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Thread: Before I go down...

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrianW View Post
    So are you guys advocating that government set limits in how successful someone can be?!? Talk about killing the entrepreneurial spirit! Did you do anything to develop Facebook? But you seem to think that the guy should only "deserve" to be a millionaire and gov.org should reap the harvest of profit and share the wealth where IT sees fit?
    In case you haven't noticed, most of the major charitable foundations are started & funded by the ultra-rich, the Gates', the Krocs et al who establish hospitals, university scholarships, community centers etc etc. They start with next to nothing but a few bucks and a good idea, grow it because of the American Dream & Spirit and then share their fortune because it's the right, moral and the human thing to do. Not because anyone else is entitled to or deserves a gift of their wealth as part of a political movement.

    And that's what the main point of UB's pasted e-mail is about, imo. When the Blue Hairs & Grey Hairs were young, you were 'entitled' to nothing but the "pursuit of happiness" & chance of being a success. There was no "right" to a college education or own a home. So yes it was "ME, ME, ME" because you knew that no one was going to give it to you. If you wanted something better, you EARNED it. So you worked for it. Sometimes with 2 or 3 jobs & you made sacrifices so your kids could have it better than you. And if you lost a job and couldn't get one where you lived, you moved to where the jobs were.

    But somehow this has changed and "The Dream" has been allowed to turn into a grotesque caricature of itself. The Aunt Zeituni video that was linked here a short while back is a great example, of what not everyone, but far too many evidently believe, an almost perfect synopsis of an "share the wealth" entitlement mentality. The sacrifices the GHB made & the gifts they and others still continue to give this country are being squandered & discarded by the spoiled children who seem to take it for granted that the grandparent's hard won inheritance is a no limit allowance for doing nothing. So I don't blame them for being pissed off and trying to get the nest egg back before it goes totally rotten..
    The only thing that I advocate is that the wealthiest Americans pay the same percentage of their income, in any form, in taxes that the middle class does. And that US corporations, since they are more than equal to us biological units as citizens, pay the same.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrianW View Post
    So are you guys advocating that government set limits in how successful someone can be?!? Talk about killing the entrepreneurial spirit! Did you do anything to develop Facebook? But you seem to think that the guy should only "deserve" to be a millionaire and gov.org should reap the harvest of profit and share the wealth where IT sees fit?
    In case you haven't noticed, most of the major charitable foundations are started & funded by the ultra-rich, the Gates', the Krocs et al who establish hospitals, university scholarships, community centers etc etc. They start with next to nothing but a few bucks and a good idea, grow it because of the American Dream & Spirit and then share their fortune because it's the right, moral and the human thing to do. Not because anyone else is entitled to or deserves a gift of their wealth as part of a political movement.

    And that's what the main point of UB's pasted e-mail is about, imo. When the Blue Hairs & Grey Hairs were young, you were 'entitled' to nothing but the "pursuit of happiness" & chance of being a success. There was no "right" to a college education or own a home. So yes it was "ME, ME, ME" because you knew that no one was going to give it to you. If you wanted something better, you EARNED it. So you worked for it. Sometimes with 2 or 3 jobs & you made sacrifices so your kids could have it better than you. And if you lost a job and couldn't get one where you lived, you moved to where the jobs were.

    But somehow this has changed and "The Dream" has been allowed to turn into a grotesque caricature of itself. The Aunt Zeituni video that was linked here a short while back is a great example, of what not everyone, but far too many evidently believe, an almost perfect synopsis of an "share the wealth" entitlement mentality. The sacrifices the GHB made & the gifts they and others still continue to give this country are being squandered & discarded by the spoiled children who seem to take it for granted that the grandparent's hard won inheritance is a no limit allowance for doing nothing. So I don't blame them for being pissed off and trying to get the nest egg back before it goes totally rotten..
    This is a strawman argument. Beyond that, the developer of FaceBook would have had nothing to develop if the government had not financed and overseen the entire development of the Internet. It would also be very amusing to the developer of FaceBook to be mentioned in the same post with the words blue hairs and gray hairs, and I wonder who paid his tuition at Harvard.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    Can you explain why its my fault


    Pete
    None of us is perfect and none of us has done everything we could to make things better. Makes no difference if it was voting or some other thing we failed to do. I don't know too many people who would say that they stepped up and did everything they could. I don't know you so I can't tell you where you made a mistake. Everyone has to search their own mind for what they can and should do.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by dnf777 View Post
    Not at all. I never said anything remotely close to that. I think reasonable laws should be in place, as they have been until the Reagan/Bush/Clinton/Bush era.

    What do you have against keeping a manufacturing base in America? Henry Ford had the right idea. And I don't think his entrepreneurial spirit was killed.

    Yes, the spirit needs to be kept alive. But not allowed to run free until the point it becomes unbridled greed, to the detriment of the very workers who built the system in the first place. Surely you don't regret Kenneth Lay, Michael Milken, and Bernie Madoff having their "entrepreneurial spirits" reeled in a bit?
    There is nothing entrepreneurial about a CEO, who in many cases is destroying an organization he walked into, not building one, or a Wall Street Banker pocketing more than a billion dollars a year. Why do America CEO's seem to require 500X workers wages while Europe and Japan seem to find CEO's that get the best of our in industry after industry for a fraction of the cost?
    From 2002-2204 US median household income dropped about 1700 dollars a year. During the same period CEO pay increased 1,827,000 dollars per year. There is nothing entrepreneurial about this.

  5. #25
    Senior Member dnf777's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by depittydawg View Post
    There is nothing entrepreneurial about a CEO, who in many cases is destroying an organization he walked into, not building one, or a Wall Street Banker pocketing more than a billion dollars a year. Why do America CEO's seem to require 500X workers wages while Europe and Japan seem to find CEO's that get the best of our in industry after industry for a fraction of the cost?
    From 2002-2204 US median household income dropped about 1700 dollars a year. During the same period CEO pay increased 1,827,000 dollars per year. There is nothing entrepreneurial about this.
    those statistics speak volumes about what's wrong with our corporate structure. There is a line between capitalism and greed. I'd like to say a "thin line", but nowadays, its a gulf.
    God Bless PFC Jamie Harkness. The US Army's newest PFC, but still our neighbor's little girl!

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