shake him up a little and command sit.

I am really with Don on this one. I had one just like you describe....finally just decided to quit beating up on the old boy. Now he is 12 and just gets to do what he wants anyway....got lots of pups to work on now.
 
#15 ·
Have his hearing checked. I had this with one of mine - I thought it was selective hearing - but, had her in for a senior check up and discovered that although she was not completely deaf her hearing was impaired. She could hear noise but not always clear enough to understand the command and give me the proper response - especially if it was windy. If she was concentrating really hard on something she would not respond.

If everything checks out and he is ok, then choose one of the suggestions above and go for it.
 
#16 ·
I appreciate all of the help. He only recently started this, within the past six months and partly could be my work schedule hasn't allowed the time needed for both of us. That, combined with a wife who NEVER has enforced a command of any type might be a clue.
 
#17 ·
I'm with Dsemple. Let the old guy retire and have fun. The old pros have a saying. "Show me the handler who knows the drill and I'll show you the dog that knows the drill." Never blame the dog. Always asked, "What have I done to create this behaviour."

If your dog was younger I would use a 20 or 30 foot rope on him until he came when he was called 100% of the time. I would also work on two or three force drills such "come/sit/come" "Kennel/come" and "Here/sit/here."

For breaking I would move from the soft breakiung drills to the more forceful ones. If you do the "business like fun bumper" every time you train this will go a long way to create steadyness without too much force. For the more advanced drills I use a 6 foot leash and whip.

On a severe case I will throw a clipped wing pigeon at a short distance and then back the dog up turning at right angles and heel the dog right back to the truck and put him away without getting a bird.
 
#18 ·
On a severe case I will throw a clipped wing pigeon at a short distance and then back the dog up turning at right angles and heel the dog right back to the truck and put him away without getting a bird.
Ewww. That's just mean. I like it.
 
#19 ·
Same type problem with my 5 month old (though probably just a puppy issue here). In the house no problem, on the lead, no problem, on a 50' training leash no problem. Take the leash off and he is all over the place. It is especially bad when he KNOWS he is doing something wrong (like picking up a piece of mulch from the front flower beds). And mine has gotten smart too, he will drop the mulch before he comes back. To be honest, I did the ear pinching butt swatting yelling routine followed by a cool down in the dog carrier. About 5 minutes later took him out and ran through sit, stay (for about 30 seconds), come, but with a dog biscut when he came. So he got the idea: come when called good, grab something, refuse to come, run away, REALLY BAD! No collar yet (I figure he is too young), but I have a feeling that will just solidify obedience.
 
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