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Bite Inhibition/Drop it

4K views 33 replies 12 participants last post by  bmelvin 
#1 ·
Hey guys, I was wondering if anybody had any really good suggestions on bite inhibition and teaching "drop it". I talked to a behaviorist who told me that just ignoring the puppy would show him that it is not acceptable to bite. This seems to make sense in theory, but in real life my puppy just jumps at you and bites your pants/legs to try and get your attention.

Also, he does NOT want to let go of his toys/bumpers...any suggestions?

Thanks
 
#2 ·
I am not sure if this is correct or how many people use this technique but any puppy I have ever had I used this on them and it worked great. To stop aggressive mouthing on people I usually take the upper lip and apply pressure to the upper canine tooth. Just enough pressure to let the little guy know this is not a good thing. After a coulple times the biting turns to licking. It is basically mimicing how his natural mother would have corrected him if he bit her. She would have nipped him back and that would have been the end of it. Taking toys out of the mouth needs to be quick and concise and coupled with a command. Just takes time and repetition. Don't let it become a tug of war. Again I am by no means a expert in dog training but these have worked for me personally and I am sure there are a bunch of other techniques that may even be more effective.

Wish you the best with the little guy
 
#3 ·
Yep,the 'ol bite yourself trick usually does it.Show him another toy or something he is allowed to chew on(nylabone etc) in place of the one he has,praise when he gives it up,most pups will outgrow this,along with proper handling of the situation 'ie' don't pull it from him.
 
#4 ·
I'm not a fan of "how the mother would correct" corrections because I'm not a momma dog and the pup knows darn well I'm not a momma dog.

I used this protocol with my aunt's mixed breed puppy the week she had him and it cut the biting quickly. http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/teaching-bite-inhibition
 
#5 ·
The bitting seems never ending but trust me pup will grow out of it in time. My 11 month YLM was awful but thankfully he was over it when he finished teething. I was able to control the biting by using a firm no and replacing my hand or toes with his favorite toy when he would bite. Be sure to be consistent with this, I always made sure I had a toy in my pocket or within arms reach to give him.

In regards to dropping toys on command leave that be. Let toys be toys and all about fun in the house with no expectations. For bumpers do retrieves in the hallway were he has to return to you. If outside always have pup on a check cord and PRAISE for returning. My neighbor still gives me a hard time for all the funny voices and hup hups I was doing in the yard.
 
#6 ·
Raegan,

I read that article and I always keep my mind open to new ideas and I appreciate you sharing that.

I personally could never see myself walking in and out of a room mubbling things to a 12 week old puppy to try and convince them I am not a chew toy. But again that is just my opinion.

However, I do disagree with the fact that you don't assume the dominant role in the relationship. If you are not the "Momma or Pappa" all that is left is a littermate. I am a firm believer that you need to establish your self as the pack leader early on.
 
#7 ·
At that age I*want to be viewed as a provider not a bully. I will trade a treat for a toy. Use two bumpers and when they return with one throw the other. They will drop it to give chase.

As far as the biting..

One of two things could be happening.

1-The dog is becoming dominant and challenging you.

2-Your pants or movements are triggering the dogs prey drive.

How you deal with each issue is very different.
 
#8 ·
I am not a fan of the ignore and it will eventually go away policy, the squirt bottles, or the exchanges. I use the lip curl and get rid of it right away. In fact, I do it on my pups when they are 5 weeks old and are biting me so maybe the people buying the pups don't have to see it. I don't think it is abnormal behavior or aggression, you don't need a psychologist because they bite their littermates but they have to learn that they can't bite humans. End of story, first lesson, get it over with and move on.
 
#18 ·
Ditto, and like Nancy, it starts in the whelping box. Lip pinch and "No bite." 0 tolerance if they bite human flesh even in play. They need to learn manners and I believe the earlier the better. It's part of early socialization. Most of my pups are not biting beyond 8 weeks and by 6 they already understand the no bite command.
 
#10 ·
As far as biting, I do the lip pinch and a sharp vocal noise. I raise alot of pups and it starts in the whelping box with the litter when they are old enough to start wrestling. They learn not to get mouthy with me, they continue to maul my husband however, because he rarely corrects a pup for anything, then whines about it when they bite him. I can sit on the floor with a litter and be fine. He tries it and comes out with bleeding scratches. Puppies are smart little sponges and figure out who is a leader to respect and who is a pushover to continue engaging with their teeth. Get the correction done and over with up front and move on, you've got better things to do with a puppy than mince around a mouthing issue. You don't have to be brutal, just firm and consistent. Trust me, pup will still adore you.
 
#11 ·
Packleader,

Isn't the "Packleader" in every essence of the word the provider for the pack. They PROVIDE a social structure that allows each memeber to know its role. They PROVIDE a set of rules that need to be followed other wise there will be consequences. They generally help PROVIDE food for the pack.

Why would you couple being the pack leader with bullying?
My dogs seek out my affection and can't stand to be away from me for more than a minute that would not be the case if I was the "bully".

And what age do you except the pack leader mentality and why?

I may be way off course here and I would love to here other peoples retorts to this becasue I value other people takes on every issue.
 
#13 ·
Because food aggression and other things are caused by taking things away all the time.

I had a friend who did the lip curl at the same age. Then at ten months he was wondering why the dog would not come back to him with the bird without CC.

If the biting is dominance I would put a short tab leash on him and make him wear it around the house and correct when needed. If it's prey drive I would redirect it.
 
#15 ·
Oh please. Blame one 10 month old dog not returning with a bird on a lip curl as a pup? Food aggression? Biiiiig stretch there. I'm sure it had NOTHING to do with the owner of the dog, nor the fact that many dogs just stop returning to hand at some point, thus we TRAIN. I can post about 20 retrievers to your 1 example, just that I've raised my way and that continue to deliver bumpers, toys and anything else I throw back to me, before ever going through FF/CC, nor have I ever had a pup I raised be food aggressive or any other aggressive with me taking something from him.
 
#14 ·
I had a friend who did the lip curl at the same age. Then at ten months he was wondering why the dog would not come back to him with the bird without CC.
OH please. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
If you are calling puppy biting dominance or prey drive you are just marketing to the ignorant and looking for customers.
 
#17 ·
Watch a litter of puppies play. It's that simple. They aren't all aggressive but they may have prey drive, but that isn't something you want to correct but encourage.

I am not going to even respond anymore because it's futile.

What happened to all the hunt tests you were going to run last year with your just watch me get the titles? You'll be gone when the weather is warm.
 
#21 ·
I thank you for sharing that with everyone but I do not have any questions about puppy biting. I simply was sharing my opinion with the OP.

After listening to that clip I agree completely with the first part of the clip but do not with the second half.

I have never corrected a puppy from biting to later have him not want to run 100 mph for anything I threw for him to retrieve. The lip technique as never so much as even made a puppy do a double take. I agree there is a bit of prey drive being established with the biting but every puppy I have ever worked with is capable of figuring out I don't want them to bite me but can be as nuts as they want when chasing a tennis ball by simple positive reinforcement.

But we can go in circles forever. I trully do appreciate the light you shed on a different technique and think everyone here is better for it.

Best wishes
 
#23 ·
Problem, I think: Threw her her first duck this morning. She retrieved and recalled nicely but absolutely refused to let it go. I could hear her crushing the birds skull. I had to pry her mouth open to take the duck, and it took a tremendous amount of force to do so. I have done a search on this topic, but found most of the advice was relating to hard mouth in older dogs or pups that lie down at the bird to chew. Piper recalls nicely, but refuses to drop the bird. This was also the first time I've heard any glimmer of agression from her. As I reached for the bird (right hand on the nap of her neck) she growled. Would appreciate your advice.
You think this might be related to what I was talking about?
 
#24 ·
No, they are not at all related. People, especially newbies, should be warned to think about the goals & experience of certain posters, what they have done as far as retriever training vs other venues, before they take their training advice for their retriever puppies. It is totally not abnormal for a retriever puppy to crunch a bird, get overly excited about a bird, not return a bird to hand, growl at a bird, etc. Puppies are puppies and react to birds in all kinds of ways. NONE of these are remotely related to teaching a puppy not to bite.
 
#25 ·
There is an incredible amount of negative controversy on Ed Frawley's techniques and ideas on dominance and pack dynamics out there. I would suggest anyone google his name and look into his methods before blindly following his videos.
 
#26 ·
Bottom line, not all retriever pups are the same, some are softer than others and don't need much, if any, teaching to not be mouthy, others are more persistent. People need to decide their own comfort level and choose the method that works best for them. If they prefer not to pinch a pup's lips to its teeth, and certainly they don't all need this method, or use the ignore method or squeal or whatever, that's fine. What they don't need is to be told by someone who doesn't raise or train retrievers for field venues that performing a lip pinch or curl is going to ruin their puppy. We're not twisting their snouts off or beating them or making them bleed or screaming at them, but when a pup is persistent, many of us have found the lip pinch effective, simple, fast and by gosh, we've got the dogs to back up our claims.
 
#27 ·
Wow, we sure do go 'round and 'round in circles here sometimes. I have tried the lip curl on Chief, he just lets go and as soon as I move back, he bites again. Finally I said enough, and when he did it, held his mouth, popped his butt with my hand and said "no". Guess what, it works. And we are still great buddies. I love puppies, but lord they do wear you out:D
 
#28 ·
I never said you would ruin the dog. I just think that getting down to their level and fighting with them over a toy is not always the best option. Many behaviorists agree.

Preventing possessive behavior is much easier than correcting it, so the most important part is to set clear rules for the dog before any issues come up.
 
#29 ·
Why would you ever have to fight a puppy over a toy. If I want to take something out of a dogs mouth it is one smooth fluid motion where I open the dogs mouth and roll the object towards me and out of the mouth. Takes maybe 1.5 seconds. I feel if you don't do this in a precise and quick move then it becomes a tug of war and a persons timid repsonse will only be met with a puppys increasing frustration. Which quickly can turn into aggression.

I have never encountered a puppy that when faced with this technique was unable to cope and or showed any aggression.
 
#31 ·
I have never had a puppy that I could not get their mouth open.

Now if you are talking an adult dog then we aren't comparing apples to apples. That convo would be an entire new thread about how I would approach that.

My previous comment is based on the OP about puppy biting.
 
#32 ·
Let me also add that I start teaching hold with my fingers as soon as the fur ball gets to me at 8 weeks. I place my fingers in their mouth across their bottom jaw and insist they hold it gently and quietly. Usually by 12 weeks I have a puppy that is holding my fingers without aviodance and will sit for over a minute while instilling the hold command and give command. Makes things very clear from that point forward and usually gives you a leg up going into FF when the pup is ready.
 
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