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  1. #11
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    Since when did I become responsible for 10 million children...I was smart enough not to have one what happened to the parents of those children!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cody Covey View Post
    Since when did I become responsible for 10 million children...I was smart enough not to have one what happened to the parents of those children!


    They're hiding behind those kids, and using them as an excuse to be fed, clothed, and have shelter provided for themselves. Can't feed the kids without momma stuffing her face too.

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by depittydawg View Post
    Just can't seem to get my mind around the conservatives mission to deprive people of healthcare. And lets not forget the fact that most of the uninsured in this country are children. Kind of weird. But then, considering what these people are all about, it isn't surprising.
    What a bunch of BS. I can not find one state that does not offer free or extremely reduced health care for poor childern. AZ has ACCSS and other states have similar programs. The programs are already in place on the local level. No body is withholding health care from anyone, at least it is no worse then the federal plan will be and a lot cheaper too.

    I love the way you phrase "conservatives mission to deprive people of healthcare", thats just as bad as saying the liberals aggenda is to enslave the masses. Both statements are stupid.
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  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by depittydawg View Post
    Hey flybreath. Suppose you explain why it is that conservatives have such an issue with forking out a little support for the 10 million or so children in this nation who don't have healthcare?
    This rather clearly shows the gap between liberals and conservatives today. To liberals, this suit is about healthcare as if the suit attacks the only way healthcare can be delivered. To conservatives, this suit is about preserving constitutional relationships and issues and the marketplace. The same suit would have been brought if Congress had passed a Universal Auto Ownership Act and required people to pay into a fund that gave some members of society free autos.

    Eric
    Last edited by Eric Johnson; 10-16-2010 at 10:27 AM.

  5. #15
    Senior Member M&K's Retrievers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by depittydawg View Post
    Hey flybreath. Suppose you explain why it is that conservatives have such an issue with forking out a little support for the 10 million or so children in this nation who don't have healthcare? Dispute that numbers? Look it up yourself. Suppose you also include in your answer how you don't give a rats ass about those who go without so you can make your pathetic living peddling bogus insurance fraud products to decent Americans. Ignore only works if you've got the self restraint to not peak you mindless drone.
    Since RK quoted you, I guess I should respond. You have taken the liberty to show your ignorance while accusing me of selling "bogus insurance fraud products to decent Americans". Kiddo, you have insulted me, my profession as well the companies I represent while exposing your total lack of information about this and every other subject you attempt to address. I and the companies I represent have provided valuable protection to individuals seeking to buy coverage rather than live off the government or other hand outs. You, on the other hand, would rather have someone else give you something for nothing. Go see your parents if you need help. Not everyone feels they deserve to be cared for by others like you do. Should we provide your groceries, your utilities, your legal fees, housing? Why stop with insurance? Let's just give you everything you need for nothing. Now that I think about it, if you had everything you want, you wouldn't have anything to biotch about on POTUS.

    One other thing. Where do you come off attacking someones profession when you know nothing about it? Where do you come off complaining about insurance when I bet you have collected more than you have paid in premiums (your employer probably paid most of that).

    Grow up little man and get a grip and stop insulting posters regards,
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  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    Since RK quoted you, I guess I should respond. You have taken the liberty to show your ignorance while accusing me of selling "bogus insurance fraud products to decent Americans". Kiddo, you have insulted me, my profession as well the companies I represent while exposing your total lack of information about this and every other subject you attempt to address. I and the companies I represent have provided valuable protection to individuals seeking to buy coverage rather than live off the government or other hand outs. You, on the other hand, would rather have someone else give you something for nothing. Go see your parents if you need help. Not everyone feels they deserve to be cared for by others like you do. Should we provide your groceries, your utilities, your legal fees, housing? Why stop with insurance? Let's just give you everything you need for nothing. Now that I think about it, if you had everything you want, you wouldn't have anything to biotch about on POTUS.

    One other thing. Where do you come off attacking someones profession when you know nothing about it? Where do you come off complaining about insurance when I bet you have collected more than you have paid in premiums (your employer probably paid most of that).

    Grow up little man and get a grip and stop insulting posters regards,
    Tell you what, you quit insulting me at every opportunity that comes your way, and I'll do the same. I have never insulted you other than to RESPOND to an insult you've flung my way. Keep doing it, and I'll keep letting you have it back.
    As far as your profession. You represent an industry that has shut out nearly 50 million Americans from access to healthcare over the last 20 years or so. And it gets worse every year. Your industry has CEO's retiring with Billions of dollars of ripped off money, while their clients go bankrupt, suffer and even die because guys like you sift through legal mumbu jumbo searching for loopholes to defraud your customers. Your industry saddles America with the HIGHEST cost healthcare system in the world with one of the lowest outcomes of any industrialized nation. The fact that you make a living selling insurance is not dishonest. The fact that you defend the status quo of a corrupt, dishonest, industry that is ripping off consumers speaks volumes for your lack of decency.
    I know a lot of insurance salesman and women who are fighting harder than I am for reform of the Health Insurance industry. They live it everyday. They see the customers who have paid all their lives all of a sudden cut off when the need the insurance. They see claims denied and have to deal with the back offices that exist only to deny claims. These people have integrity, are honest, and are hard workers. They see the flaws in the system and are trying to change it. They live everyday within the environment of self serving greed from the far distant offices that try to dictate who is, and who isn't illegible, among their paying customers, to receive care. These decent folks are not sitting back on their haunches trying to defend or perpetuate a failed industry. They see the flaws in their industry and are trying to fight it.
    The fact that you work in the Health Insurance Industry and understand how it works, and persist in defending it, isn't something you should be bragging about. What company do you work for? I've dealt with several over the last several years. By far the worst company for its customers is United Health Care. Regency Blue Cross / Blue Shield was a decent company except that they tried to deny just about every claim until pushed back against. I now have Aetna. They have proven to be a decent company. Yes, you are correct. I have insurance through my employer. I have no choice in the matter. Since I'm over 50 years old, no insurance company will take a personal policy out on me or my wife. Neither of us has ever been seriously ill. A few years ago I had United Healthcare. Never saw such a callous organisation in my life, in any business. They denied claims, lost paperwork, caused so many roadblocks and obstacles that I tried to drop it from work and buy my own. That's when I found out NO insurance company would sell my family a policy. Now isn't that a nice twist. I've never been uninsured in my life. I've paid premiums for 35 years and other than a few office visits and a broken leg never used the insurance. But, no, they can't sell a policy to someone my age. Hell, I might actually get sick. So keep on defending your industry. Sooner or later you won't have an industry to defend.

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    Quote Originally Posted by code3retrievers View Post
    What a bunch of BS. I can not find one state that does not offer free or extremely reduced health care for poor childern. AZ has ACCSS and other states have similar programs. The programs are already in place on the local level. No body is withholding health care from anyone, at least it is no worse then the federal plan will be and a lot cheaper too.

    I love the way you phrase "conservatives mission to deprive people of healthcare", thats just as bad as saying the liberals aggenda is to enslave the masses. Both statements are stupid.
    Let me spell it out for you. Conservatives, Republicans, whatever you want to call them, BLOCKED all attempts at reforming the system that currently denies about 50 million people healthcare coverage. Not a day goes by on this site that conservatives don't rant and rave about somebody getting a handout that didn't earn it.
    It's not a lack of resources. It's not a lack of money. Hell, while United Healthcare was busily trying to deny every office visit my family needed, their CEO retired with like 7 BILLION dollars. How in the world did this guy get so much money? Where did that money come from? Was it providing healthcare? Not... It was because he created an empire of 'professionals' who made a science out of collecting premiums from their customers and then getting out of upholding their end of the contract when it came due.
    So let me ask again. What is it about conservatives that makes them so appalled at reaching out a hand to help others in need?
    The Republican Party, its representatives, whom you place in their positions, have fought against not only healthcare, but every other system that is designed to help people who can't help themselves. So, what the hell. Are you all so greedy you can't stand the thought of helping someone else? Have you completely lost or forgot the meaning of sacrifice? Take a step back and just look what you guys are advocating. You want to turn the clock back to 1920?
    You mention the State run systems that provide services to children and others. Conservatives have fought, and continue to fight these programs at every level. The fact that they exist is not a credit to ANY conservative initiative that I've ever seen. They exist only because Republicans, and conservative LOST those battles.
    So one more time. What is it about HELPING people in need that gets the blood of Conservatives boiling? A simple question.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Johnson View Post
    This rather clearly shows the gap between liberals and conservatives today. To liberals, this suit is about healthcare as if the suit attacks the only way healthcare can be delivered. To conservatives, this suit is about preserving constitutional relationships and issues and the marketplace. The same suit would have been brought if Congress had passed a Universal Auto Ownership Act and required people to pay into a fund that gave some members of society got free autos.

    Eric
    On its merit, this lawsuit does expose some legitimate questions to various parts of the healthcare changes. Which, BTW, I was against it in its final form. Specifically, the fine, or whatever it is that is imposed for not paying into the system. Now, keep in mind that we ended up with this 'fine' because conservatives, and also some Democratic congressional leaders would NOT budge in adopting a single payer system in any form. Without total participation, it becomes extremely expensive to cover everyone. So we end up with this ridiculous idea of collecting fines from people who opt out of coverage (which they should be mandated to pay for in the first place)

    On these merits, I actually side with the states. But make no mistake about it. This law suit is NOT driven by constitutional principles. It is an orchestrated attempt to stop reform of the health industry in its tracks. The constitutionality issues are secondary. The same coalition who is trying to use the constitution now, has in the past, and will continue to shred the constitution when it becomes necessary to their end.
    I hope the courts throw the entire healthcare package out. I also hope the Republicans win control over one or both houses. Remember that 70% of Americans want a single payer system. That's a huge number. Let the Republicans figure out how to make that happen. Instead of playing the obstructionist game, and being the party of NO, they will be the party in power. And they will be charged with getting the job done. Should be fun to watch them squirm again.

  9. #19
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    ok all you liberal dipwits - spin this one, please

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    "Medicare loses seven times as much money in fraud every year than the combined profits of the 14 health insurance companies on the Fortune 500." Yet here's Harry Reid getting paid off on a land deal in Vegas, impugning insurance companies for seeking profit and "almost destroying our economy" when he and his buddies in the Democrat Party are in the process of doing just that.

    In the systems they devise for our health care -- Medicare, Medicaid -- there's so much fraud (and who knows who's getting paid off on this) that it dwarfs the combined profit of 14 health insurance companies in the Fortune 500. This is just an out-and-out outrageous, despicable lie and is typical of what we've been getting of the Democrat Party for as long as I've been listening to 'em speak. Government great! Government God! Profits destroy! Profits destroy economy. Profits destroy the country. Companies, corporations want profits. They don't care about people. Only Democrats care about people. Only Democrats care about the little guy -- unless you're unborn in the womb and then you're on your own. "
    <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    "As 60 Minutes reported last week, Medicare fraud is rampant and has now replaced the cocaine (ahem) business as the major criminal activity in South Florida. Both 60 Minutes and the Washington Post report that Medicare fraud now costs American taxpayers roughly $60 billion a year. That may sound like a lot of money, but surely it pales next to the extraordinary profits of private insurance companies, right?

    Well, let's see.... Last year, the profits of the ten largest insurance companies in America were just over $8 billion -- combined. No single insurance company made even five percent of what Medicare reportedly loses in fraud."

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    so, dippity doo dah, actually it is doctors and their fraud (do we have any here?) that are and have been the real culprit, so instead of harping on MK for his profession, why not place the blame where it really lies - the doctors that have medicare fraud down to an art form.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by david gibson View Post
    ok all you liberal dipwits - spin this one, please

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    "Medicare loses seven times as much money in fraud every year than the combined profits of the 14 health insurance companies on the Fortune 500." Yet here's Harry Reid getting paid off on a land deal in Vegas, impugning insurance companies for seeking profit and "almost destroying our economy" when he and his buddies in the Democrat Party are in the process of doing just that.

    In the systems they devise for our health care -- Medicare, Medicaid -- there's so much fraud (and who knows who's getting paid off on this) that it dwarfs the combined profit of 14 health insurance companies in the Fortune 500. This is just an out-and-out outrageous, despicable lie and is typical of what we've been getting of the Democrat Party for as long as I've been listening to 'em speak. Government great! Government God! Profits destroy! Profits destroy economy. Profits destroy the country. Companies, corporations want profits. They don't care about people. Only Democrats care about people. Only Democrats care about the little guy -- unless you're unborn in the womb and then you're on your own. "
    <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    "As 60 Minutes reported last week, Medicare fraud is rampant and has now replaced the cocaine (ahem) business as the major criminal activity in South Florida. Both 60 Minutes and the Washington Post report that Medicare fraud now costs American taxpayers roughly $60 billion a year. That may sound like a lot of money, but surely it pales next to the extraordinary profits of private insurance companies, right?

    Well, let's see.... Last year, the profits of the ten largest insurance companies in America were just over $8 billion -- combined. No single insurance company made even five percent of what Medicare reportedly loses in fraud."

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    so, dippity doo dah, actually it is doctors and their fraud (do we have any here?) that are and have been the real culprit, so instead of harping on MK for his profession, why not place the blame where it really lies - the doctors that have medicare fraud down to an art form.
    I have spoken to several Doctors, nurses and healthcare providers over the last few years. Every one of them is an advocate of single payer healthcare. They live the life, and bare the expense of dealing with the fraudulent health insurance companies on a daily basis. Not once, has a healthcare professional responded to my inquiries with a positive assessment of the current state of healthcare, as administered by the Insurance Companies of America.
    The fact that Medicare has issues is just another factor presenting the need for healthcare reform in America. Why did the Republican Party BLOCK all attemps at reform. Why did they NOT offer up any proposals for reform of their own?
    I'll say one more thing, then I'm done with this topic. We can agree to disagree. When reform is necessary, a public institution, such as Medicare is directly responsive to the political leaders we put in place. They can clean it up. When an private industry, such as healthcare today (their are many other examples), spins out of control it is a much more difficult task to initiate change. Another good argument for a public option.

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