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Thread: Former President back in the news

  1. #11
    Senior Member BonMallari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dnf777 View Post
    Two Americans held prisoner in hostile nation. A former president negotiates and executes their release and safe return to their families. I can't wait to hear how that's ripped to shreds by neocons. When I heard of this, the first thing I said was he should have taken Bush I with him, to prevent the inevitable attacks from the extreme right. This shows true colors.

    Let the name calling and attacks begin!!
    Who's calling anyone any names ? the negotiations were already done behind the scenes, dont be naive in thinking Clinton hammered out a deal inside of an hour, he was sent in to accept the deal at the request of the President. NK needed a photo op with a world figure, he was the perfect "errand boy"

    who else could they send ? Carter- nope, Bush 41, nope,Al Gore nope, Hillary should have been the logical choice but she has been marginalized and doesnt have the gravitasse to pull it off..

    Kudos to Pres.Clinton for being presidential and helping secure the girls safe return home
    All my Exes live in Texas

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    A few things that I learned still ring true. "Lanse when you get a gift, say thank you and walk away. When you get a screwing walk away. You are going to get a lot more screwings than gifts"

  2. #12
    Senior Member Hew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dnf777 View Post
    Two Americans held prisoner in hostile nation. A former president negotiates and executes their release and safe return to their families. I can't wait to hear how that's ripped to shreds by neocons. When I heard of this, the first thing I said was he should have taken Bush I with him, to prevent the inevitable attacks from the extreme right. This shows true colors.
    The only "inevitable attack" is you driving a hari kari sword through the credibility of your opinions. Last week you made the claim that Bush all but invited 911 on us because he negotiated with the Chinese for our Navy personnel, and this week Clinton is a hero for doing the same.
    I'll take the river down to still water and ride a pack of dogs.

  3. #13
    Senior Member luvalab's Avatar
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    North Korea got to imply they were dealing with the US, the current administration got to pretend they weren't dealing with North Korea, and two citizens get to sleep in their own beds instead of on a prison floor.

    It seems this is the type of thing only ex-presidents can do; I can't stand Clinton, and I'll be darned if I know if this was a good use of his services, but it's a legitimate role of an ex-president and he seems to have done his duty. Sometimes these things even serve a purpose in the long run; then again, they can bite you in the butt. Again, I have no idea on this one.

    Off-the-books diplomacy might be a bit unsavory, but it's been done before, it will be done again, hopefully very rarely.
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    Senior Member Bob Gutermuth's Avatar
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    I still want to know what the quid pro quo was that slick willy got from the two prisoners.
    Bob Gutermuth
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  5. #15
    Senior Member JDogger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Gutermuth View Post
    I still want to know what the quid pro quo was that slick willy got from the two prisoners.
    Please Bob, attack former President Clinton to your heart's delight. He deserves it. I fail to see what you can gain by attacking the two former journalists in question. Are they guilty in your estimation of something other than bad judgement in attempting to enter NK illegally. Do all women who encounter Bill Clinton fall under suspicion?

    JD
    One cannot reason someone out of something they were not reasoned into. - Jonathan Swift

  6. #16
    Senior Member Bob Gutermuth's Avatar
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    It is no great leap of faith to think that Willy got something in return, he wouldn't walk across the street unless someone was willing to pay him in some way for it.
    Bob Gutermuth
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  7. #17
    Senior Member dnf777's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hew View Post
    The only "inevitable attack" is you driving a hari kari sword through the credibility of your opinions. Last week you made the claim that Bush all but invited 911 on us because he negotiated with the Chinese for our Navy personnel, and this week Clinton is a hero for doing the same.
    I don't know what you're smoking in your Avatar, but its cleverly disguised as a cigarette. You might need some dramamine though, after spinning words so ferociously.

    I guess I'm making points, since you're adopting the typical Fox modus operandi of when you can't win on merit, you distort, manipulate, and try to discredit.

    "Credibility"...opinions? Opinions can be whatever the heck you want them to be. Please don't spend so much of your time trying to figure out hidden meanings and distortions in my opinions. They're only that, opinions.

    I don't recall Clinton or anyone else pounding their chest stating any mandates. He did something that may be foreign to you....he negotiated and used diplomacy...or someone did. Very poor comparison, even for you.

    We seem to be taking this to a personal level, and probably need to throw a bucket of cold water on it. In the words of the famous talker...you, sir, have the final word...
    God Bless PFC Jamie Harkness. The US Army's newest PFC, but still our neighbor's little girl!

  8. #18
    Senior Member Hew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dnf777 View Post
    "Credibility"...opinions? Opinions can be whatever the heck you want them to be. Please don't spend so much of your time trying to figure out hidden meanings and distortions in my opinions. They're only that, opinions.
    Everyone is entitled to their own set of opinions, but I don't believe you're entitled to your own set of facts.

    While I don't comment all that much, I typically read everyones' posts. As I read through peoples' comments I often come across things that I didn't know before and learn something or am provided with a new/different perspective to consider. Sometimes I read things that are totally different than what I previously believed to be true or contrary to the facts as I've known them to be. I'm no rocket surgeon or an expert on much of anything, so I often look into those items to perhaps better edumacate myself. Occasionally I find out that I was wrong and end up learning something new or even changing my opinion. When I first started reading your posts I frequently came across many items that challenged my understanding of the facts. But as I looked into your claims, time and again, I found that a lot of your statements of fact were just simply untrue. For example, when you wrote that Limbaugh said John McCain was "un-American" the bullsh*t detector in my brain goes off since that doesn't sound like something Limbaugh would say about McCain and I'd never heard him say something like that before. So I look it up and find no reference to it. Giving you the benefit of the doubt I asked for some evidence...and to-date all I've gotten are chirping crickets. Or the time you wrote, "And just to set the record straight, Obama has not had a budget approved and signed into law yet." I read that and think, "hmmm...now I know that doesn't sound right." In perhaps three seconds one could find numerous references to Obama's signed budget. That you added, "and just to set the record straight..." makes it all the more, well, galling.

    So, no, I don't parse your posts or look for "hidden distortions"....as the distortions usually jump off my monitor screen, grab me by the throat and slap me around. But after your post yesterday, where you pretty much said that you're too busy to let facts get in your way, I will make an effort to not comment on them as much since you don't seem to care whether your opinions are based on facts or not. But in the end, by publically giving your opinion on this site you're inviting comments, so I'll reserve the right to disagree as I see fit.
    I'll take the river down to still water and ride a pack of dogs.

  9. #19
    Senior Member dnf777's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hew View Post
    Everyone is entitled to their own set of opinions, but I don't believe you're entitled to your own set of facts.

    While I don't comment all that much, I typically read everyones' posts. As I read through peoples' comments I often come across things that I didn't know before and learn something or am provided with a new/different perspective to consider. Sometimes I read things that are totally different than what I previously believed to be true or contrary to the facts as I've known them to be. I'm no rocket surgeon or an expert on much of anything, so I often look into those items to perhaps better edumacate myself. Occasionally I find out that I was wrong and end up learning something new or even changing my opinion. When I first started reading your posts I frequently came across many items that challenged my understanding of the facts. But as I looked into your claims, time and again, I found that a lot of your statements of fact were just simply untrue. For example, when you wrote that Limbaugh said John McCain was "un-American" the bullsh*t detector in my brain goes off since that doesn't sound like something Limbaugh would say about McCain and I'd never heard him say something like that before. So I look it up and find no reference to it. Giving you the benefit of the doubt I asked for some evidence...and to-date all I've gotten are chirping crickets. Or the time you wrote, "And just to set the record straight, Obama has not had a budget approved and signed into law yet." I read that and think, "hmmm...now I know that doesn't sound right." In perhaps three seconds one could find numerous references to Obama's signed budget. That you added, "and just to set the record straight..." makes it all the more, well, galling.

    So, no, I don't parse your posts or look for "hidden distortions"....as the distortions usually jump off my monitor screen, grab me by the throat and slap me around. But after your post yesterday, where you pretty much said that you're too busy to let facts get in your way, I will make an effort to not comment on them as much since you don't seem to care whether your opinions are based on facts or not. But in the end, by publically giving your opinion on this site you're inviting comments, so I'll reserve the right to disagree as I see fit.
    Having a budget "approved" meant both houses pass the budget and it is signed into law. That has not happened as of yet. Sorry if I don't meet your muster. If you current job doesn't work out, you would make an EXCELLENT attorney!
    God Bless PFC Jamie Harkness. The US Army's newest PFC, but still our neighbor's little girl!

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by dnf777 View Post
    Two Americans held prisoner in hostile nation. A former president negotiates and executes their release and safe return to their families. I can't wait to hear how that's ripped to shreds by neocons. When I heard of this, the first thing I said was he should have taken Bush I with him, to prevent the inevitable attacks from the extreme right. This shows true colors.

    Let the name calling and attacks begin!!
    Clinton did a great job negotiating...not.

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/ap_on_go_...korea_analysis

    Bill Clinton undertook the mission, a senior administration official said, only after the North assured the White House that the reporters would be freed and allowed to return home with the former president.

    The official, who spoke on condition of anonymity to detail the back-channel negotiations, also said the north rejected Gore as a suitable emissary. The journalists' families, Gore and the White House then turned to Clinton. The official said President Barack Obama did not speak with Clinton about the mission.
    ________
    Honda Cbr600F
    Last edited by ducknwork; 04-21-2011 at 05:07 PM.

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