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Thread: Should The Debt Ceiling Be Raised ?

  1. #11
    Senior Member troy schwab's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franco View Post
    Actually, defaulting could be very strategic in us heading down a sound financial road.

    First, it would demonstrate that we are serious about the problem and realize spending more is not the answer. Second, there is till a lot of wasteful spending in the budget and would wforce cuts in many of the unneeded areas.

    By addressing the problem instead of hiding from it, we gain credibility.
    Franco may be on to something here.......with all of our outstanding debt and uncontrolled QE practices........the government will have to devalue the dollar.......its not a choice.....they have to. that would be one way to do it..........scary.
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  2. #12
    Senior Member dnf777's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by troy schwab View Post
    Franco may be on to something here.......with all of our outstanding debt and uncontrolled QE practices........the government will have to devalue the dollar.......its not a choice.....they have to. that would be one way to do it..........scary.
    Yes. Defaulting = Devaluing the dollar

    Ready for $1000 weekly grocery tabs? $900 fill-ups at the gas station?

    I'm not.

    I hope those are wildly extreme, alarmist, exaggerated numbers......but do we know what defaulting will really mean??
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  3. #13
    Senior Member luvmylabs23139's Avatar
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    Actually the federal gov't would not have to default on the debt. There is revenue coming in. It would be simple (not pleasant) to pay the debt obligations priority number one and simply stop spending anymore money.
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  4. #14
    Senior Member TxHillHunter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by luvmylabs23139 View Post
    Actually the federal gov't would not have to default on the debt. There is revenue coming in. It would be simple (not pleasant) to pay the debt obligations priority number one and simply stop spending anymore money.
    BINGO!! What do we generate....something like $2 trillion a year in tax receipts? Somehow I think that should cover the debt service on the debt.....but not while spending at the rate we currently do.

  5. #15
    Senior Member Franco's Avatar
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    If we defaulted and had a plan that was believeable to out creditors, we would escape any sort of inflation and faith would return to the value of the dollar.

    Just look at how stupid our current policy is. Here is an example; China buys our debt so we can afford to defend Taiwan against the Chinese. Tell me where that makes any sense? Our politicians will not get serious about the debt until the American people call them on the carpet. Where is the call for an Amendment for a balanced budget? Until we have one, politicians will continue to use tax dollars to buy votes!

    By defaulting, all their pet projects/earmarks/pork will go bye-bye! Out of control entitlements and other government waste will be curtailed. If they get away with raising the debt ceiling, like they did two years ago, they will look at raising it again in another two years. It just won't stop!
    “The end of democracy and the defeat of the American Revolution will occur when government falls into the hands of lending institutions and moneyed incorporations.” –Thomas Jefferson

  6. #16
    Senior Member Goose's Avatar
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    I just read where the Greek 2-year note is priced to yield 22% That's so cool! Of course it will never happen here. Right, Ben? Right, Timmy? Right, Barack?

    We live in Cuba now.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
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    It occurs to me ...

    We have these ostensibly really smart people running this whole show, right?

    Well, for a while now they've been watching unemployment (& underemployment) get worse, which means that they should anticipate lower income tax revenues, right?

    So, on top of that they give out a bunch of tax credits to buy new homes to people who are working & many of whom were going to buy those homes anyhow.

    So ... they spend a bunch of billions to bail out the mortgage mess because it would cause financial collapse. Then more billions to "stimulate" the economy, many of which billions only allow state & local govts to simply bridge their budget gaps & not look forward to what they will do the following year.

    Now, OMG! our debt ceiling is being reached! OMG! OMG! We just forgot to count up all those billions we were borrowing/spending. The sky will fall unless you let us borrow more!

    These economic geniuses, can they not do basic arithmetic? Our successful educational system at work?

    So, if we let them borrow more, what are they going to do about next year? Will their arithmetic skills fail again?

    Seems like they're going to argue about picking pepper out of flysheet ... massive debate over $38 billion that works out to far less. Meanwhile telling us to get used to paying $4/gallon for gasoline.

    And we think these fellas are so bright we should let them run our govt and economy?
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  8. #18
    Senior Member TxHillHunter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerry Clinchy View Post
    It occurs to me ...

    We have these ostensibly really smart people running this whole show, right?

    Well, for a while now they've been watching unemployment (& underemployment) get worse, which means that they should anticipate lower income tax revenues, right?

    So, on top of that they give out a bunch of tax credits to buy new homes to people who are working & many of whom were going to buy those homes anyhow.

    So ... they spend a bunch of billions to bail out the mortgage mess because it would cause financial collapse. Then more billions to "stimulate" the economy, many of which billions only allow state & local govts to simply bridge their budget gaps & not look forward to what they will do the following year.

    Now, OMG! our debt ceiling is being reached! OMG! OMG! We just forgot to count up all those billions we were borrowing/spending. The sky will fall unless you let us borrow more!

    These economic geniuses, can they not do basic arithmetic? Our successful educational system at work?

    So, if we let them borrow more, what are they going to do about next year? Will their arithmetic skills fail again?

    Seems like they're going to argue about picking pepper out of flysheet ... massive debate over $38 billion that works out to far less. Meanwhile telling us to get used to paying $4/gallon for gasoline.

    And we think these fellas are so bright we should let them run our govt and economy?
    Almost like they failed arithmetic, huh. Not sure who up there thinks we can borrow our way out of debt?!

  9. #19
    Senior Member cotts135's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franco View Post
    I say, NO!

    The politicians are trying to scare the American people by saying we would default on our credit.

    Yet, there is much waste in the new budget. Both parties are being irresponsible because both are protecting thier pet projects, earmarks/pork. The only difference between the two is their social agenda. Both represent big government.

    Ryan's budget proposal is nothing more than a bandaide on a severed artery. Rand Paul's buget proposal which addresses the real issues of the deficit is not even being taken seriously in DC.

    I see it as a complete failure of our Federal Government!
    I am with you on this one. Eventually hard choices will have to be made, doing it now will hurt far less than if we keep postponing it to the future. The problem is that this will never happen. If the dire consequences that are predicted to come true actually materialize(Which I doubt. Sounds a lot like the bailout crisis we heard just a few years ago ). this will almost surely make most of these guys unelectable come voting time. They will not act against their own best interests.

  10. #20
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cotts135 View Post
    I am with you on this one. Eventually hard choices will have to be made, doing it now will hurt far less than if we keep postponing it to the future. The problem is that this will never happen. If the dire consequences that are predicted to come true actually materialize(Which I doubt. Sounds a lot like the bailout crisis we heard just a few years ago ). this will almost surely make most of these guys unelectable come voting time. They will not act against their own best interests.
    If we do it now, we have some choices, the longer we wait the less choices we will have until we have NO CHOICE!!

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