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Thread: Did the message win in Massachusetts or the method?

  1. #1
    Senior Member DSemple's Avatar
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    Default Did the message win in Massachusetts or the method?

    I’m of the opinion Brown’s victory isn’t a win for conservatism, it’s a rejection of the “shove it down your throat methods”, that both sides of the isle in Washington have been guilty of for that last decade.

    There was no consensus about going into Iraq

    Tarp was shoved down our throats.

    The stimulus packages were rammed through.

    Heath Care reform is being brokered in back room deals.


    It all tastes like Asparagus.


    ....Don
    Just for the record I have very fine dogs. Some of the best in the whole country....or at least on my own block anyhow.

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    Senior Member YardleyLabs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DSemple View Post
    I’m of the opinion Brown’s victory isn’t a win for conservatism, it’s a rejection of the “shove it down your throat methods”, that both sides of the isle in Washington have been guilty of for that last decade.

    There was no consensus about going into Iraq

    Tarp was shoved down our throats.

    The stimulus packages were rammed through.

    Heath Care reform is being brokered in back room deals.


    It all tastes like Asparagus.


    ....Don
    I suspect that there was not one simple message behind the voters' decision. Massachusetts polls show strong (57%) support for Obama, and even strong majority support for the President's health plan. What they didn't show was support for Coakley who ran a dismissive campaign. If the administration had not lost support from independents and moderate democrats, Coakley probably would have won despite being a bad candidate.. Had Coakley been a good candidate, she probably would have won despite the problems fced by the administration. Having a bad candidate and administration problems spelled victory for a guy who would have had trouble being elected dog catcher under different circumstances.

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    Senior Member AmiableLabs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DSemple View Post
    I’m of the opinion Brown’s victory isn’t a win for conservatism, it’s a rejection of the “shove it down your throat methods”, that both sides of the isle in Washington have been guilty of for that last decade.
    Close, but no soap. We are experiencing a wave of populism. In 2008, the voters overwhelmingly voted for "change." In a majority of ways, they got more of the same, just a different color.

    Quote Originally Posted by YardleyLabs View Post
    I suspect that there was not one simple message behind the voters' decision. . . .What they didn't show was support for Coakley who ran a dismissive campaign. If the administration had not lost support from independents and moderate democrats, Coakley probably would have won despite being a bad candidate.
    A perfect reiteration of the spin from the left. "It's not the policies! Oh no! It's the cowbell -- we need more cowbell!"

    http://www.funnyhub.com/videos/pages...e-cowbell.html

    Keep it up. Please, keep it up. "More cowbell."
    Kevin Walker

    Drive is the manifestation of Desire, and measured in Style.
    Thank you judges who score Style, you are preserving Desire!

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    Senior Member Hew's Avatar
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    Here's an interesting article that makes the case for national security/terror issues playing a big part...

    “People talk about the potency of the health-care issue,” Brown’s top strategist, Eric Fehrnstrom, told National Review’s Robert Costa, “but from our own internal polling, the more potent issue here in Massachusetts was terrorism and the treatment of enemy combatants.”

    http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=ZTAyNjJiMGZmMWU4NGQ2MDZlZjRlNDkyYTE0OGJlNGE=
    I hope Cotts doesn't read this.
    I'll take the river down to still water and ride a pack of dogs.

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    Senior Member dback's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YardleyLabs View Post
    I suspect that there was not one simple message behind the voters' decision. Massachusetts polls show strong (57%) support for Obama, and even strong majority support for the President's health plan. What they didn't show was support for Coakley who ran a dismissive campaign. If the administration had not lost support from independents and moderate democrats, Coakley probably would have won despite being a bad candidate.. Had Coakley been a good candidate, she probably would have won despite the problems fced by the administration. Having a bad candidate and administration problems spelled victory for a guy who would have had trouble being elected dog catcher under different circumstances.
    Not too hard to find folks that would disagree with that statement. http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/op...-81112097.html
    Last edited by dback; 01-20-2010 at 11:09 AM.
    "What a difference a week makes. This week I feel like a football coach. Last week I felt like Britney Spears' choreographer."
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    Senior Member AmiableLabs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YardleyLabs View Post
    Massachusetts polls show strong (57%) support for Obama, and even strong majority support for the President's health plan.
    NOT EVEN CLOSE TO THE TRUTH. Yes, they support Obama at around 57%, BUT --

    The citizens of Massachusetts oppose "proposed national near universal healthcare law" 51% to 36%. They oppose Obamacare 48% to 47%.

    http://www.suffolk.edu/images/conten...an.14.2010.pdf
    Kevin Walker

    Drive is the manifestation of Desire, and measured in Style.
    Thank you judges who score Style, you are preserving Desire!

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    The number that really sticks with me was that only 12% of the voters in MA are Republicans. Match that against Brown's 52% vote total. He picked up roughly 40% from somewhere....Dems or the independents. That strikes me as a pretty powerful message.

    Eric

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    Senior Member DSemple's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hew View Post
    Here's an interesting article that makes the case for national security/terror issues playing a big part...

    Quote:
    “People talk about the potency of the health-care issue,” Brown’s top strategist, Eric Fehrnstrom, told National Review’s Robert Costa, “but from our own internal polling, the more potent issue here in Massachusetts was terrorism and the treatment of enemy combatants.”

    http://article.nationalreview.com/?q...kyYTE0OGJlNGE=

    I hope Cotts doesn't read this.
    From the Article - "Scott Brown went out and made the case for enhanced interrogation, for denying terrorists the rights of criminal defendants, for detaining them without trial, and for trying them by military commission. It worked. It will work for other candidates willing to get out of their Beltway bubbles."

    A perfect example of explaining and selling a position, which Americans like, admire and respect, even if they don't agree with it.

    Reagan used the same method. He explained and sold his ideas directly to the public and the public bought in to them and pressured their representatives to go along with his plans.

    How you play the game matters.

    Thanks Hew
    Just for the record I have very fine dogs. Some of the best in the whole country....or at least on my own block anyhow.

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    Senior Member huntinman's Avatar
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    So now every time a Lib loses the party line is "they did not run a good campaign" or "we had a bad candidate". Hell, we even said that about McCain...

    That could be said about every losing campaign out there. Coakley was good enough to be elected Attorney General for the state. Maybe it wasn't the campaign or the candidate, but the message...

    The best single event for conservatives in the last decade or so has been Obama. His Chicago style politics has galvanized the nation against this BS.
    Bill Davis

  10. #10
    Senior Member EdA's Avatar
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    This should make incumbent Democrats facing re-election in an off year a bit uncomfortable with their current position and may give some cause to re-evaluate their alignment with the Administration

    If a Republican can be elected to the Senate from Massachusetts then almost anything is possible

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