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Thread: Success without swim-by

  1. #1
    Senior Member Matt Weberpal's Avatar
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    Default Success without swim-by

    Now that I've been through swim-by, I'm wondering can you have success in hunt tests with a dog who has not gone through swim-by?

    If the return is not judged and your dog will handle in the water to a blind, why teach swim-by?

    I guess I'm just trying to greater understand swim-by.
    Matt Weberpal


    Candlewood's Just In Case JH

  2. #2
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    Sure you don't have to do swim-by. You don't have to force fetch or collar condition either. You never even have to look at a program and you can still train your dog successfully. Years ago I had a neighbor train his female to a SH and he never cracked a book on how to do it.

    Swim-by introduces staying in the water in a drill format when doing a directional retrieve. Dogs are not very watery. They want to go as fast as they can when retrieving and water only slows them down. It's a factor they need to learn how to navigate successfully. Swim-by is just the start.

    You have to start somewhere and swim-by gives you the basic tools.

    Angie

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    Yes you can. My first three MH titled dogs (one QAA) never went through swim-by.

    WRL

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    Senior Member T. Mac's Avatar
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    Possible, but how do you then do cheating singles?

    Everything in retriever training builds on the steps before it. To avoid any one step leads to a big foundation hole that will rear its ugly head at some point in future training.

    T. Mac

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    Senior Member Matt Weberpal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by T. Mac View Post
    Possible, but how do you then do cheating singles?

    Everything in retriever training builds on the steps before it. To avoid any one step leads to a big foundation hole that will rear its ugly head at some point in future training.

    T. Mac
    I know it's all for a greater purpose,but...You could just do water T so your dog will handle in the water and whistle sit him if he begins to cheat, then cast to the mark. He doesn't need to be able to handle with a bumper in his mouth at that point.
    Matt Weberpal


    Candlewood's Just In Case JH

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    Senior Member helencalif's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by T. Mac View Post

    Everything in retriever training builds on the steps before it. To avoid any one step leads to a big foundation hole that will rear its ugly head at some point in future training.

    T. Mac
    You have nailed it, T.Mac. Those who cut corners on the basics will regret it as there will be holes. All of the excuses will not fill up those holes.

    Helen

  7. #7
    Senior Member Matt Weberpal's Avatar
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    I understand, like I said I've done swim-by but was just wondering if others have skipped that step and whether or not they were successful in hunt tests.
    Matt Weberpal


    Candlewood's Just In Case JH

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    Senior Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by weberpal78 View Post
    If the return is not judged and your dog will handle in the water to a blind, why teach swim-by?
    Apples, meet oranges. Do you think swim-by is a skill set designed purely to handle on return? In tests?
    Quote Originally Posted by weberpal78 View Post
    I guess I'm just trying to greater understand swim-by.
    Do you recognize yet what the benefits are of doing it? Is there a real specific question you have about swim-by?

    Evan
    "Prepare your dog in such a manner that the work he is normally called upon to do under-whelms him, not overwhelms him." ~ Evan Graham

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    Yes you can have success without it but having that tool in your tool box can make transition and advanced training easier on you and your dog. The 10-14 days you spend on it can save you alot of headaches in the long run.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    Apples, meet oranges. Do you think swim-by is a skill set designed purely to handle on return? In tests?Do you recognize yet what the benefits are of doing it? Is there a real specific question you have about swim-by?

    Evan
    So, you are saying that swim-by is the ONLY drill that can/will accomplish these skills?

    NONE of the first three MHs I trained (one ended up QAA) were cheaters nor "lacked" from not doing swim-by.

    It is ONE DRILL that covers a "skill set" that you can teach with a few other drills. All three of those dogs were decheated before they could even handle.

    WRL

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