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Thread: Transparency??

  1. #1
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
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    Default Transparency??

    Obama Signed Secret Libya Order Authorizing Support For Rebels
    First Posted: 03/30/11 04:21 PM ET Updated: 03/30/11 04:35 PM ET

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Barack Obama has signed a secret order authorizing covert U.S. government support for rebel forces seeking to oust Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi, government officials told Reuters on Wednesday.

    (SCROLL DOWN FOR LIVE UPDATES)

    Obama signed the order, known as a presidential "finding", within the last two or three weeks, according to four U.S. government sources familiar with the matter.

    Such findings are a principal form of presidential directive used to authorize secret operations by the Central Intelligence Agency. The CIA and the White House declined immediate comment.

    News that Obama had given the authorization surfaced as the President and other U.S. and allied officials spoke openly about the possibility of sending arms supplies to Gaddafi's opponents, who are fighting better-equipped government forces.

    The United States is part of a coalition, with NATO members and some Arab states, which is conducting air strikes on Libyan government forces under a U.N. mandate aimed at protecting civilians opposing Gaddafi.

    In interviews with American TV networks on Tuesday, Obama said the objective was for Gaddafi to "ultimately step down" from power. He spoke of applying "steady pressure, not only militarily but also through these other means" to force Gaddafi out.

    Obama said the U.S. had not ruled out providing military hardware to rebels. "It's fair to say that if we wanted to get weapons into Libya, we probably could. We're looking at all our options at this point," the President told ABC News anchor Diane Sawyer.

    U.S. officials monitoring events in Libya say that at present, neither Gaddafi's forces nor the rebels, who have asked the West for heavy weapons, appear able to make decisive gains.

    While U.S. and allied airstrikes have seriously damaged Gaddafi's military forces and disrupted his chain of command, officials say, rebel forces remain disorganized and unable to take full advantage of western military support.

    SPECIFIC OPERATIONS

    People familiar with U.S. intelligence procedures said that Presidential covert action "findings" are normally crafted to provide broad authorization for a range of potential U.S. government actions to support a particular covert objective.

    In order for specific operations to be carried out under the provisions of such a broad authorization -- for example the delivery of cash or weapons to anti-Gaddafi forces -- the White House also would have to give additional "permission" allowing such activities to proceed.

    Former officials say these follow-up authorizations are known in the intelligence world as "'Mother may I' findings."

    In 2009 Obama gave a similar authorization for the expansion of covert U.S. counter-terrorism actions by the CIA in Yemen. The White House does not normally confirm such orders have been issued.

    Because U.S. and allied intelligence agencies still have many questions about the identities and leadership of anti-Gaddafi forces, any covert U.S. activities are likely to proceed cautiously until more information about the rebels can be collected and analyzed, officials said.

    "The whole issue on (providing rebels with) training and equipment requires knowing who the rebels are," said Bruce Riedel, a former senior CIA Middle East expert who has advised the Obama White House.

    Riedel said that helping the rebels to organize themselves and training them how use weapons effectively would be more urgent then shipping them arms.

    According to an article speculating on possible U.S. covert actions in Libya published early in March on the website of the Voice of America, the U.S. government's broadcasting service, a covert action is "any U.S. government effort to change the economic, military, or political situation overseas in a hidden way."ARMS SUPPLIES

    The article, by VOA intelligence correspondent Gary Thomas, said covert action "can encompass many things, including propaganda, covert funding, electoral manipulation, arming and training insurgents, and even encouraging a coup."

    U.S. officials also have said that Saudi Arabia and Qatar, whose leaders despise Gaddafi, have indicated a willingness to supply Libyan rebels with weapons.

    Members of Congress have expressed anxiety about U.S. government activates in Libya. Some have recalled that weapons provided by the U.S. and Saudis to mujahedeen fighting Soviet occupation forces in Afghanistan in the 1980s later ended up in the hands of anti-American militants.

    There are fears that the same thing could happen in Libya unless the U.S. is sure who it is dealing with. The chairman of the House intelligence committee, Rep. Mike Rogers, said on Wednesday he opposed supplying arms to the Libyan rebels fighting Gaddafi "at this time."

    "We need to understand more about the opposition before I would support passing out guns and advanced weapons to them," Rogers said in a statement.

    __________________________________________________ _______

    This may well be the most transparent US Government ever, don't you think???


    RK
    Stan b & Elvis

  2. #2
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
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    If it was supposed to be "covert", guess it isn't anymore?
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
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    Senior Member subroc's Avatar
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    So obama hasn't ruled out arming al qaeda, I mean the rebels.
    subroc

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    Article [II.]
    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

  4. #4
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    He is too "transparent"....

    http://www.politico.com/politico44/p...f3a51b959.html

    http://tinyurl.com/4bnd8lc

    "President Obama finally and quietly accepted his “transparency” award from the open government community this week — in a closed, undisclosed meeting at the White House on Monday.

    The secret presentation happened almost two weeks after the White House inexplicably postponed the ceremony, which was expected to be open to the press pool."

    -more-

  5. #5
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
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    LOL! If they gave blue ribbons for "potential" at field trials, think how many FCs and AFCs we would have!
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
    "Know in your heart that all things are possible. We couldn't conceive of a miracle if none ever happened." -Libby Fudim

    ​I don't use the PM feature, so just email me direct at the address shown above.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by road kill View Post
    Obama Signed Secret Libya Order Authorizing Support For Rebels
    First Posted: 03/30/11 04:21 PM ET Updated: 03/30/11 04:35 PM ET

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Barack Obama has signed a secret order authorizing covert U.S. government support for rebel forces seeking to oust Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi, government officials told Reuters on Wednesday.

    (SCROLL DOWN FOR LIVE UPDATES)

    Obama signed the order, known as a presidential "finding", within the last two or three weeks, according to four U.S. government sources familiar with the matter.

    Such findings are a principal form of presidential directive used to authorize secret operations by the Central Intelligence Agency. The CIA and the White House declined immediate comment.

    News that Obama had given the authorization surfaced as the President and other U.S. and allied officials spoke openly about the possibility of sending arms supplies to Gaddafi's opponents, who are fighting better-equipped government forces.

    The United States is part of a coalition, with NATO members and some Arab states, which is conducting air strikes on Libyan government forces under a U.N. mandate aimed at protecting civilians opposing Gaddafi.

    In interviews with American TV networks on Tuesday, Obama said the objective was for Gaddafi to "ultimately step down" from power. He spoke of applying "steady pressure, not only militarily but also through these other means" to force Gaddafi out.

    Obama said the U.S. had not ruled out providing military hardware to rebels. "It's fair to say that if we wanted to get weapons into Libya, we probably could. We're looking at all our options at this point," the President told ABC News anchor Diane Sawyer.

    U.S. officials monitoring events in Libya say that at present, neither Gaddafi's forces nor the rebels, who have asked the West for heavy weapons, appear able to make decisive gains.

    While U.S. and allied airstrikes have seriously damaged Gaddafi's military forces and disrupted his chain of command, officials say, rebel forces remain disorganized and unable to take full advantage of western military support.

    SPECIFIC OPERATIONS

    People familiar with U.S. intelligence procedures said that Presidential covert action "findings" are normally crafted to provide broad authorization for a range of potential U.S. government actions to support a particular covert objective.

    In order for specific operations to be carried out under the provisions of such a broad authorization -- for example the delivery of cash or weapons to anti-Gaddafi forces -- the White House also would have to give additional "permission" allowing such activities to proceed.

    Former officials say these follow-up authorizations are known in the intelligence world as "'Mother may I' findings."

    In 2009 Obama gave a similar authorization for the expansion of covert U.S. counter-terrorism actions by the CIA in Yemen. The White House does not normally confirm such orders have been issued.

    Because U.S. and allied intelligence agencies still have many questions about the identities and leadership of anti-Gaddafi forces, any covert U.S. activities are likely to proceed cautiously until more information about the rebels can be collected and analyzed, officials said.

    "The whole issue on (providing rebels with) training and equipment requires knowing who the rebels are," said Bruce Riedel, a former senior CIA Middle East expert who has advised the Obama White House.

    Riedel said that helping the rebels to organize themselves and training them how use weapons effectively would be more urgent then shipping them arms.

    According to an article speculating on possible U.S. covert actions in Libya published early in March on the website of the Voice of America, the U.S. government's broadcasting service, a covert action is "any U.S. government effort to change the economic, military, or political situation overseas in a hidden way."ARMS SUPPLIES

    The article, by VOA intelligence correspondent Gary Thomas, said covert action "can encompass many things, including propaganda, covert funding, electoral manipulation, arming and training insurgents, and even encouraging a coup."

    U.S. officials also have said that Saudi Arabia and Qatar, whose leaders despise Gaddafi, have indicated a willingness to supply Libyan rebels with weapons.

    Members of Congress have expressed anxiety about U.S. government activates in Libya. Some have recalled that weapons provided by the U.S. and Saudis to mujahedeen fighting Soviet occupation forces in Afghanistan in the 1980s later ended up in the hands of anti-American militants.

    There are fears that the same thing could happen in Libya unless the U.S. is sure who it is dealing with. The chairman of the House intelligence committee, Rep. Mike Rogers, said on Wednesday he opposed supplying arms to the Libyan rebels fighting Gaddafi "at this time."

    "We need to understand more about the opposition before I would support passing out guns and advanced weapons to them," Rogers said in a statement.

    __________________________________________________ _______

    This may well be the most transparent US Government ever, don't you think???


    RK
    It has a long way to go to catch up to the previous administration in the secret department. Anyone remember the number of times Bush43 claimed "Executive Privilege"???????????
    Last edited by Roger Perry; 03-30-2011 at 07:15 PM.

  7. #7
    Senior Member badbullgator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Perry View Post
    It has a long way to go to catch up to the previous administration in the secret department. Anyone remember the number of times Bush43 claimed "Executive Privilege"???????????

    And even if he has or does Rodger will never forget.........
    I still think he has a man crush on Bush
    Views and opinions expressed herein by Badbullgator do not necessarily represent the policies or position of RTF. RTF and all of it's subsidiaries can not be held liable for the off centered humor and politically incorrect comments of the author.
    Corey Burke

  8. #8
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Perry View Post
    It has a long way to go to catch up to the previous administration in the secret department. Anyone remember the number of times Bush43 claimed "Executive Privilege"???????????
    Does that make it OK then???


    HHhHHhhEEeeEEeeEESSssSssSstTttTTtTttAAaAaaAaarRrrR rrRrtTtTtTTtTTEEeEeeeeeeEEdDDdDdIIiIiiIiitTttTtt!! !!!!!

    RK
    Stan b & Elvis

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Perry View Post
    It has a long way to go to catch up to the previous administration in the secret department. Anyone remember the number of times Bush43 claimed "Executive Privilege"???????????
    I blamed my Mother for spanking me when I was a child but I got over it before the age of 67

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by caryalsobrook View Post
    I blamed my Mother for spanking me when I was a child but I got over it before the age of 67
    I am not seeing Obama claim executive privilege--------In the United States government, executive privilege is the power claimed by the President of the United States and other members of the executive branch to resist certain subpoenas and other interventions by the legislative and judicial branches of government.

    In other words, the President can break laws and then claim executive privilege to keep other branches of the government from going after the President who may have commited crimes or broke constitutional law which he took an oath to uphold.
    Last edited by Roger Perry; 03-30-2011 at 08:30 PM.

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