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Thread: Just Plain in Over His Head!!!!

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Granddaddy View Post
    Even waiting too late, it is still the only viable approach for the US. We have to support those who support our interests as a first priority. We can attempt to change/influence the culture to something we find acceptable, but that has to be a second priority. The point is if influence and pressure is handled properly, the public would never know we are making the application. This current approach of our president making a public announcement as a reaction every time something new happens shows publically we really have no influence and no plan for stability in the region.

    Certainly at the same time we should have a national plan to lessen the dependence upon anything from the Middle East. That would mean aggressive drilling in the US (the gulf, the east coast & Alaska), all of which can be done without risk to the environment. More aggressive use of our abundant natural gas and coal (using new clean coal techniques). And BTW what has happened to Obama's campaign promises to do just these things? I do know at this point wherever we find a key strategic resource threatened, we should be actively involved to influence the continued allegiance to protect the resource. Our future and world peace depend upon it.
    While I agree with much of what you are saying, we have passed the point of using our influence and pressure to effect change in this situation. We can try those tactics on the next autocratic regime we are in bed with BEFORE it descends into chaos.

    We donít really know what the U.S. has been doing behind the scenes to help resolve and control this situation since it has erupted. We are only speculating. I am sure the Obama administration has been in contact with Mubarak regarding the conflict. We do not know how those discussions went. I think the Obama administration realizes there is nothing that can be done to save Mubarak at this point. Continuing to support him publically would only serve to make the U.S. look complicit with Mubarakís oppression in the eyes of the Egyptian people. That would not bode well for us with whatever administration ends up replacing Mubarak.

    Although there is the chance the Muslim Brotherhood will replace Mubarak, it is more likely his successor will be someone like Mohamed ElBaradei. ElBaradei is someone the U.S. is more likely to forge a good relationship with. Perhaps the Obama administration is already working on that.

    While Iím big on loyalty, I could not support a despot over the will of those he is oppressing. Perhaps the Obama administration feels the same way.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by road kill View Post
    All we have to do is to start "talking" about drilling and prices will go down.

    It has happened before.


    BTW--5 oil rigs are far less intrusive to the landscape than 500 wind mills, and produce far more benefits.


    RK
    Even if that did work, it is still not a solution to decency on oil, foreign or domestic. If we drill, how long will those reserves last before weíre right back in the same situation?

    My point is we, as a country, are not willing to make scarifies now if we think it will cost us more. I have seen it with the backlash against E-85, and heard people complain about the cost of electric vehicles, like Volt. We want to blame the Governments lack of an energy policy, but would we support it if they had one?

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackstone View Post
    Even if that did work, it is still not a solution to decency on oil, foreign or domestic. If we drill, how long will those reserves last before we’re right back in the same situation?

    My point is we, as a country, are not willing to make scarifies now if we think it will cost us more. I have seen it with the backlash against E-85, and heard people complain about the cost of electric vehicles, like Volt. We want to blame the Governments lack of an energy policy, but would we support it if they had one?
    Just the known reserves off the east coast are estimated at 30yrs+ reserves. The known reserves in Alaska are even higher & in Alaska, exploration has been very limited, therefore the potential reserves are much higher. Reserves in the Rocky Mtns from shale are estimated to be higher than our off-shore reserves. In addition our natural gas & coal reserves represent some of the highest in the world.

    Nothing but politics has kept us from being fuel source independent. The radical environmentalists, the multi-national oil companies and the politicians have formed an unholy alliance when it comes to fuel source(s) limitations. The environmentalists don't want any fossil fuels used dispite clean technologies. The multi-national oil companies want the best return on their investments which is fostered by limiting supplies (higher prices). The politicians are funded by both of the noted groups and are therefore influenced to limit supply.

    And, of course, nuclear power, is both the cleanest and cheapest of all power sources but our government won't license new power plants. The result is that politics and propaganda have us wringing our hands that we don't have long term power sources.
    David Didier, GA

  4. #54
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
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    While I agree with much of what you are saying, we have passed the point of using our influence and pressure to effect change in this situation. We can try those tactics on the next autocratic regime we are in bed with BEFORE it descends into chaos.
    We didn't learn from previous mistakes, so I'm not real confident that we'll learn much from this one either. It will take a major change of mindset for those in our govt who make these decisions.

    We had 30 years to put some pressure on Mubarak. I can only guess that we were afraid to rock the boat. As long as Mubarak stayed an ally, his payoff was to have us "look the other way" on how he maintained his control.

    Continuing to support him publically would only serve to make the U.S. look complicit with Mubarak’s oppression in the eyes of the Egyptian people. That would not bode well for us with whatever administration ends up replacing Mubarak.
    Absolutely ... but what have we done for 30 years? If I were on the outside looking in, I wouldn't trust the US as far as I could throw us. We are doing the same thing in Iraq and A'stan! So, when do we learn from our errors of the past?

    The errors of the past are on the scorecards of those who made them. The errors we are making now are on O's scorecard. Time to tell despots like these our tolerance level has been exceeded.

    We want to blame the Governments lack of an energy policy, but would we support it if they had one?
    So, if we ever get a sensible energy policy, we might get an answer to that question. From your mouth to God's ear
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
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  5. #55
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
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    And, of course, nuclear power, is both the cleanest and cheapest of all power sources but our government won't license new power plants. The result is that politics and propaganda have us wringing our hands that we don't have long term power sources.
    And one cannot underestimate the value not being subject to "blackmail" if we could be very much self-sufficient just long enough to make the extortionists blink.
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
    "Know in your heart that all things are possible. We couldn't conceive of a miracle if none ever happened." -Libby Fudim

    ​I don't use the PM feature, so just email me direct at the address shown above.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    Nah! We don't need no stinking domestic production and the jobs it would create. Let's just continue to be totally dependent on the Middle East. They always seem to look out for our best interests.
    Hey, I know, why don't we get the oil from Iraq that the Bush administration said would pay for the war??????????????

  7. #57
    Senior Member M&K's Retrievers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Perry View Post
    Hey, I know, why don't we get the oil from Iraq that the Bush administration said would pay for the war??????????????
    Why don't we get it here?

    If we could bottle all of your hatred, we wouldn't need any oil, foreign or domestic.

    Last time I checked, Bush isn't in charge, your buddy Obama is. Let him get it from Iraq. After all, those are his buds.
    Last edited by M&K's Retrievers; 02-05-2011 at 11:58 AM.
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  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Granddaddy View Post
    Just the known reserves off the east coast are estimated at 30yrs+ reserves. The known reserves in Alaska are even higher & in Alaska, exploration has been very limited, therefore the potential reserves are much higher. Reserves in the Rocky Mtns from shale are estimated to be higher than our off-shore reserves. In addition our natural gas & coal reserves represent some of the highest in the world.

    Nothing but politics has kept us from being fuel source independent. The radical environmentalists, the multi-national oil companies and the politicians have formed an unholy alliance when it comes to fuel source(s) limitations. The environmentalists don't want any fossil fuels used dispite clean technologies. The multi-national oil companies want the best return on their investments which is fostered by limiting supplies (higher prices). The politicians are funded by both of the noted groups and are therefore influenced to limit supply.


    And, of course, nuclear power, is both the cleanest and cheapest of all power sources but our government won't license new power plants. The result is that politics and propaganda have us wringing our hands that we don't have long term power sources.

    one of the best explanations right there
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  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    Why don't we get it here?

    If we could bottle all of your hatred, we wouldn't need any oil, foreign or domestic.

    Last time I checked, Bush isn't in charge, your buddy Obama is. Let him get it from Iraq. After all, those are his buds.
    Well, we could send Cheney over there and let him lead Haliburton to the oil fields.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Perry View Post
    Well, we could send Cheney over there and let him lead Haliburton to the oil fields.
    A thousand comedians out of work and your trying to make jokes.
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